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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » You are getting sleepy...very sleepy... » » The Hypnotism Act .UK (0 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

bobser
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I've read the hypno act (circa 1950's) and the 1996 revised copy (UK) but I'm still unsure if you really really neeeeed a licence to do a hypno show. Sure I know you don't privately but I'm wondering if you really even need to bother publicly. It's very ambiguous and I'm not sure if THEY know exactly what they're saying.
After reading it I've no idea why someone would deem it necessary to go out and spend a grand on the insurance. A friend suggested to me today that with the proper wording in the pre-talk and closure (all filmed of course during the show) you probably more than cover yourself. After reading through the act I'd have to agree.
Does anyone have any comments or opinions on this?
If necessary pm me and I'll email you The Act.

bobser
Bob Burns is the creator of The Swan.
Photo-Wizard
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For fear of being attacked the best way to answer your question Bobser is with several answers as follows:


You should be aware that due to the licensing act 2006 things have changed a little as this is itself an Act of Parliment which makes mention of a seperate special license/permission being needed for stage hypnosis shows in licensed premises and this legally to the letter of the law applies even for private parties.

If your hiring the venue yourself and get your own Personal Alchohol License then there are some loopholes (legal ones as always) around that as well.

Insurance cover can be got for far less than a grand from Equity and also as a FESH member and also independently from various companies if you search around enough (as many of us have had to in recent years)

To get a license/permission granted is easier than ever just so long as you have the insurance and so best all round to either a) be 100% legit and have the insurance and license or b) use ALL of the loopholes and perform 100% legally without the need for a license and/or insurance.

Remember Loopholes are 100% Legal, that's why baristers get paid so much to find them in any new laws which are passed.
mindpunisher
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From my experience in Scotland. If this is at the start of a cycle of popularity chances are youl get away with it. If its a private club you don't need a license.

As soon as that club advertises outwith its membership you are required to get a license. Infact I once had a show closed because a social club put a poster up in a public place.

When I first started performing licenses were free. However after a number of years many councils up here charged £150 for a license.(15+ years ago) Either for a single show or a single run.

Hypnposis is not a big deal just now so the odd show will be ignored. The problems would most likely arise if the popularity rises once again and brings out the anti brigade.

The thing about the insurance is if you don't have the cash the lawyers may go after the venue should anyone be hurt during a show. You will not get a license anywhere without insurance. I maybe wrong but if I remember its the venue that needs the license not the performer? Or it may vary from council to council.

This means for bar work if the councils are still charging it isn't econimical to go down the license route. So you take your chance and play a game of russian roulette and cross your fingers hoping a loophole will save you. That still doesn't eliminate the risk for the venue. Most don't realise the risk exists.

For the first year I performed without insurance. Im sure so long as you are safe youl get away with it for a while. Should the trend kick off again Things will change.

Many people Ive spoken to over the years know about the insurance situation friends aquaintances etc. So springing for insurance would be a good marketing ploy. However youl need to charge much more than £300 a show.
Photo-Wizard
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Mindpunisher

With respect the "Private Members Club" exclusion is if you want to abide to the letter ofthe law now no use.

Reason being the Licensing Act 2006 which applies to all premises (including private members clubs) who sell Alchohol

This Legal Act of Parliment clearly states that Hypnotism Shows need a License/Permission from local authority to take place in ANY licensed premises which sell Alchohol and unfortunately due to the wording of this Act of parliment it overules the 1952 Hypnotism Act and is law.

As such by the letter of the law no longer are shows in private members clubs (where they serve alchohol) legal without permission from the local authority

But to be honest as long as its no being advertised publically then how are the local authority ever likely to find out?
bobser
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So my plans to seek publicity on local radio is NOT the best idea I've ever had?
Does anybody know how Robert Temple (Robert if you can answer that'd be great) is arranging his latest show (I think it's in Manchester?) with regards to insurance and a license? That would be very educational.
Bob Burns is the creator of The Swan.
mindpunisher
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In my case they found out because someone tipped the council who had a grievance around hypnosis. Things may have changed since the new 2006 review. ~Before then clubs didn't need a license if they were putting the show on for members.

Actually the truth is we went ahead anyway but just couldn't advertise outwith. It had a moderate turn out as oposed to being bursting at the seams the previous time.


Bobser I think Robert made it clear he has insurance. If the show is going ahead then the council has agreed to it and gave him a license. There really isn't anything else to add. The Police will usually do a background check on you. If you have any convictions you might not get the license.

Councils vary with their rules and guidelines. In the 90s I had a run set up in Newcastle as an alternative to Paul Mckenna and Andrew Newton. Who would be both playing around my run. I had bookked two shows with the option of up to 12. It was a late show billed as an adult show. I couldn't believe of all places Newcastle it was banned before it happened. The council refused a license on the basis the show used inflatables and had "adult" content. This was a 1500 seater

Powers had been banned from Newcastle to. It can vary from council to council. Some parts of the country in the past had banned it completely. Much can be to the discretion of the council.

>>So my plans to seek publicity on local radio is NOT the best idea I've ever had?<<<

Im serious hypnosis is a subject that attracts all kinds of reactions from the public and media. Ive lived and performed through it. And although its not big enough just now - if it does become big enough then you don't have to be a mindreader to guess that side of things will also rise once again.

Which is why an explosion of street hypnosis would be a "gift" to the anti's.
RobertTemple
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Hi everyone!

Just thought I'd add my 2 cents, although Stuart has given a brilliant over-view of the situation as it stands.

Firstly, with regard to insurance. Yes I have it and it is available in the UK if you know where to look. It's not mega-cheap but there are 3 ways to get it and I'm working on a fourth. Of course if you do stage hypnosis for a full time living, it makes the insurance very affordable.

As far as licensing is concerned, a license must be obtained, by law, for EVERY performance that you do. It was, originally, only public performances but now as Stuart has mentioned, even Private Parties require one, thanks to the Licensing Act 2006.

The license technically needs to be obtained by the promoter. So if you are hired by a pub or similar venue then they would have to acquire it and if you hire a venue and promote the show yourself you will have to ask for it.

Applying for the license is easy.... GETTING IT is the harder part. You simply ring the local licensing department, find out who is in charge of it and ask them for a form. Next, fill in the form and send it off along with a cheque and a photocopy of your insurance certificate/policy.

I know many hypnotists in the UK avoid this by putting a clause in their contract that says the venue are responsible for obtaining a license. This means that they can avoid the hassle and cost of the license apart from the odd few occasions that the council will find out BUT I strongly advise against this as ultimately the Legal penalty will still fall down to you PLUS by performing the show you will have broken the 1952 Stage Hypnotism Act and, if convicted of this, you will be unable to perform again.

As a result, in the cover letter that gets sent out with my contract I explain that they will need to get the license etc etc, AND I ask to see a copy of it before I'll go on stage. Simple as. OK, so you'll lose a few customers here and there who can't afford to pay my fee (average of £495-795) PLUS the license fee, but generally I get most of them to cough up.

Cost-wise, in Sunderland (where I live) the license fee is £88. In Newcastle its only about £30.

As many of you will know I'm doing my DVD filming in Manchester on 9th April and Manchester City Council appear not to charge any form of license fee.

So at the end of the day, my advise from one of the UK's few full-time professional hypnotists is to do everything by the book. Follow the law, get insurance, tell clients to get the licenses. There is more than enough work available in this country to warrant it all.

Hope this has been of some use and if you want to thank me for it, buy one of the remaining tickets and come down to see my show in Manchester!

Cheers,
RT
bobser
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Thankyou Robert. You omitted to say where to obtain the insurance. Can I ask where did you get yours from, what are the three main options and what's the fourth option?
Thanks,
bobser
Bob Burns is the creator of The Swan.
mindpunisher
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Prison..
bobser
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Hey... is your name Robert???!!!
Bob Burns is the creator of The Swan.
mindpunisher
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Well prisons not so bad. At least you'll have a captive audience.
bobser
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Good point. But where's Robert with the info regarding my insurance? I tried his see-saw thingy today. It worked a treat. Has he pm'd you Mindpunisher? You normally like to talk in private. Or better still for you, in the dark.
Bob Burns is the creator of The Swan.
mindpunisher
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Bobser whats the matter with you. Robert told you Equity or FESH. Equity was the easiest when I had insurance. You can do a search on them then give them a call. Do you want Robert to visit you and change your nappy too?

I couldn't be arsed with FESH asking you all these questions telling you what you can and can't do.

Any let me know when your on radio I'll listen in.
RobertTemple
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Hi everyone!

Firstly Bobser, I'm glad you enjoyed the See Saw Induction. I have to say I was delighted with it Smile Would love to have you write a testimonial and whack it across to me Help with sales etc.

Anyway.. insurance:

1. Equity - If you are over the age of 25 (I'm not) then you can get insured at a cost of £800. You become a member of Equity, then get listed on their Stage Hypnotist Register, then you can fill in a form and get the insurance.

2. FESH - Become a member of the Federation of Ethical Stage Hypnotists (I'm not). This costs £125 per year PLUS a one-off joining/vetting/application fee of £100. Once they have vetted you and sorted it all out then you can get the insurance policy which is between £550 and £850, depending on how much you earn from stage hypnosis.

3. Look abroad. There are some insurance companies abroad (in Europe - although I don't have the details of them at this moment) who will insure UK hypnotists although I'm unsure how legally water-tight these insurance policies are.

4. I've found an insurance company that has agreed to duplicate FESH's insurance policy without me being a member of FESH as a one-off person. I'm not going to reveal the details of it yet BUT that's not me being an arse. I'm trying to work out a way of making this available to the general hypnosis population. Bear with me on it. This is the policy that I have.


Once again, I'm glad you enjoyed the See-Saw and hopefully the performance DVD too!

Cheers,
bobser
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MP... I'm having the radio thing edited. It's too long to send but I'll send you a copy (in fact I'll post it in here), just so you can write a good review about my work here on The Café (I heard it's snowing in The Sahara). Thanks for the post Robert. Although your se-saw works I'm not an experienced stage hypnotist and as such my opinion & review wouldn't be worth tuppence to you,, other than to say 'it works' which everyone already knows. But maybe in the future... ?
Bob Burns is the creator of The Swan.
mindpunisher
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Bobser Im sure you are a good magician. And good luck with the hypnosis.

I hope now you can see my point of view (even if you don't agree with it) regarding street hypno attacks. And how potentially damaging it could be.

From a source who occasionally performs and has done for twenty years it seems it is still a sensitive subject up here if not down south.

Im sure you don't need a good review from me.

Im taking a break from here ... cya
bobser
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Okay, but phone sometime for a blether.
Bob Burns is the creator of The Swan.
RobertTemple
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Hi Bobser... I wish I knew who you really are! Then your opinion would mean more! haha

RT
bobser
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Or less
Bob Burns is the creator of The Swan.
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