I've been curious about this since the PM that was sent out recently.

Several have already expressed the same concerns I had, specifically the poor website design & content. But that is certainly fixable. However that is really the beginning. Having been disappointed by so many of the magic success-gurus, I was hesitant to even sign up for this to get more information, so I will ask a few questions here.

Is the only plan of action online marketing?

I am asking that because your site will never beat my sites in terms of search engine visibility in the market that I am in and that goes for many others here.

Certainly there are many of us here who could go on for hours about SEO, it's an important component to a larger marketing plan. Top listings in the search engines doesn't equal the phone ringing.

Aside from online marketing - what else are you going to do to promote the service?

Are you getting calls from event planners around the country and are you marketing to event planners around the country?

Is there a criteria for the acts that will be represented or is it first come first serve? Will some acts not be allowed on the site due to lack of experience?

From reading this thread there appears to be a fee for being listed. I'm fine with paying a fee as I do that with Gigmasters and it certainly pays for itself many times over, however this goes back to the first question - is being listed in the site the only service I am paying for? If I get a gig, who's booking it - you or me? Do you get a commission on top of the site's membership fee?

I think these are fair questions and I'm curious to know more about the service.

Hi Everyone,

I wanted to jump and address a few questions:

Requarding the pre-qualification, prior to sending out the north-america email that went out last night, I spoke with close to 100 magicians on the phone. While that represents only a fraction of the initial response, there were several dozen people whose reputation precedes them.Others still were kind enough to send, or link to their promotional material and many more visits to websites, discussions with trusted friends etc. The bulk of the vetting focus is on the high end. The email was sent to subset of performers in North America, not everyone who responded to the initial ad.

Regarding the first-come first served policy. It's not total a free for all. 322 emails went out and we're capping membership at 250. Each level is also capped so if 75 people want to join the top tier 25 people have to either be on the waiting list or chose a different level. Everyone who received the email is equally welcome which is why, at the last hurdle, the cutoff is arbitrary.

Finally, regarding the fees. As the email explained, the agency is one aspect of the master magicians guild, the other is the marketing outsourcing service. The email lays it out pretty well, but in a nutshell we're also creating a marketing co-op of sorts. Individually our marketing spend will be pretty high to get these results (it cost me about 8 times the top end to blanket my market), but together we can get the same or better results at a fraction of the cost.

I believe in keeping everything as transparent as possible while respecting the privacy of our members. I like having this open forum for discussion because I am sure many people have the same questions.

I hope this answered a few of your questions.

-Michael

...So if you did not receive an e-mail then???

Wouldn't it be appropriate to send out an e-mail to all who applied regardless?

It does seem like a high priced Gigmasters. As I remember, I signed up for Gigmasters with a “money back guarantee” I wish MMG had that offer, especially because of the higher price. You could go through $200 to $500 or more before you could really make a good judgment as to its success.

I wish Michael, whom I have a great deal of respect for, all the best in this venture, but I am not ready to jump on the band wagon yet.

More emails are going out today to the 'no thank-yous' and the international applicants. If you haven't seen anything by tomorrow morning, PM me or email me and we'll figure out what happened.

I think from the email they vetted performers as he mentioned some he knew and some they saw the websites and they sent the email to those they chose or had interest in having on their list. at least in the top gold area that is.

I could be wrong but that is how I read it.

again I also think one other thing. form the sound of it this will not just be a website for people to browse (they will have that) but they will also have a human touch. real people pursuing gigs for its clients like a "real" agent

any who I think it sounds good and worth pursuing.
we shall see what we shall see

later
sam
ps I am too curious what the "fee" or commission they get from the gigs will be

Someone sent me the email that went out and if everything that is said is true, then it's beyond Gigmasters on a couple of levels. The first is that anyone can sign up on Gigmasters. There isn't a vetting process. You'll find the best and the worst there. With this it looks like they are going to do their best to get the most qualified performers. It's in their best interest to do so!

Second, there also seems to be an effort to do offline marketing and to me that is the important part. As I mentioned in my previous post, my online marketing is great. I outrank everyone in my market and even Gigmasters is buried.

There is another mindset to also consider and that is some event planners are more comfortable working with an entity rather than an individual and that's one of the benefits I can see here.

One last thing that I am getting from this is that a client booking through the site will have human contact (not the performer) if they want it, someone who can answer questions and you don't get that through Gigmasters. The third party factor can be important for the person booking the show because they can get answers on several acts at the same time, receiving a consultation rather than a sales pitch.

This really does look promising!

Hmmm....
Doing some QUICK math.
At $165 a month.

This online agency needs to bring the entertainer in at at least $825. to $1,650 a month in shows to represent their fee as an agent and not a directory site of magicians.

Just a thought Carducci,
Sites like; Gigmasters, Gigsalad and Partypop are just directories for a variety of entertainers.... IF you are not going to be a directory of entertainers, but an agency of the best magicians. What is the justification asking any established entertainer to pay your company around $1,980 a year for your top membership?

$1980 x 250 entertainers (the cap) =$495,000 a year from your entertainers?



Indeed promising!

The actual membership revenue will be closer to half that, but I believe in being open so let's talk about this for a moment.

A few people have expressed confusion over the concept and understandably so. A key aspect to the Master Magicians Guild is the agency aspect. A typical agency does not charge up-front for services (therein lies the confusion). We're not trying to create a typical agency.

Think of the Master Magicians Guild as a hybrid between an agency and a marketing firm. The marketing typically firm goes out and generates the leads and gives them to you. A typical agency connects buyers with talent and charges a fee. Put the two together and you've outsourced your marketing and booking in one fell swoop.

From a cost perspective, I challenge anyone to run an aggressive nationwide marketing campaign for $165 a month (or an aggressive local marketing campaign for $65 a month) By all members making an investment into the marketing arm (commensurate with their fee range and travel radius) we now have a pretty strong marketing force.

The net result is your investment only goes towards the bookings you want. If, for example, somebody in Nashville, TN would really like to get a world class Escape Artist/Magician, we can connect them with you, Curtis. If the next person in Nashville is looking for A $300 children's entertainer, that booking goes to someone more local with that specialty.

So, where does the money go? Into marketing members online and off. That's it.

My end of this is $0 right now. No salary, No reimbursement for my investment, nada.

100% of the membership revenue goes to the marketing budget. PPC, Display, Direct Mail, telephone prospecting, list building and so on.

The Agency charges %15 on top of your fee for booking. Then 75% of that revenue goes BACK into the marketing budget - on top of the $277,000 so we can get our 250 members even busier and more successful.

The business makes a 3.75% profit on every show you perform, everything else goes towards marking our members.

Our mission here is genuinely help performers succeed and raise the profile of magicians and magic as a whole. We could do the same thing using P&H's model, but then you lose and the client loses. I believe there is a better way, personally.

"I'm In"

[quote]On 2009-09-15 17:18, Carducci wrote:


I market my business at $5.00/month.

I do trust you will do the work to advertise, I am just unsure of the results.

My other problem is the credit card as I won't use it anymore. I pay in cash/cheque or paypal. Do you allow those options?

I would also like to know what you would do specifically for my region of Ontario Canada (email me at nuvoentertainment@hotmail.com ) Since you email related more to the US

I have to assume that there will not be a large number of performers in any one geographic area? So................

Will individual performers be promoted in specific geographic areas, if somone is searching by a geographic area, or by performer name, will the M.G. site come up, and will it feature information about that performer. (Similar to Gigmaster, and other standard agencies)?

OR......will it just lead into the M.G. site and the "fill-in" the request form etc.

Blair

[quote]On 2009-09-15 17:18, Carducci wrote:


Actually, if anyone has the right promo material and if they mail out $165 a month direct marketing to the proper prospects, most likely will get a greater results.
Agency sells acts that are profitable and easy for them to sell and fits in the budget. Therefore one act can be over looked for a countless reasons... Best bet in my opinion is to stick with agency that do not charge...
IF this programs books a person twice a year it would have to be $1000 or more to break even or even worse maybe 4 times a year....

SEEMS like NO proven track record, no current contacts in the entertainment business....

I wonder who is signing up? SPEAK UP?????????????????

Well, I've been sitting in the weeds on this one.

I would like to say good luck to Magicians' Guild and all those that sign aboard. I truly do wish you well.

I would also like to add, that I will be not be one of your members.

I did fill out the initial form to find out more information and I received the e mail back with the sign up information and it just doesn't make good business sense to me personally.

Most of the performers here that have a steady business already have a good business plan. That plan includes agencies, agents and event organizers that already have a web site and promote us, all at no up front cost (although we do pay them a commission of some sort for every show, of course).

The fee of $165 a month is extremely steep for belonging to a group. Marketing by the Magician's Guild would have to be almost supernatural to make it profitable for all of its members.

In any particular geographic market (local regional, national, international), there are only so many opportunities to begin with. Many of the performers with any years of experience that have networked with their fellow magi already know where most of these opportunities exist and who is working them for their particular market.

The experienced magician, also knows the agents et al that are promoting and booking the variety acts in their areas. The agents have a pool of talent that they already find it difficult to book consistently and so most performers spread themselves around to more than one agency. In fact, some will be represented by as many as 8 to 12 agencies or more.

So, there is a limited number of opportunities that are available.

Next, the clients searching for talent do so by more than just the internet. Assuming that the Magicians' Guild can reach beyond the internet to aggressively seek out contacts, is it realistic to assume that they will contact every possible corporate lead in North America directly? No, that of course makes no sense. But, the working magician already does, or should be if that is one of their markets. They might be able to contact school boards, scout organizations etc..., but working magicians already do that too.

Well, what if the potential client does a Google search to look for a magician for their special event (which most upper scale clients do not), then Magicians' Guild would still only be one of many sites to appear, including that old nemesis P & H.

If the client is price shopping, then P & H would probably win as many jobs as MG, if not more. The majority of seekers will probably be very price conscious and with a limited budget, ie the mother or father seeking a performer for their child's birthday party. It is not like there are a lot of families out there willing to spend $300 to $500 for a magician to come to the 5 year old's bday party and they can't find anyone.

When it comes to upper level shows, these most often are booked through existing agents and event planners who have long established relationships with existing clients, or at least long established roots and a solid reputation in the business. These business contacts are aggressively sought out by the agents et al in their areas ( both geographically and speciality). This again is going to put MG at a distinct disadvantage.

Anyway, just a few thoughts on why I won't be joining. Still, if others do see this as fitting into their business plans successfully, then I do indeed wish you all the absolute very best and no hard feelings, I hope.

Looking for Mr Carducci's personal website online brings one to page 2 on Google, however his Gigmaster rating is much higher, so I'm wondering how good his online skills might be ?
Additionally I see him accepting Picnics at $135.00 per hour which isn't exactly high end work.
Hopefully as a group the result will be better but for now I see only sizzle and no steak.

Sid

Q: You want to know who signed up?

A: I did.

Q: Why?

A: I am in a new market heavily saturated with $100 performers. Normally not a problem. NOW a problem because they are actually decent. I am NOT willing to charge that nor is that all the market can bear. Because my website is currently going through a major overhaul. Because I am not a generic act that is looking to be undersold by today's agencies for less than I deserve with no future gigs resulting from it because I am passing out THEIR business card. Because I spoke with Michael Carducci on the phone today and his plan sounds solid and genuine, and he is receptive to feedback. Because I am paying a commitment for one month, and if I can get just one SOLID booking (for a high-end client that I actually WANT) it is totally worth it. Because the fee I paid to join for one month will not be charged until the categories are locked in and the marketing plan begins.

I can understand those wanting to wait for proven success before they jump on the bandwagon. I can also understand those that have a solid marketing plan and word of mouth practice and are well established in their area. For me, this makes sense, and I bet it does for others as well.

Good luck to everyone!

Alexa Langrock (Princess Lexiloo)
Enchanted Entertainment

Don't sell your act like the $100. acts... Sell you! and be flexible...

Just moments ago, this lovely lady was trying to get me down on price to a non-comfort point. She even brought up P.H. Productions. I stated to her that "P.H. Productions told you what they are worth and I just told you what I am worth."
She wanted the impossible for next to nothing. Although, I am a fan of working with clients budgets, but if they don't budge on the services they want from me, I can't budge....

Friend, there are plenty of jobs out there for all of us... It takes lots of work in order to work...

SInce you are starting off. Try sites like Partypop.com and Gigsalad. Over time they are promising, Gigsalad in the past year has brought me two amazing events and not referring to the money aspect.




Famous words by Ronald Reagan:
"Trust, but verify!"

What's funny here is After you posted this, I got about a dozen hits to my website with people looking for me. All found me #1 or #2 on google (or, in half the cases, all 10)

What exactly did you search for?

Michael Carducci - #2, 3, 4, & 8 link to me
Michael Carducci Magician - all of page one links to me
Michael Carducci Magic - all of page one links to me

And the keywords that matter in my market:

Denver Magician - #1 (and #1 in the local listings) (most searched phrase in my market)
Boulder Magician - #1, 2 and 3
Magician Denver - #5
Magician Boulder - #1

There are other, less common searches that I was 'below the fold' on. Until recently I had PPC to fill in the gaps (that is, until I diverted those resources to the Master Magicians Guild.)

Michael Carducci,

Nice search results

Wow. I'm not starting out from the beginning....I'm starting out in a new area. But I just booked a $400 birthday for one hour for 8 kids. So I think I'm doing alright. If the MMG can help me get some of those and other premium events, it will be worth it.

Thanks for your advice and all who have contributed meaningfully to this conversation so far. Keep it going!