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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Gaffed & Funky » » Mind Power vs. Radar (1 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

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thumpton
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I am seriously considering purchasing a Mind Power deck for an effect where I need a spectator to silently select a seen card. However I'm not entirely sure a Radar deck wouldn't be better for me. Has anyone used both and can compare for me?

While I would usually have a table for a ribbon spread, there may be times when it would be better to spread the cards from hand-to-hand as several spectators make their selections, as I've seen Osterlind do with his Radar deck.

The selection will be quick and the cards will then go away. Of course I could purchase both and use as appropriate, but I don't know as I need to. Is a table required for Mind Power? Suggestions?
Zebaztian
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That's a question I wanted to ask as well. Did you read my mind? In that case, you don't need the Radar nor Mind Power Deck. Both effects are the more or less the same, but the Radar Deck is cheaper. Why is that? And if the effects are actually the same, isn't this a copyright issue?

Who can help us out?

By the way, do not reveal the trick. I'm thinking of buying of the two, but which one? Any tips?
My mind reading routines: http://www.basjongenelen.nl/goocheltrucs/. Scroll a bit down to the English routines.
Richard Osterlind
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Zebaztian,

I really don't think the Mind Power Deck is exactly like my Radar Deck.

My effect is based on the Koran Deck and many others. There are many subtleties, of course, such as the exact construction and the fact that you don't really ask questions and what you do say is very little to get a lot of information.

I think I first put out the Radar Deck about 25 years ago, but I would have to look it up to find the exact year. I had a slightly different and earlier version that I put in the Linking Ring and it won an award.

Richard
pearljamjeff
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Richard is right. They are not the same at all. I'm sure there is a way to work the radar deck for one spectator, but I haven't come up with it yet. Radar is my preference for audiences of four or more. Mind Power is my preference for one on one.

The pros and cons of the Mind Power Deck:

Pros -
* All of the cards may be shown to be different. Not examined, but shown. (Note: some may argue that this ventures into the arena of "over-proving")
* No, a table is not required.
* It works one-on-one.

Cons -
* The reveal of the card may have more "no" responses than the Radar deck.
* The cards are bridge sized with a weird back design. (Maybe there are bicycle versions out there now, but at the time I bought mine, there were not.)
* More expensive. The price difference is probably due to the gaffed nature of the MPD. If you lose your deck, you will need to buy another... or make one and lose the ability to show the cards as different.
* Deck cannot be shuffled. (False is fine, but shuffling isn't really needed.)



Pros and Cons of the Radar Deck:

Pros -

* Multiple reveals.
* You can even tell them the card they "almost" thought of, in addition to the one they settled on. (To be fair, you can probably do this with the MPD as well, but this concept was not explored in the MPD materials.)
* Normal cards. If you lose your deck, you can make another fairly easily if you have to. Buying a replacement is also fairly inexpensive.
* Seemingly no fishing at all.

Cons -

* Four people required for the routine as described. Like I said, there might be a way to come up with a process for a single person, but this would potentially lessen the impact.
* Cards cannot be shown fully for a prolonged period of time. Easily remedied with a s***ch after the routine. Giving the supposed deck out as a souvenir.
* Deck cannot be shuffled. (Shuffling is not really needed.)


For a great use of the mind power deck, see Derren Brown's "Smoke" routine. He uses a different reveal process that eliminates some of the potential for "no" responses.

For a great demonstration of the Radar Deck, see Richard Osterlind's Mind Mysteries Volume One DVD. He destroys an entire room with this routine. In mentalism, the more involved you can get the audience, the better. For that reason, I would give a slight edge to the Radar Deck, as long as you have the audience to support it. That said, they are both phenomenal concepts in their own right. Both are very worthy to have in your collection.

I hope that helps?
Jeff Travilla - I own an advertising agency to help finance my magic addiction.
Zebaztian
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Thanks Richard and Jeff. It certainly looks like the decks are more different than I thought. If I see Jeff's explanation I tend more to the Radar Deck. If read Richard's answer, the Radar Deck is the better one (of course, Richard ;-). Altough I like to do tricks one on one, instead of one on four... I must think and consider a bit more. The costs defenitely plays a role.
My mind reading routines: http://www.basjongenelen.nl/goocheltrucs/. Scroll a bit down to the English routines.
Steven Keyl
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MPD has one huge advantage which is explored by Derren Brown, as Jeff mentioned. Specifically, you can have a thought of card disappear from the deck to reappear at any other location.

After purchasing 'The Act' from Osterlind I saw how awesome the Radar deck can be. So I made up a modified version which uses the same cards in the MPD. That way, I have less to remember regardless of which deck I'm using. It's the same group of cards.

In fact, the only time I use the MPD now is if I'm doing a 'Thought of Cards Across' type effect. Otherwise, I stick with the Radar deck because it's so simple to use with multiple spectators. And because you're using normal cards, if you drop them or bang them up over the course of standard performing they are easy to replace--MPD is quite expensive by comparison.
Steven Keyl - The Human Whisperer!

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"If you ever find yourself on the side of the majority, it is time to pause, and reflect." --Mark Twain
thumpton
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Great information! Thanks to all.

I have watched both Darren Brown and Richard's performances and they are, of course, fantastic. Like Zebaztian I need to consider it a bit more, and resist the urge to have both immediately. I will consider my audience, the routines I am creating for them, the venues ... and THEN probably give in to the urge and happily get both. I'm fairly sure Radar is in my future for my routine, but I might just have to have MPD for 1-on-1s with family and friends and the odd unsuspecting "improptus" where I need the card to vanish from the deck and reappear elsewhere. [Great suggestion on using the same group of cards.]

I have never been disappointed with either Darren or Richard's effects or instruction. Even when not performing, my Osterlind Breakthrough Card System effects are rarely out of reach.

Again, thanks for your posts!
JoeBlack
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Can anyone tell me if the versions of the Mind Power Deck being sold now are printed on standard bicycle cards? I have seen many people saying they don't look like bicycles etc, but don't know if its an old version or the present one.

Thanks in advance, and sorry for going slightly off-topic.
Kjellstrom
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JoeBlack
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I guess that means they are printed on real bicycle cards.
Thanks.
Kjellstrom
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First time I saw a magician use the Mind Power deck I remember I had no clue how it was done. One tiny question and he know my card.

This is a powerhouse effect IF done flawless. True.
Noskcid the Fantastic
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This past weekend I was playing poker with some new friends and one of them happens to be a very proficient card trick artist. He took the deck from the table, showed me a group of cards, asked me to think of one and proceeded to tell me which card I was thinking of. So is this trick possible with a normal deck of cards, or do any of you believe that he may have pulled a deck switch?
Jonas
Kjellstrom
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Yes, you can do a similar effect w. a normal deck of cards.
One example: Allan Ackermans Impromptu Ultra Mental, think of a card effect.
Noskcid the Fantastic
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Thank you for the reference Kjellstrom! Can't wait to check it out.
Jonas
Decomposed
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Quote:
On 2009-09-29 16:37, pearljamjeff wrote:
Richard is right. They are not the same at all. I'm sure there is a way to work the radar deck for one spectator, but I haven't come up with it yet. Radar is my preference for audiences of four or more. Mind Power is my preference for one on one.

The pros and cons of the Mind Power Deck:

Pros -
* All of the cards may be shown to be different. Not examined, but shown. (Note: some may argue that this ventures into the arena of "over-proving")
* No, a table is not required.
* It works one-on-one.

Cons -
* The reveal of the card may have more "no" responses than the Radar deck.
* The cards are bridge sized with a weird back design. (Maybe there are bicycle versions out there now, but at the time I bought mine, there were not.)
* More expensive. The price difference is probably due to the gaffed nature of the MPD. If you lose your deck, you will need to buy another... or make one and lose the ability to show the cards as different.
* Deck cannot be shuffled. (False is fine, but shuffling isn't really needed.)



Pros and Cons of the Radar Deck:

Pros -

* Multiple reveals.
* You can even tell them the card they "almost" thought of, in addition to the one they settled on. (To be fair, you can probably do this with the MPD as well, but this concept was not explored in the MPD materials.)
* Normal cards. If you lose your deck, you can make another fairly easily if you have to. Buying a replacement is also fairly inexpensive.
* Seemingly no fishing at all.

Cons -

* Four people required for the routine as described. Like I said, there might be a way to come up with a process for a single person, but this would potentially lessen the impact.
* Cards cannot be shown fully for a prolonged period of time. Easily remedied with a s***ch after the routine. Giving the supposed deck out as a souvenir.
* Deck cannot be shuffled. (Shuffling is not really needed.)


For a great use of the mind power deck, see Derren Brown's "Smoke" routine. He uses a different reveal process that eliminates some of the potential for "no" responses.

For a great demonstration of the Radar Deck, see Richard Osterlind's Mind Mysteries Volume One DVD. He destroys an entire room with this routine. In mentalism, the more involved you can get the audience, the better. For that reason, I would give a slight edge to the Radar Deck, as long as you have the audience to support it. That said, they are both phenomenal concepts in their own right. Both are very worthy to have in your collection.

I hope that helps?



Great info, thanks!!! Smile I only have used Richard's Radar Deck, very nice. Once I started his BCS, I basically only use that one now when I use cards.

C
PSYSHADOW
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Richard's Radar Deck all the way for me!
Peace in the World - or - the World in Pieces
david blown
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There is the version of Derren Brown using the Mind Power Deck, its really a fantastic trick!!! I would go with the mind power deck all the way!!! (with the biggest respect to R. Osterlind). The MPD is in my opinion a very good approach to the thematic.

(I like ungaffed deck versions much more, and have come across some very interesting ideas, but for a quick go MPD in my opinion is great)
david blown
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Check out his "the devils picturebook", the MPD effect - if I remember correctly - should be included somewhere... its called smoke or similar
david blown
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There is another deck called "dream deck" by nick verna and jeff bloom, they say its better than MPD and peter duffie agrees.. do a quicksearch on the Café

best, David
JSBLOOM
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Review for Dream Deck can be found here:

http://www.themagiccafe.com/forums/viewt......orum=109
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