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spatlind
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I'm weighing up a decision between a set of RNT2 Foxy 2.5s, Phoenix 2s and Sisti Copper working cups. From what I can see, apart from aesthetic differences, the Sisti set takes a larger load than the other two and the Phoenix 2s accomodate larger balls on the saddle. Anybody have any recommendations for me from your own experience? Cheers
Scott

(I know, it's not about the cups, it's about me - but leaving that aside Smile )
Actions lie louder than words - Carolyn Wells

I believe in God, only I spell it Nature - Frank Lloyd Wright.
Keith Mitchell
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I have both RNT's SBL Working Pro cups and Mendoza cups, the Mendoza cups has more attic space. Three 1" balls fits great inside the Mendoza cups. The saddles on both these cups work great for three 1" balls.

Hope that helps Smile
pabloinus
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I don't have any of these cups, I do have a Foxy II (smaller) and the design of the cups is fantastic, can really fool your eye when you see the final load that these cups can hold. The Foxy 2.5 has the same advantage, they look small and can get a Tennis ball.The nicest of the three.
Sisti's shape is similar to PF, similar to monti, similar to Bazar (my view only, please) so they are not unique, the Phoenix is a variation of the original one, and while maybe better it is not the original one (you can still get the original from Frank and on ebay)
Another option on the same price range is the Mendoza combo (you get a chop in case you want to use it) or non combo.Epiphany is selling one set on satin finish on For sale section

My personal view is that the size of the load is not absolute rather relative to the size of the cup, so a Tennis ball in some cases looks larger than a baseball coming from a larger cup

Let us know which one you decide.
Tom Fenton
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Scott,

The Sisti Cups take the smallest final load.
Both the Foxy 2.5's and the Phoenix II's take tennis balls while the biggest load a Sisti will hold is a lacrosse ball.

I have a set of Sisti cups and a set of Phoenix II's.
I prefer the Phoenix II's, no real reason, I just like the shape of them.

It all depends on what you want to do.
The Foxy 2.5's will make the tennis ball look bigger when it is placed on top of the cup, the Phoenix II's, being bigger, will be more visible from a distance and the Sisti cups will take up less space due to their size and the size of the loads.

Do you know anyone who owns these cups?
If you do, maybe they'd let you have a play with them so that you can 'try before you buy'.

Best of luck with whatever set you get.
"But there isn't a door"
spatlind
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Tom, my bad. Of course the Sisti load is the lacrosse ball. Unfortunately, the closest thing anyone has to a "cup" where I am is an aluminium container for making ice! (So I should probably be just using those Smile ) So won't get to test drive any of these.

Madkiki and pabloinus, I have a set of aluminium Mendoza's on the way. I also have a set of Bazar cups, so for sake of variety, maybe I'll look more closely at the Foxy and Phoenix sets.

Thanks guys, keep em coming!
Scott
Actions lie louder than words - Carolyn Wells

I believe in God, only I spell it Nature - Frank Lloyd Wright.
Keith Mitchell
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I have a set of Foxy 2's Aluminum cups and they will fit a tennis ball, but the saddle is on the flat side. The saddle for the Mendoza and SBL working pros has more of a deep dimple.

Also, have Monti Aluminum these will not take a tennis ball, but will work with 2 1/4 balls.

Wish I could afford the Princess cups or the Foxy 2's copper, but I am broke Smile

Have Fun Folks Smile Smile Smile
Bill Palmer
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The Foxy 2's will not take a tennis balls. The Foxy II.V's take a tennis ball.
"The Swatter"

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walid ahumada
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I would choose the most beautiful shape for my eye, get a picture of each set side by side and pick a cup, any cup that you like...
“Magic becomes art when it has nothing to hide.” BEN OKRI quote
Etienne M.
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I prefer the foxy II.V. I like the shape of the cup better than the others.

Floyd
"Imagination is more important than knowledge"

-- Albert Einstein
M for Magic
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I like the Foxy 2.5. I have an Aluminum set and they have to be the smallest cups possible that will still easily fit a tennis ball. It looks absolutely impossible for the tennis ball to have come from the cup when you display it on top. Also it seems impossible to be able to nest them with 1" balls in the saddle. They are very deceptive and handle well.
Just my 2cents (CND. so actually 1.6 cents USD)
Pete Biro
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IMHO final load size doesn't matter. I would pick the cups the looks and feels right to you. What one person likes the next doesn't.
STAY TOONED... @ www.pete-biro.com
JamesTong
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I agree with you, Pete. Beauty lies in the eye of the beholder.
kentfgunn
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I'm with uncle Pete on this. I've never understood "the tennis ball standard" for cups. I think having the largest possible load syndrome. The only people I know that ever focus so much on, "it looks like that ball is too big to have come out of that cup are the guys selling. Quit sweating the marketing drivel and GO ACTUALLY Practice with the stuff you have right now!
M for Magic
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I think in the case of the Foxy 2.5 cups, the final load definitely does have bearing. Reason being the optical illusion of the larger load, in this case a tennis ball, looking much too large to have fit in the cup it just came out of. This can be done with a smaller cup and final load, but when the final load is something that is a common item (like a tennis ball or baseball) that people are used too, know is solid and have a relative idea of it's size, it gives a little more impact. This has nothing to do with marketing, just personal preference and what you feel or find plays well.
That being said, I do prefer my RNT2 PF cups better. They fit my hand better and the final load I use is fake fruit, who's size I find easier to manage. And I think the fruit is more surprising. But the PF cups were not one of the 3 original inquired about by the OP.
There are no absolutes, just opinions and preferences.
Trial and error and all that.
Chessmann
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I have to disagree with those who say that a large load that seems to be too big for the doesn't matter terribly.

I distinclty remember my own eyes popping out more at routines with large loads that appeared from cups, and then being placed on top of the cups. There was a certain way that the cups were removed from the balls that added to it a little to the illusion.

Neither is bad. Both are fine. But the larger load certainly did create extra magic for me.

But everyone's mileage will vary on things like this, I suppose.
My ex-cat was named "Muffin". "Vomit" would be a better name for her. AKA "The Evil Ball of Fur".
Epiphany
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Load size is a prime number in the equation of of how big your saddle will be on a cup and wether you will be able to do a 3 ball stack with the cups. Cups are designed from the inside out. There are many aspect of the final load that affect the entire design of a cup.

It's not marketing drivel, it's engineering drivel and customer input on ball sizes and what they wanted to be able to use and do with the cups. If you were to follow Mr. Gunn's drivel everyone would still be using Paul Fox size cups today.

Epiphany
Pete Biro
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Look, here's another thing to consider regarding tennis balls, baseballs, etc.

How to you load and palm them? If you use a pouch, maybe OK if you can misdirect well. Most guys I see can't.

And how much do you FUMBLE to get a big load out of your pocket?

I won't repeat it here, but Ken Brooke showed Ricky Jay and I how you can get an incredible reaction even with small lemons.

It's not the size, but the CHANGE he taught.
STAY TOONED... @ www.pete-biro.com
M for Magic
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Hey!
You sold me my Paul Fox cups Smile
Epiphany
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Mr. Biro,

absolutely correct. But given the needs of performers that need to stack (3) 1 1/8 balls on the saddle for a routine a common demoninator has to be used. Why a tennis ball? Simply put, it's available. A tennis ball size load was a common request obviously given Porper cups and so on, or even bigger given Gazzo size cups. Base the cup shape/design on a baseball and you would end up with a street size cup, ie Gazzo or even your Gali cups.

My contentions here are that the cups load is not marketing drivel but an engineering issue to give performers the specs that they need in a cup. Because a cup holds a tennis ball does not mean a tennis ball is all that can be used, you can load a lemon, lime etc.

Epiphany
Dave V
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Quote:
On 2009-01-29 17:06, Epiphany wrote:
My contentions here are that the cups load is not marketing drivel but an engineering issue to give performers the specs that they need in a cup.

Precisely. It's hard to visualize load capacity from pictures or numbers alone. It's easier for buyers to relate to "baseball size" or "tennis ball size" or even "golf ball size." This also gives us a ready supply of practice loads that won't rot or spoil.
No trees were killed in the making of this message, but a large number of electrons were terribly inconvenienced.
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