I actually believe he is saying it's too low, and the low price at that shop slows down the sales of other shops carrying it at MSRP. A 'price lock' would ensure equal competition between vendors as all their prices would be the same.

Yes that is exactly what I am talking about, The Price seems to low and Yes I know what Walkers and Morgans go for , One of the reasons for this post,

But My point is as jprace has said "the low price at that shop slows down the sales of other shops carrying it at MSRP. A 'price lock' would ensure equal competition between vendors as all their prices would be the same".
Thank You for understanding.
Sal

But isn't that how competition is supposed to work? Do you guys mean to say that you support "price locks"?

Not me! Price wars are a good thing! Besides, it has a way of working itself out eventually.

Jim

I agree with Jim. Free enterprise is what America is all about.
Many will only buy this set because is is affordable. If it was $200.00, they wouldn't buy it.
What is better for the producer? No sales at $200.00 or many sales at $129.00?
I own a lot of coin gaffs, and to me $200.00 is way to pricey for this gaff.

Sammy

Hi guys,
I see your point, but if you look at the shop side of this -- the producer of the product has been paid by selling an amount of items to a major supplier as mentioned above, to be bought at a wholesale price by either Brick & Mortar shops or online shops so that all can benefit. This is only one example as to how the online craze has hurt the Brick & mortar shops. Agreed free enterprise is what America is all about -- I guess I'm a little biased as our little brick and mortar shop had taken a major hit by online shops that undercut so drastically the prices of just about Anything. It is contributing to the demise of the Live Local Magic shop that people can actually visit. I,m sure if you owned a shop(you may or may not) you would look at it a little differently--I read somewhere here in the Café that 75% of the brick and mortar shops will be out of business due to the ease of buying online and the price cutting competition amongst the online shops that offer things so cheap just to make a sale, or to bring people to there site in hope that if they do not by that item in particular they will find something else that strikes there fancy.I just don't want to see the struggling Brick & Mortar shops that are left fall due to this type of practice. I cannot count how many times someone came into the shop and said " no thanks I can get them cheaper on line' -after 10-20mins of demo's --Just looking at the Ethics of it all Not Just This One Item-- and Yes I agree $200.00 retail is to much for this gaff-- But then again the wholesale price is up there also which leaves little room for profit after ship,ect for the live shop- The worker that buys an item and use it in there work -will pay for it's self after only a couple/few gigs whether bought online or at a shop ---Basically "Price Locks" that more and more producers are implementing were supposed to help stop this very thing and to try to keep the high end gaffs out of the hands of the 'Just curious,so to speak & to help keep the secret-if that mean anything nowadays" Just my opinion --not intended to offend
Thanks
Sal

Hey Sal.

Your opinion is valid. It's just that life tends to move on, whether we like it or not.

The days of a young David Roth working and learning at a brick and mortar shop are becoming quaint. There are no brick and mortar shops in my geographical area, certainly none that are easy to reach. Nowadays, the way to learn is by traveling to conventions and video. Exceptions abound and there still are many brick and mortar shops that offer what you are talking about, but unfortunately they are becoming just that - the exceptions. The upside is that with the internet and conventions, you get to meet or talk to the very best of the field on a frequent basis (many on this forum and the Nothing Up My Sleeve forum), which would have been unheard of only a few decades ago. As an example, since we are in the TUC topic, I have "talked" to Mr. Tango by PM multiple times, getting advice and asking about custom work. He is extremely forthcoming with help, advice and support. Since Mr. Tango is usually in Argentina, such conversations would be difficult over the phone and trying to communicate with him through a middleman shop owner would be impractical at best.

As for minimum prices, there are already quite a few manufacturers that have "price locks" and they don't always work - for example see what happened with the Kohler Ultimate 3-fly and how it was undercut by Magic Makers (Illusion coins).

Your heart's in the right place, though.

Regards,

Alan

Same problem here, unfortunately. I haven't seen a brick-and-mortar magic shop in Philadelphia for about 30 years! It's hard for me to feel as you do, Sal, because in my life what you predict already happened; to me there are no good old-fashioned magic shops. Online shops are all I have now, for quite some time.

Jim

I suppose the question then may be, "Do we still try to favor things that will help brick and mortar shops stay in business, even if it cannot benefit me directly?"

Well, I'm not quite sure how you expect that to be accomplished. Ask online what the prices are in local magic shops and then refuse to order any effect online that sells it for less? Surely you are not serious!

Presently I have about three or four regular online magic shops I buy from. I don’t go crazy looking for lower and lower prices but if two of my usual places have the same effect but one is significantly lower, guess which one I buy?

Sorry Chessman but there are already way too many obstacles thrown in the path of we who purchase magic effects, online or at local shops. Deceptive advertising and demo videos; reviews bought and paid for usually via the mutual back-scratching method. How often have you wondered if a given effect was right for you, desperately trying to find out more about the effect - not for negative reasons but purely to see if it is something you should be breaking your magic-spending budget on? How many items have you purchased only to discover that the effect is not quite what it was marketed as? And then of course there are no refunds because you now know the deep dark secret of that effect! I have a closet and a half filled with such stuff.

Sorry but buying at the best price available is non-supportive? Give me a break!!

Jim

My preference is to support the manufacturer/artist/creator anyway, not necessarily the magic reseller. If I can, I buy from Lassen, Schoolcraft, Mr. Tango, Mark Mason, etc. directly.

Regards,

Alan

Thanks everyone for the input and I agree with a-lot of what all have said, I believe that "Magic" is truly moving forward due to the internet and online shops and such, Giving some, that might not have found the Passion otherwise, -This has been an education for me -that's for sure and I cannot argue with the with facts --online is the Next Big Thing so to speak- and the local shop IS going away, in most places,It's just a shame. but I understand the thinking behind the best offer/same product idea, but I to try to buy from the Creator of an effect for my personal use, as I understand just how much work,research etc, that goes into it.
This has been a fun conservation and thanks all.
Sal

Can someone send an older 1/2 dollar (or other coins) TUC to Mr. Tango to retrofit with the newer round mag**t?

What would the cost be - or can someone do it themselves?

He is starting a European tour but I am sure he will answer an email request

I just purchased a T.U.C. and at first I wasn't to impressed but it has slowly grew on me. I just have one issue with it. And that is that it sounds nothing like a real coin. I cannot flip/throw it in the air because it surely gives off that tiny metal sound. I can only imagine that this may be the most difficult aspect to overcome when a gimmick like this is created. I have the same issue when flipping a 3cf in the air. Do any of these "multiplying coin gimmicks" when nested as one, sound like just one coin when it falls from a flip? I don't believe I have a defective set but rather it is the reality of such a gimmick. What are your thoughts?

Don't flip it.

I know of no gaffed coin that sounds like a real one. If it's not a single solid hunk of metal it's just not going to "ring" like one.

In "T.U.C. Appreciation" many methods for Switching In/Out the Gaff are discussed including ways to ovecome the "click" problem. Proper handling can give the illusion that all coins are dropped, clinked and shown to be normal. For example, there is a "Bounch Pass" technique in which several coins are tossed into the left hand and clink against each other, except that ...

Yes, I agree the sound of TUC is different to a regular coin and unfortunately this problem is common of any no solid coin. But is not difficult to avoid this problem. As Funsway say in the book there are many ways for that.

I will be in Blackpool magic convention with my stand. After the congress I will two lectures in Spain: Barcelona El Rey de la Magia February 22 and in Reus February 25. Then in Paris I will give a lecture and a work shop at Henry Mayol Magic School, lecture March 1 and work shop march 5.

Bye

I agree, in the sense that many things are possible to mask the sound. Though laymen probably do not notice, when you have a T.U.C. and several other coins and jingle them, the sound is flat and has a diminished ring than that which silver coins would have. Maybe this is a bigger issue when mixing silver gaffs with real silver coins than mixing clad gimmicks with clad coins. Of course proper routineing can overcome this problem, however the only thing I am truly critical of is performing a simple French drop with my T.U.C. Half the time the gimmick will click and rock creating a very tiny audible sound. Hand washing and things evolving just the single coin are hopeless, unless you have music loud music playing for your audience. However tiny that sound is, the fact is, single coins don't sound like that. The T.U.C. is a great gimmick but it is not the best thing since the shell. It is just a stepping stone for more superior practical gimmicks of the future. I mean this with all do respect and I like the way Mr. Tango is taking coin magic and can't wait to see what new gimmick he comes out with 10 years from now.

I wonder if a regular or slipp*** expan*** Sh*** will fit a Kennedy or Ike T.U.C.