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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » The Gambling Spot » » My Cold Deck Switch idea (0 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

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splice
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Quote:
On 2009-11-03 09:04, acesover wrote:
If it is the dealer who completes the cut how did he deal with the other deck in his hand.


Ever consider that there are natural pauses in the game? In the shuffling procedure? There are opportunities for the dealer to get a hold of the deck while waiting for the cut.

Cold decking is not a new thing, and regardless of your opinion that it can't be done at a table, it has been done, it is being done, it will continue to be done, and it gets the money.
acesover
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Quote:
On 2009-11-03 09:37, splice wrote:
Quote:
On 2009-11-03 09:04, acesover wrote:
If it is the dealer who completes the cut how did he deal with the other deck in his hand.


Ever consider that there are natural pauses in the game? In the shuffling procedure? There are opportunities for the dealer to get a hold of the deck while waiting for the cut.

Cold decking is not a new thing, and regardless of your opinion that it can't be done at a table, it has been done, it is being done, it will continue to be done, and it gets the money.



You are right cold decking is a very old concept and I guess will continue to be put to use. But I do not believe it can be used as much today as in the past due to the fact there are just to many savy players.

I also agree with you that there are definitely pauses between the time the cut is offered and the actual cut takes place. But lets be realistic here. Most of the games played today the players are sitting quite close together. It has to be just about IMPOSSIBLE to pull off a lap move with a person sitting right next to you. That is why I said that it can work easily in performing a magic trick because of audience management, but not in a card game with someone sitting next to you.

There are much more subtle ways to put in a cold deck than that switch. As I said it is cool, but not practical in a card game for money. I can make it fly in a card trick but not in a card game for money.

No matter how good you may be it is kind of hard to lap a full deck of 52 cards with someone sitting right next to you and get away with it. Not to mention the consequences..maybe this will fly in Canada but not here in the U.S. in a money game.
If I were to agree with you. Then we would both be wrong. As of Apr 5, 2015 10:26 pm I have 880 posts. Used to have over 1,000
Maitre D
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Quote:
On 2009-11-03 09:04, acesover wrote:
If it is the dealer who completes the cut how did he deal with the other deck in his hand.


What on earth are you talking about? The deck is lapped, there is no "other" deck in his hand while he deals.

Your statement that getting away with cold-decking being "just about IMPOSSIBLE" is beyond absurd and naive. In fact, it's so bad, I won't respond to it. I'm recalling your similar arguments on the "how to deal trips" thread. Smile

Wait a second, aren't you the guy who thinks you can get away with culling by shuffling the deck face up? But a cold deck is IMPOSSIBLE, eh?
euro76
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Most of cheaters always along with a partner(s).
Sometimes, the whole house(host) is involved in the card cheat (watch the movie "SHADE" or follow this link: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WQUHaFf4r1s).

cold deck is an old concept but still, it should be the most feared con.
If you think it is IMPOSSIBLE, come to my place with plenty of money. I will shoot super duper frozen cold deck.
tommy
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BUT

I think acesover means; A croupier (stationary dealer) shuffles and then he cuts immediately after the shuffle. So how can a croupier put this cooler in? Does he shuffle with a cooler in his hands? Does he shuffle and just before he cuts get the cooler in his hands? If so, then how does he, or can he, do that when there is no time in between him shuffling and cutting the cards?

Or. If it is not a croupier dealt game, but a player dealt game, where the deal passes from player to player, where what normally happens is that the dealer who’s turn it is to deal shuffles and the fellow to his right cuts. The fellow on the right who’s turn it is only to cut and not deal, does NOT pick up the cards after he has cut as if it is his deal because its not. However in the film that is what happens, euro76 cuts and picks up the deck as if about to deal.

So, if I am not mistaken. Aces is saying this ya cooler would not the fit the normal procedure of any poker game known to man or beast. For the above reasons. I agree with him. As I can't see how it fits normal procedures neither, not now, that I can see what Aces means.
If there is a single truth about Magic, it is that nothing on earth so efficiently evades it.

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splice
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Sorry tommy, you're wrong.

Player dealt game, dealer shuffles and passes the deck to cut, prepares the cold deck while the cut happens, completes the cut with the right hand, picks up the deck and switches it out. Pretty *** simple.

As far as ditching in your lap and have other players see it, I refer again to my first reply:

"Whether it's good enough depends in a large part on what you're doing with the deck that's going out."

The fact that it's lapped in the video doesn't mean it has to be. As far as others spotting the deck going out, obviously you wouldn't cold deck with other players right next to you, unless they're partners, or you're sure of yourself. Doc posted a really nice ditch a while back that I'm pretty sure would work at the table. Video is long gone, of course.
Maitre D
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I concur. As splice said, the cold deck is prepared as the cut is offered. The switch is made when the cut is completed. Frankly, I'm surprised this needs to be explained.
silverking
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Quote:
On 2009-11-03 17:04, Maitre D wrote:
Frankly, I'm surprised this needs to be explained.

Most important point in the entire thread.
tommy
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I seeeeeee. Cool! Thank you. My only excuss is I am not a cold deck man and ain't played in a game where the players deal and cut for about 30 years.
If there is a single truth about Magic, it is that nothing on earth so efficiently evades it.

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silverking
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That wasn't directed at you at all Tommy, but rather the concept of repeatedly explaining why cold-decking still actually works as it was designed to, and wondering why all of a sudden there's even a thought that it doesn't.
tommy
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I was thinking yes Aces is right, he can’t cut and deal! I just forgot that I am supposed to imagine its not him cutting. Smile
If there is a single truth about Magic, it is that nothing on earth so efficiently evades it.

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acesover
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Where in the heck did I say that cold decking is not used? Every time I get into a discussion with you, you put words in my mouth. I never said it. I did say it is harder today then it was before because there are more savy card players today and I am sticking to that.

What the heck kind of statement is this??("Whether it's good enough depends in a large part on what you're doing with the deck that's going out.") It is not complicated in this instance it is being lapped. Again you are makinig up things because in this case we are talking about a deck being lapped not making it disappear into thin air. Stick with the topic.

If you try and bring a deck into a game in the way shown you are going to get caught..plain and simple. Are there ways to do it? Absoutely ..but that is not one of them. You make me laugh. You disagree with someone messing with the cards beore a game starts but you believe that this deck switch will fly. Do you gentlemen even play cards for money?

By the way I would very much enjoy your invitation to play cards. I live in Pa. and would very much enjoy vacationing in Canada to play some Poker with you and your friends. As I am self employed (billiard parlors and related activities) I can pretty much come and go as I please.
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splice
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Quote:
On 2009-11-04 01:53, acesover wrote:

What the heck kind of statement is this??("Whether it's good enough depends in a large part on what you're doing with the deck that's going out.") It is not complicated in this instance it is being lapped.


If you can't understand what's being said, better shut your mouth than be exposed as the fool you are.
acesover
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I understand what is being said alright... it is just that you do not want to face reality. You are sitting at a card table with people who are playing cards for money and you just made a cheat move and have 52 cards sitting on your lap and probably not in a very neat pile. They are not just going to disappear. Unless you have that "secret move" but if you do why did you use a slopy lap move to begin with). The guy sitting next to you, unless he is deaf dumb and blind just might ask what are all of those cards doing in your lap? Of course you can tell him that he does not understand the same as you told me here in your last post. However as that is in the real world and not in cyber space I do not think that will fly. So you go ahead in your game and use that paticualr cold deck switch and lap the cards and win all the money. I am sure it will work for you. Good luck.

As I said it will work in a magic trick senario as you have audience control, but not in a gambling situation with people sitting alongside you.
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silverking
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Acesover, please stop embarrassing yourself.
acesover
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Thanks for all that valuable input silverking. That is the post we have all been waiting for.

Guess I am just not as smart a you guys and am embarassing myself. Go out and use your Lap cold deck switch in the gambling world. It is positively flawless and has everyone fooled. Most card games I am at the players all have cards on their laps while sitting next to one another.

Another win for you. Foiled again by the true gamblers here. Quite frankly I do not know why I bother to respond to some of these posts as I should realize by their content that the posters while may be magicians but are not gamblers. I guess I should realize this is a magic forum not a gambling forum.

I am done responding to this thread. I know that will constitiue a win for you nongamblers so enjoy and feel like a winner.
If I were to agree with you. Then we would both be wrong. As of Apr 5, 2015 10:26 pm I have 880 posts. Used to have over 1,000
silverking
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Acesover, you suffer from the Dunning-Kruger Effect on this topic, (don't worry, a lot of people do), please go to this link and read about your problem:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning-Kruger_effect

Some years ago I (and many if not most others here) suffered through exactly the same ailment on this very topic.
It's important to remember (before you light up like a roman candle) that there is no one book to learn from, there is only the words of those who already know.
Unfortunately for most, it only works for those who are willing to shut up and listen.

Over time, I listened to a few folks who told me to keep my uninformed opinions to myself and instead to quietly listen and learn from those who didn't suffer this same ailment, and in fact did know of what they spoke.

You may very well be a gambler, but you're most definitely not a hustler or a cheater, nor do you fully (or even partially) understand hustling and cheating methods.........but your own fundamental incompetence in the field simply won't let you realize that fact.

The suggestion that you stop posting definitive statements related to topics you don't understand is just a suggestion.......yours to do with as you see fit.

(remember, because you don't understand something doesn't make it anything more than a topic you simply don't understand.......you'd do well to mull this over before responding......you likely won't, but you'd do well to).
silverking
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Unfortunately, the "edit" button has disappeared, but re-reading my post above it may come across as if I had intended it to be insulting or derogatory towards acesover.

Just to be clear, I didn't mean it to be either.

I honestly feel that (on this particular topic), much of what's in my post may be worth reading for those who may be learning (which includes me BTW).

This is a topic (and forum) in which definitive statements are probably not that good of an idea, and also a topic in which one never stops learning.

The post above where I suggest that acesover is "embarrassing himself" should have been more detailed(as was the next post), and was a knee-jerk response.......never a good idea.
Maitre D
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Quote:
On 2009-11-04 10:02, silverking wrote:
Acesover, please stop embarrassing yourself.

Quote:
On 2009-11-04 10:46, acesover wrote:
I am done responding to this thread.


If only it were always this easy...
Maitre D
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Acesover, we don't single you out for no reason. You say things that are incorrect or make it obvious that you don't understand what's going on. Whenever we correct you, you get bitter and sarcastic and refuse to accept our correction.

This became immensely apparent in the "how to deal trips" thread when you were corrected 4 or 5 separate times on different subjects which made it very clear that you lack an understanding of some very basic principles. Rather than being appreciative to the information we were giving, each time you were corrected you became more aggressive and egotistical with your posts.

For the sake of the future of this forum, stop behaving like this. If you want to debate something, fine, but only do so if you can handle it maturely. Be open to the fact that others may know something that you don't.
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