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james prince Loyal user England 233 Posts |
I have a problem with one of my cups
It has split along the line of one of the ridges The split is about 1/3 of the way round This is one of the solid silver ones It has to be put in the context of around 10 years hard use but I had hoped these would last a lifetime Has anyone else encountered this or a similar problem? Any suggestions? I have obviously emailed Brett and am awaiting his reply James Prince |
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Bad to the Balloon Inner circle Clearwater Florida 2116 Posts |
Find a silversmith to fix it. Usually they solder the crack and buff it out.
Good luck
Mark Byrne
AKA Mark the Balloon Guy As seen on the TODAY SHOW www.balloonguy.net Creator of Bad to the Balloon DVD series Go to my store: http://tinyurl.com/Bad2theBalloon |
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Donnie Buckley V.I.P. Cleveland, Ohio 1123 Posts |
James,
When you say "along the line of one of the ridges", what do you mean? There is 1 mouth bead, 2 center beads, and the undulate saddle on Sherwood cups. Each of those places on the cups could be considered a "ridge". So where is the fracture? And if the cups are engraved, then soldering them will be a problem. |
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Christopher Lyle Inner circle Dallas, Texas 5698 Posts |
Contact Brett...I'm sure he could fix it.
In Mystery,
Christopher Lyle Magician, Comic, Daredevil, and Balloon Twisting Genius For a Good Time...CLICK HERE! |
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james prince Loyal user England 233 Posts |
Still waiting to hear back from Brett but this is not a critism, I only emailed him yesterday
DDecae - Looking at the cup mouth down on a table, the crack runs along the upper edge of the lower centre bead. This means it's hard to see but spectators examining the cup can pick it up They are then under the impression the cup comes apart |
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Donnie Buckley V.I.P. Cleveland, Ohio 1123 Posts |
Hi James,
Brett works cruise ships and is away from email for long stretches. That crack is in an odd place - the lower center bead doesn't have any stress on it from stacking/nesting or anything. All the stress is on the mouth bead and the top center bead. Sterling silver is a soft metal + 10 years of hard use, I doubt ANY warranty is going to cover that! Your best bet is to take them to a jeweler and see if you can get the crack soldered and polished - I would have the whole set polished for consistency. Then put them on a shelf and admire them - that's a beautiful and rare set of cups! |
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Christopher Lyle Inner circle Dallas, Texas 5698 Posts |
The warrenty may not be good anymore, but I would still ONLY LET BRETT handle that cup!
My 2 cents... Christopher
In Mystery,
Christopher Lyle Magician, Comic, Daredevil, and Balloon Twisting Genius For a Good Time...CLICK HERE! |
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Bill Palmer Eternal Order Only Jonathan Townsend has more than 24312 Posts |
I know FOR A FACT that Brett is on an ocean liner right now, because I got an e-mail from him yesterday stating that he was just about to leave Athens on a cruise ship. He has no way of getting e-mail aboard ship. So you will need to wait until he gets to a port and gets his e-mail.
I understand how frustrating it can be to have a cup split on you like that. I do know a bit about silver work. I've done some jewelry work in the past. The split can be repaired by silver soldering, but it will require a really good silversmith, jeweler or a top flight musical instrument repairman. If the cup is split, there is probably some distortion in that cup that will need to be set right before the soldering is done. Then the cup will need to be soldered and the repair polished out. Any damage to the engraving that occurs after the soldering process will also need to be repaired. Since there is about 1 mm of clear space above and below each of the rings, it should not be too difficult for a really good silversmith, jeweler or musical instrument repairman to fix the damage. Many musical instrument repairment, especially those who work with the instruments of symphonic musicians, are familiar with working on silver instruments and are also able to either do small repairs to engraving or know someone who is a top notch engraver. Please bear in mind that silver soldering is similar to brazing, so it will probably subject the cup that is being repaired to quite a bit of heat. Posted: Sep 25, 2009 1:04am Naturally, if this is not an engraved silver set, it makes the whole thing a lot simpler. BTW, if I were doing the cups and balls many times on a daily basis for normal people, I would use either a silver plated or chrome plated set of copper cups. Most people cannot tell the difference. Copper cups are very tough compared to silver.
"The Swatter"
Founder of CODBAMMC My Chickasaw name is "Throws Money at Cups." www.cupsandballsmuseum.com |
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james prince Loyal user England 233 Posts |
Thanks to everyone for chipping in
I think the crack has occurred in particular place it has because people try and unscrew the cups. They can't of course but they try! Bill thanks for letting me know Brett's away and all your other advice Chris, I will wait for Brett to surface first before I do anything hasty I feel a solution will be forthcoming, hope so, as I'm not really a 'put them on a shelf and admire them' sort of person |
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Bill Palmer Eternal Order Only Jonathan Townsend has more than 24312 Posts |
Two things:
1) The "unscrewing" thing should not affect the cups, unless someone who is really ham-handed got hold of them. 2) Why do you let the people handle your props? If you are using silver cups, you should make sure that the people treat them with the respect that something that expensive deserves. If these are the solid silver non-engraved cups, more's the pity. These are the most collectible of the Sherwood cups. I could sell my set for twice what I paid for it, even in these economically depressed times.
"The Swatter"
Founder of CODBAMMC My Chickasaw name is "Throws Money at Cups." www.cupsandballsmuseum.com |
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cupsandballsmagic Inner circle 2705 Posts |
If you don't have any joy (though I feel sure that Brett will be able to help) I could ask the guy who fixed my cup yesterday and did a beautiful (as in, imperceptable) job though I have no idea if he works with silver.
Bri |
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Brett Sherwood New user 96 Posts |
Hi James
Having just arrived back from my cruise to notice your alarming thread title, I'm glad to be able to add my comments here, following my earlier answer to your email. This is the first cracked cup I have ever heard about, apart from one guy who had hammered a BASEBALL into one of my tennis ball sized Engraved Copper cups and broke it in two! However things like small dents have, on occasion, passed through our quality controls and, in every case, I have exchanged the full set or fixed the single cup and returned it. Unfortunately this is a different case entirely, as you have had this set for about ten years and the warranty has expired. However, this doesn’t mean I stop caring. As I already mentioned to you in my private email, I cannot simply replace this type of Engraved All Silver cup. If under warranty and with replacement sets in stock, I ordinarily replace the entire set. At present I do not have any Engraved All Silver ‘sets’ in stock, nor have I had any in stock for about a year. If it were still under warranty I could reimburse you completely. I do not know when I will get more Engraved All Silver in stock, but my best guess would be in 2011…? However because these Engraved All Silver are always sold in numbered limited editions 'sets' of three I could not ethically replace one single cup of a used set with a new numbered cup. As I also suggested to you in my personal email, my best idea is the same as Bill, Mark and Don’s; to have this silver cup finely silver soldered by a good jeweller and then invisibly polished. There are many very clever silver jewellers in the UK that can do this very fine work without interfering with the engraved areas. In my opinion I agree this is your best and most affordable solution. If you would like me to get this done for you I will, but with my work schedule and acting as a ‘middle man’ it will work out more expensive for you. Please keep me updated and I’ll do whatever I can to help. Kind Regards, Brett Sherwood PS) this reminded me of another incident which I have copied from my Q&A on my website. Dear Brett, The cups have arrived today. Thanks a lot. They are great. I will take some more time to write you again tonight, but can already say that I am very (!) happy with them. I was also positively surprised by the fact that you applied your smooth range discount though the cups were ordered before the discount was introduced. Thanks a lot! I have to mention, however, that I found a (very) small dent in the middle ring of one of the cups. I definitely do NOT intend to return the cups for refund because of that. I like them a lot and dent really is rather tiny. However, I am of course asking myself whether such a dent can be smoothed away and whether I can send the cup in for repair? Given how tiny the dent, I am not entirely sure whether this would be worth my and your effort, but you will understand that I would like to take some more time thinking about it. Just to say it again: I am VERY happy with the look and feel of your cups. Excellent work. With kind regards, Tilman ...continued [I offered Tilman a complete exchange of his cups or a paid repair of the small dent, but before this could be decided upon Tilman took his cups to a silver jeweller for expert advice and this interesting incident took place.] Dear Brett, I went to get a second opinion about the small dent and by coincidence entered the shop of an elderly, soon to retire silver jeweller who turned out to have some professional experience in metal spinning. When he saw your cups he basically went down on his knees because he was so impressed by your work. He told me not to worry about the small dent, which, he said, could easily and inexpensively be removed completely by inserting a tool into the cup and hammering the bead back into shape from the other side. He also pointed out that the dent really was very minor and did in no way diminish the value of your work. Having witnessed this expert's immense enthusiasm about your smooth silver cups, I now think that I was being overly picky when complaining about the dent and I am feeling very sorry for any inconvenience my last emails may have caused. I therefore want to apologize and thank you again for your impressive service and for taking my concerns so seriously (more seriously than they deserved). Special thanks for your very kind last email, offering to replace the set. Last but not least thanks a lot for your very beautiful cups. I very much hope to have enough money in the near future to buy another set. Tilman Gruenewald - The Netherlands |
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lint Special user Concord, CA 967 Posts |
Hah I remember the guy who hammered the ball in. He came on here all upset about it.
sheesh
"There's many a slip 'twixt the cup and the lip..." -English Proverb
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james prince Loyal user England 233 Posts |
As you will gather from Brett's thread we're now in communication
It's looking like a jeweller or similar at this stage I will report back on the outcome James |
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tabman Inner circle USA 5946 Posts |
James, I'm still kicking myself for not getting a set when they were available. Good work is always worth admiring. I think Bill is steering you right when he mentions a musical instrument repair person. He's talking about a "horn man." Selmer used to make silver saxophones and I think cornets too. Good jewelers are almost a thing of the past here in the states.
-=tabman
...Your professional woodworking and "tender" loving care in the products you make, make the wait worthwhile. Thanks for all you do...
http://Sefalaljia.com |
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Pete Biro 1933 - 2018 18558 Posts |
Glad to see this is resolved.
BUT... IMHO... whenever someone has a problem like this I would not post it in a public forum. I would always go to the maker first.
STAY TOONED... @ www.pete-biro.com
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Turk Inner circle Portland, OR 3546 Posts |
James,
Another possible repair source might be to contact a local museum and ask them for suggestions on whom to use to accomplish the repair. I'm fairly certain that the museum people either have an outside source for repair of similar objects (i.e., cups, picture frames, etc.) or they have someone on staff that does this type of work. Anohter possible source might be some local art calleries. I'd be greatly surprised if their database did not include the names of artists that do similar work. Tabman gave you an excellent idea when he suggested music intrument repair shops, and, they might be the least expensive way to go. Jewelers mght be alright but, they come in all sorts of variety and expertise. And, IMHO, unless the jeweler comes with a long list of references and/or specilizes in jewelry making, you might not get the best person doing this highly specialized job. Being anal retentive, I'd almost just pay the higher price to use Brett as a middleman and send it back to him and have him "git 'er dun" (Sorry, Yank joke.) for you. Bummer that the cup split. Best, Mike P.S. Never knew that Brett's cups had a warranty period. Frankly, never knew that anyone who manufactures cups might have a warranty period on their cups.
Magic is a vanishing Art.
This must not be Kansas anymore, Toto. Eschew obfuscation. |
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Bill Palmer Eternal Order Only Jonathan Townsend has more than 24312 Posts |
A couple of things here:
1) Most of us have gotten spoiled with the instant communication that has become available to us over the internet. We post an item for sale in the Tricks and Effects for sale or trade section and we wonder why nobody has contacted us within an hour or two. Sometimes, slower means of communication are necessary. In my work with the banjo company that I write ads for, I may be gone for a week, without a proper computer. Or I may be on tour in Germany for a few weeks. People who contact me during those times may have to wait a week or two for a reply. I'm as guilty of this as the next guy. I have almost forgotten how nice it is to phone someone. Or to write them a letter. 2) I understand the frustration of having a prop like the engraved Sherwood cups get damaged. There are a number of things this brings up. First, you need some kind of backup set -- not necessarily of the same quality, but that will work as well. I would very strongly suggest purchasing a set of the engraved copper cups. You can even get them plated. I would also try to find exactly what caused the first break and eliminate that.
"The Swatter"
Founder of CODBAMMC My Chickasaw name is "Throws Money at Cups." www.cupsandballsmuseum.com |
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M for Magic Special user 673 Posts |
Hi Brett,
After reading through this thread I just wanted to say that I am sincerely impressed by your customer service and ethics. True integrity! Very rare these days. All the best, Jeff |
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Bill Palmer Eternal Order Only Jonathan Townsend has more than 24312 Posts |
Brett is aces in my book. He always stands behind his merchandise.
"The Swatter"
Founder of CODBAMMC My Chickasaw name is "Throws Money at Cups." www.cupsandballsmuseum.com |
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