I think you have a faulty disc, check this thread:
http://www.themagiccafe.com/forums/viewt......m=111&42

Yes sound like a bad DVD. Whoever sold you the set should send you replacements. I had 2 bad DVDs replaced.


OK guy, which effect on this set do you think is skill wises the hardest to preform? What about the easiest?

The hardest is Cheng's Riser The easiest... Weirdling? There's practically no handling involved with the Weirdling.

Contacting the dealer you bought it from is the best way to handle it.

Found the twilght angels red replacemts!
http://www.world-of-magic.co.uk/10_Refil......3945.asp

Greetings to all...
A few thoughts concerning the recent posts regarding the availablity and pricing of the refills for Twilight Angels, and the notion of having your own printed up.
First of all, in a phone conversation with Paul yesterday (3-27-09) he told me that the USPCC has agreed to print more gaffs...so these will be available in red as well as blue, and I know Paul has no intention of gouging anyone price-wise. People need to remember that manufacturers, jobbers, and dealers all add a percentage in order to stay in business. You might go around the latter two by having a printer make them up for you...BUT...you should consider a couple of things (as Chris and Tim said earlier)...

1. To produce an item that is marketed by its inventor without specific permission to do so is flatly unethical. It is, in fact, piracy, and in the long run it only discourages creative people from sharing or marketing their work. So you shoot yourself in the foot, and create problems for others in the process. Obviously, if you also sell the item, it is outright thievery...but even if only for your own use, it is the wrong tactic. If the gaff is no longer made, then you should get permission to produce it...perhaps even work out a deal with the inventor to handle the production. If the item is still being marketed, but you feel it is over-priced...simply do not buy it. If all feel the price is too high, it will not move off of the shelves, and that will drive the price down to a reasonable level.

2. If you decide to ignore the ethical issue and print up a batch...be prepared to have both the inventor (and in this case the USPCC) come after you legally for copyright infringement...and tell the printer who does the job for you to expect a call from the USPCC's lawyers as well.

Not for one second, by the way, do I believe that there is any malice in what was suggested by anyone in any post. I am sure it is just a concern that gaffs may become unavailable or unreasonable at some point, making it difficult or impossible to perform an effect which, of course, you invested in when you purchased the TA set. I see that as a perfectly understandable concern. So having said that...let me add these thoughts...

If you use a red deck and therefore want red Twilight Angel refills...I think you may be over concerned. The refills WILL be available..but suppose that you could only get the blue? ..what is the most creative response? Anger? Suppose you turn this "problem" into an asset? Suppose you contrive to turn a selected card from red to blue (perhaps Frank Garcia's Chicago Opener would do) and then cap off the color change with the Twilight Angels effect and give the card away. It becomes doubly magical...and frankly easier to keep track of your gaffs.
Alternatively...suppose that the gaffs became unavailable entirely? Does that mean the EFFECT is lost to you? Remember that this effect evolved from Paul's effect 'Twilight' in the first place...and it can evolve again. Yes, Paul has handed you an effect that is thought out and effective...so don't just learn and perform it...IMPROVE IT! Let it evolve to become your own. If you can not get playing cards...then ask yourself..."what else can I use?" There is no ethical or legal hassle involved in having your printer print an original piece...like a business card...coffee card...ticket...and number of items that will make YOUR presentation unique to yourself and may even put your info into your audience's hands in a memorable way. You will get far more from TA and magic in general if you tune into the principles and possibilities of an effect like this, and worry less about how you will continue doing it exactly the same way for the rest of your career. Do not cling to the coat-tails of those who have come before you, but rather stand on their shoulders. Paradigms are shifted by people who approach problems with this attitude. Best to spend less energy saying 'Who is going to feed me?' and more energy learning to grow some food.

Personally, I'd love to see some posts from people who have some creative ideas on what ELSE you can do with the Twilight Angels idea. (ie. the notion of a reflection manifesting itself as a reality)
Also, it occurs to me that this post could read as an admonishment of sorts...it is not meant that way at all friends, but is intended to be informative, helpful (I hope) and as an encouragement to your personal creativity.

Regards, Patrick Snowden

Posted: Mar 28, 2009 5:20pm
Oh yes...nearly forgot...
Activity in the TA Forums has slowed considerably. People are, no doubt, out in the world trying out new material. The "live" forum with Paul will likely (according to Paul) be in April (MAYBE the 12th he said) ...but Jason will be heading that up so it is his baby. (Jason, heard you were under the weather...hope you're doing well)
In any case, Paul saw a post I had placed in the TA Forums and ask me to repost it here in the Café. It concerns an idea for "Ripped and Fryed" which is among the most popular effects in the set.
My post came on the heels of a discussion about the notion of restoring the second card as a follow-up to the first restoration (an idea I discourage) , but the part that Paul was most interested in posting has to do with the finish.
I am skipping parts of my original post that have to do with a subtlety of handling, and cutting to the notes on finishing the effect...

"This effect is over when that torn card is restored...that is the moment of astonishment...and it is the LAST thing you want to dilute.

...here is my notion regarding the finish of this piece...I talked to Paul on the phone about this a couple of days ago, and he thought it was the best way to go...

There is a moment at the end, as Wayne is about to do his (BEAUTIFUL) touch restoration...when he is holding a piece of the (covered) torn card in each hand...a VERY strong image..let it burn...

He brings them together and finishes as you see on the disk...it IS great. But...
At this moment, I like to ask the spectator (whose hand I asked for earlier) to PINCH the piece in my left hand firmly between thumb and index finger. Using Charlie's "Sawing a Lady" notion...I say.."take her by the toe...and DON'T let go"
Now I point out that he/she(the spectator)has the "feet" (by the toes) ...and "I have the head ...over here". I bring the pieces together and unfold as Wayne does (the move at least ...but without blowing) then I lift the left covering piece straight up and place it in my right fingers so that it covers the gaff. "Pull" I say...and the spectator FEELS the restoration even as they take the entire piece (and all the heat) with them. The two pieces in the other hand are now flat and pinched between thumb and finger as I put them away. ALL attention is on that restored card.

Why is this stronger?
Well...you have done two things that make it so...

1. You have added another sense to the effect....that of touch...so the effect is not only seen, but felt.

2. You have pointed out the seeming impossiblity of the restoration...as they clearly see the parts widely separated, and NEVER let go of their half!
I take nothing away from the pure visual beauty of this effect...it is a killer. But I think this last bit really makes a miracle of it.
Try it and see if it works for your style.

Have fun, Patrick"

Thank you Patrick

You are a scholar and a gentleman, wise beyond your years and a positive role model for every single one of us.

Every time you make a post, I am better for having read it.

I can say with complete sincerity that I am not worthy, but I am forever grateful.

Thanks again for your wisdom and kindness.

Jay

Doodah: I thought I moved on, but thank you for your post. Everything you said crossed my mind, and I was just trying to come up with alternatives. I'm not going to bother to make these, not worth it. Doubling the price by the makers just seems like gouging to me. But they can sell them for whatever they want, I just don't have to buy them.
Like I said, I've moved on...
My biggest problem now is not being able to repeat it.
I did an adult birthday party for a very good client. It was in a small neighborhood upscale bar and restuaraunt. The way I work, she gets me 2 hours, and I approach each "couple" or small group and do my routine over and over during the course of the night. (With a DJ playing music, and I do everything standing up with no tables.)
I was going to do Twilight Angels just for her, but I ended up leaving it at home by accident when I opened a new pack of cards to bring. I did another powerfull effect, Mason's Shoe'T for the first time. Had the card signed, and did it about 20 times. Worked great every time. And I could repeat it. I wish I could have had the Twilight angels in 52 different cards. Then I could repeat it each time and leave the card. And after, everyone would not wonder why I had 20-2H's in my deck!( Note: I pretty well don't have the same person see the same effect twice in a night unless they follow me around or drag me to show it to another guest:
I'm worried after I leave or during the night, and all these people know each other, and are starting to know me from all the shows I do for them, so next time I see them, they would ask me why it was always the 2H. They only see one deck on me at a time.)
And techincally it would have cost me $20 to perform 20 times. With the economy like it is, this is a good chunk of money. So at this point, not much I can do.

It was fun and stimulating conversation, though, lol.

And I will think about your idea of using something else to accomplish the same effect. What if I get custom Business card Playing cards with my logo? I've been wanting to get some for years, just never did. I could get them with MY logo, and contact info, and that would be a good reason to give them away.
I'll have to maybe make my face jump next to itself, or something like that.

My goal now is to find effects from TA that will work in the type of situations I perform in:
No tables, can do 20-50 times a night with cost effective refills or no refills. With music and conversations going on around you. So it is hard to do story telling effects.

I already have many solid fool proof effects that work in this situation.
I just like the challenge of finding more good magic that will work like this.

And give my regulars something new to see.

The last performance for them was last Christmas at her house, had those high ceilings, so I did card on ceiling.
This club had ceilings only about 7-8 feet tall. So I said instead of the signed card going up, it would go down, and it was in my shoe.

I did use principles of theory I learned from the TA set when I did this show.
I tried to relax and let the moment of astonishment sink in.

I'm very happy with my purchase of TA. It's just a very different type of magic than I perform. I Never stand behind a table or sit to perform. I don't do one big show, but walk around. I don't go up to strangers on a beach or anywhere and just perform. It is all hired gigs in party rooms or halls with a band. I do already have several story effects, but most of them can't be done with loud music playing. I have to be brief and to the point, and let the magic sink in.

Thanks again for your post. You are indeed one of the Great Ones.

ACE

And this subject is closed. I think Patrick has made this clear for everybody. Sorry if I contributed in a negative way.

Ace...
You said:
<blockquote>
"I will think about your idea of using something else to accomplish the same effect. What if I get custom Business card Playing cards with my logo? I've been wanting to get some for years, just never did. I could get them with MY logo, and contact info, and that would be a good reason to give them away.
I'll have to maybe make my face jump next to itself, or something like that."</blockquote>

I think this is a brilliant idea. It preserves the potential for the effect, solves the problem of availablity, explains why all the cards are the same at the evening's end..and personalizes the effect.

I have done a lot of performing under the circumstances you describe...no working surfaces...can't be heard (not only presentational 'stories', but simple instructions)...surrounded...repeat viewers etc. It is a tribute to your ability to pull it off..very tough conditions. So yes, a lot of picking and choosing of appropriate effects. What a fun challenge!

Patrick

I'm not sure that customized playing cards are the way to go with Twilight Angels, for the same reason why you shouldn't perform The Weirdling with your business cards. They will simply suspect that you printed them the way they end up after the effect. I'm not saying it won't work, I'm just guessing it might not be very effective.

The TA set has brought to me just what I had hoped for: I'm on a journey.

It's not a DVD set of tricks or handling of tricks, but effects that have emotional impact on people you perform for.

I think folks will be absorbing the impact of the set for years to come.

Well said Christopher, I agree. Its quite an amazing journey

.

I am wondering what the interest would be to having a full deck (all different cards), Red Back Bicycle Twilight Angel cards. If the demand is there we (Paul) can examine a print run. My guess is a deck would cost about $25 (not 100% sure). That allows one to do it 56 times with various cards (jokers and all regular cards). Please let me know so we can get an idea of the interest.

Tim

I'd bite for a few decks.

I'd be in for a few as well.

Yes.

Definitely! It'd be great to have a whole deck of these. You could have the full deck, but replace the top card with a regular card and then a DB on top of that. Have them select a card from the face up spread, take it out, place it face up on the face down deck, turn the card over to mention the angels on the back, deal it on the table face up so they can sign it. As they sign it you put the deck away and perform Twilight Angels. You're good to keep doing that throughout the entire night with different cards and no reset.

I'd pick up a Twilight Angels deck.