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Craig Dickson Veteran user Pleasant Valley, NY 353 Posts |
Part of it is in each performers contract, and that is part of their agreement with the convention. I do not have a copy of that, they do. I do have ones I signed, it is in every one. Inappropraite material, blue material is in every contract I have ever seen with regards to performers. It is also in contest rules. Blackpool Magicians have it as well. Hey, get booked, you will see it. Why don't you ask them what they expect, wouldn;t that have made sense? Call me silly, I guess it was the way I was raised. As a performer, my own guidlines are simple, it is not my right to offend even one person, not if I want to be hired again. Again, I said take it for what you want. Its not my candy store, but I have been in enough to understand. It is part of the dealer agreement as well, we have had to ask many to remove items that could be offensive, and either they do, or they leave, and that I may have a copy of somewhere, but this is a no brainer. Why in heavens name would any one debate something that is just so appropriate and simple and stands for family values. And I did not say the audience was not important, I did say the expectations are up to those who hire you, it is their call, not a vote. And also, take what ya want, leave the rest. Here is an excerpt of a blog with quotes on this topic from Bill Cosby regarding Magic.................
.........As to Cosby's second point, off color, dirty, or "blue" material has no place in magic. "Cos" pointed out that in the days of vaudeville when the comedian didn't get the laughs from the audience that he thought he should get, then he dropped his pants and resorted to debased humor. Many of today's comedians and some magicians use "blue" material or "potty" humor as the mainstay in their act. His point was that if they start with this kind of humor and it doesn't work, then where do you have to go to get the audience to laugh, particularly if you have alienated most of them to the point of no retrieval? Their pants are already down so to speak and they have nowhere to go except to pull them up and go home. Along this same line of thinking, once you have started working "dirty", then it's difficult to change your image as you mature. People will remember the joke or trick you did or line you used and ask you to repeat it. You may have moved on from there and no longer want to be associated with that kind of humor or reputation. But an image has already been created and you are stuck with it. So the best thing is not to use it at all and not resort to "dropping your pants." Magic itself is funny enough. People laugh or smile as a natural reaction to being fooled. You can only make it more enjoyable by weaving a web of joviality with "clean", family, G-rated humor. So be known as a "clean" entertainer that appeals to the widest variety of audiences regardless of their reactions. Take a tip from "Cos" because you can't knock success. Almost all magic organizations towed this line, it was a place you never had to worry about values. An entire industry was created in the comedy market as well, just take a look at http://www.cleancomedians.com/ And that's it I said my peace. Now time to pack for Blackpool. On to the next fun thing, Magi-Fest begins the year, beautifuly I might add, and on we go.
Craig R Dickson
Website: www.wizardcraft.com Blog: http://wizardcraftmagic.blogspot.com Magicalendar: http://allmagicguide.com/c.html |
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Corbett Inner circle Indiana 1161 Posts |
I appreciate your comments and insight Craig. Makes great sense, and frankly, sounds like common sense to me.
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David Kaye V.I.P. New York City 131 Posts |
It looks like this topic is winding down. But I wanted to add three things that have not been mentioned yet, regarding offending an audience.
1. The convention has to tell the performer about their attitude towards offensive language. It is not enough to say that it is up to the performer to ask. If the performing style and script are established and have been performed elsewhere without incident, the performer will not consider it offensive, and therefore is not prone to ask whether saying "this" is offensive or not in this particular city. 2. This is a big country and a big planet. One city's "offensive language" may not be considered offensive everywhere else. As strange as you may find this to be, organizers need to be very clear, with specific examples of what is considered offensive at that particular convention. I watch a lot of tv where g-d, f-, s-, c-, mf-, j-, r-, are all used frequently. So be clear about what is offensive. 3. Remember that a professional magician is an artist. And as someone making art he may have decided that "not offending anyone" is not a priority in his art. Great art does offend. Otherwise it is just bland nothing, as some artists believe. Instead of saying "That is wrong," offended audiences should say, "I am offended, but he is successful and that style obviously works in the venues he usually performs in. This is an important topic to me. I even wrote a lecture called, "How To Offend Your Audience."
David Kaye / Silly Billy
www.sillymagic.com |
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Mr. Mystoffelees Inner circle I haven't changed anyone's opinion in 3623 Posts |
Fair enough, Craig. We all have our "lines", each drawn to our own level, but if the contract says "no blue material" you are correct- that is very specific and must be honored. Thanks for the reply...
Jim
Also known, when doing rope magic, as "Cordini"
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Jon Allen V.I.P. England 1771 Posts |
I spoke to Jep earlier today to thank him for all his help and for putting on such a great convention. It's not easy when around 600 people of different ages, backgrounds, interests and abilities converge onto a magic convention. I said that even if he booked David Copperfield, there would be someone who says, "I don't like those big illusions!"
With regards language, I asked him about it and the only thing that was mentioned to him was that some thought I maybe could have cut the Monica Lewinsky and Tiger Woods impressions I did with the Quadro-chick from the close-up set. I did it 9 times and nobody mentioned it to me at any time. As far as I was concerned, everything was okay. As for the lecture, I know my "Adlibitious Principle" is pretty outrageous... some of the time! I did give due warning to people and said if they think they are going to be offended they should leave. I had planned to merely show the words but the audience seemed up for it so I went with it. That's pretty much the point I was making anyway! It's about feeling out your audience and knowing where the line is. It's also about context. The words I mentioned were mostly given to me by people at black tie events and this is what happens in the real world. As a performer, you need to be ready for anything and I like to put myself on the line and not know what's going to happen or what I am going to say. It makes the performance exciting for me AND the audience. I hope that feeling came across and that people went away with a different perspective on performing something as mundane as a card trick. (Jim, I'm glad I provided you and your grandson with a memorable experience!) I feel I have a very valid point in the lecture about performance. From my point of view, if one person stands up out of a few hundred and asks me to tone down whatever it is I am doing, I feel I should honour the wishes of the majority and I would ask the person to leave rather than lessen the experience of the vast majority. I do not swear just for the sake of it when performing but can easily adapt my language (if nit my accent) depending on the group I am working for at the time. Craig is right though. If the booker expressly tells a performer the terms of the engagement and requests no bad langauge and the performer goes against them, there is no excuse. I hope all this does not detract from how good Magi-fest was for the majority of people. Every convention is several rolled into one. There will always be things people like and things people don't like. If I lived closer (anywhere in the USA would be a start) I'd definitely go back again next year. David, you make some excellent points. #3 is very true! I said that my first priority is NOT to entertain people but to make them cae. whetehr that is in a negative way or a positive way (I much prefer it to be the latter) as long as they feel something ti's better than not caring at all. With regards what is offensive, one of Elvis's first TV appearances on a chat show was filmed above the waist as his gyrations were considered offensive to some. Now what's the best way to eat chicken wings...?
Creator of iconic magic that you will want to perform.
The Silent Treatment, The Pain Game, Paragon 3D, Double Back, Destination Box and more. Available at www.onlinemagicshop.co.uk |
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hocuspocusjay23 Regular user 170 Posts |
Seems like I am reading a lot about the Friday night show, how did the Sat. night show come off?
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andrew martin Veteran user 394 Posts |
It was ###### Great !
Now that's funny |
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Andrew H. Regular user Elizabethton,TN 124 Posts |
Just have to say that this was the first time I ever got to see Jon Allen and Ed Ellis perform... It was out of this world! We gotta stop focusing on the bad and look at the good. Had too much fun with the compitions, Jessica and I are looking forward to next year. Hope to see some of my new friends soon.
Andrew |
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magicjy New user Big Stone Gap, VA 61 Posts |
Quote:
On 2010-02-10 23:42, Andrew H. wrote: Does that mean we are going to room together next year if I go. ha! Joseph
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MAGIC is believing in yourself. If you can do that, you can make anything happen. - Foka Gomez Joseph Young WWW.JOSEPHYOUNGMAGIC.COM |
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bsears Inner circle Cincinnati, Ohio 1040 Posts |
Personally, the only thing I found offensive during the convention was the way some of the audience members were treated. I'm not going to name names or specifics, but there were more than a few times when helpers were mocked or insulted. I can't remember ever seeing so much of this...maybe its just the economy or something that's got everybody in a "mood." Some of it is ok, but it just seemed out of control to me.
To Jon - I did Adlibitious in my restaurant Monday and it KILLED. (the word was "Furnace" btw, weird, but I made it work). I really appreciate your contributions to card magic! And I loved your little duck probably more than I should. Ok, as far as Garcia, here's the bottom line: Under 50 = love him. Over 50 = probably not so much. I thought the book test was hilarious, the card restoration beautiful (my room-mate thought adhesives were involved lol), and his dollar bill magic just received rave reviews in Magic Mag. What more can I say? Someone asked about the Saturday night show: Well, Arther Trace scored the only Standing "O" of the convention. And he deserved it. On a final note, was anyone else surprised the Headliner show ended with a rabbit production? (maybe I've just been spoiled by all the great illusions over the years, but it left me wanting a little more. As I said before, Magi-fest sets the bar very high!) |
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Craig Dickson Veteran user Pleasant Valley, NY 353 Posts |
Jon
Alex did tell me how to eat wings. But it is his intellectual property so I won't tip it. Not mine to give. And yes, Jon that was my ONLY point. IF the show producers state a specific requirement, then that and only that is what you present. And .......... as far as negatives, I think the media has warped us all. That is the focus of News in our generation. I was just defending the wishes of any producer (not just Magi Fest) to state what they expect. The Magi-Fest team is one of the best I have ever had the pleasure to know and work with. Regardless of a few speed bumps, and every convention has them, the overall experience of Magi-Fest year after year is simply one of the best. Why? Because they don't run it as a business, it is a passion for magic, for excellence, for making it a wonderful experience for all, a labor of love, and something they all give to without reservation. You can see it in their eyes and hearts. The experience is what you make it. Any convention can be so much more than just the line up, and this one had a solid line-up by the way, some truly world class presentations, but enjoyment is up to each attendee. It is what you make it. We had the time of our lives, were able to catch up with many friends we had not seen, in some cases in years. Laughed until we almost cried, and made some new friends we will do that with next time. But we went to have fun, and we did. And it was great seeing you Jon, it's been a while. Always something we look forward too. Hopefully I see you on the other side soon. Glad you got home ok, we leave on Tusday. Be well.
Craig R Dickson
Website: www.wizardcraft.com Blog: http://wizardcraftmagic.blogspot.com Magicalendar: http://allmagicguide.com/c.html |
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Chezaday Inner circle Naperville, IL 1673 Posts |
You know there were many highlights of the convention .. Jon Allen was one of them. His lecture was awesome .. funny and entertaining. The material in question was presented with class. You had to be there ... it was a riot.
Daniel Garcia was doing his thing. I don't recall hearing him drop one "F-bomb." Sure the older crowd may not "get" him .. but, he was entertaining as well. Aurthur Trace set the bar pretty high. He has fine-tuned his act over the years and his work is paying off. Now I see why he has won so many awards. The dealers room was a bit sparse from years ago, another sign of the times. I can still remember when Chalet had his huge display .. those were the days. Let's not forget about the food out that way .. Skyline Chili, Thorton's and of course the Waffle House after mid-night. Now I'm getting hungry ... Steve |
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magicnewswire Inner circle 1947 Posts |
I forgot to post this here earlier, but Bill Gladwell captured a set of interviews with people attending the convention including Tony Miller, Terry Ward, Mike Segal, Jamie Schoolcraft, Danny Garcia, Dan Harlan, Geoff Williams, Caleb Wiles, Tim Hall, B Smoth, Ryan Bosley, Jep Hostetler, David McCreary, Michael Kent, Aaron DeLong, Shane Black & Carroll Baker and you can Listen To Them Here
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Jon Allen V.I.P. England 1771 Posts |
Quote:
On 2010-02-11 00:33, bsears wrote: That's great you went and tried it out. The only down side is you'll not want to do any other card trick with a group of people because you'll be thinking, "I wonder what they'll write?" Doing it for the first time, I bet you were really 'fired up'. I guess you did the routine you learned from an old 'flame'? With the 'heat' really on you I suppose you were 'stoked' when it all worked out? Oh, there's nothing wrong with liking the chick Craif, you are absolutely right in that any convention is what you make it. I'm all for 'the exeprience' and it is not the tricks you learn the sleights you notice, the lines people use but the overall experience. (The same as when we perform for laymen!) It's the in-between times that can make a convention and Magi-fest was no excpetion. I came away inspired and rejuvenated about magic and that's thanks to the organisers and the attendees.
Creator of iconic magic that you will want to perform.
The Silent Treatment, The Pain Game, Paragon 3D, Double Back, Destination Box and more. Available at www.onlinemagicshop.co.uk |
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dg magic Veteran user Houston , TX. 350 Posts |
Hey there Guys,
I've been out of town for the past few days and I just wanted to hop on and clear up a few things. First and foremost, I think all of you guys should know how much of an AMAZING job all the Red Coats did. They were extremely helpful in every aspect of the convention. The organization and availability to the performers AND registrants was TOP NOTCH and I couldn't thank you guys enough. Next, I spoke to Jep a few days ago to apologize if I had offended anybody with a routine that I'd performed, it was NOT my intention to "appear cool," "act street," or to purposely offend anyone at the convention. Jep actually chuckled and said that he never thought I had, and that he would happily refer me to any other convention as he was receiving numerous compliments on my lecture and my performance throughout the entire duration of the convention. Now to clear a few things up that have been STRETCHED so far they could reach the moon and back. 1) NEVER did I ever drop the "f-bomb" in any of the shows that I was performing in. If someone was around me at the hotel BAR and heard otherwise while I was talking to my friends, then I apologize for not taking my volume into consideration. 2) The words "HAIRY BALLS" were NEVER used in my show. How do I know this for a fact? Well... because that whole routine is scripted. I will go through and tell you EXACTLY what I said and how the routine goes. The routine is a book test that Alex Rangel and myself created, known as the Innuendo Book Test. A SPORTS book is pulled out and a spectator is asked if they play sports. The book is given to them and they are asked to turn to any page and think of a word. They write the word down for the audience to see. The audience chuckles and I act surprised that the word is so amusing. I then say that I will draw a picture of the word after a few yes or no questions. I then say and I quote :: - Some of these are larger than others - They are different textures..like some are fuzzy and some are smooth - You probably played with these a lot more as a child that you do as an adult Each time the audience responds I act completely surprised that the word is so entertaining. I then tell the spectator to say the word out loud and the spectator says that the word was "Balls." I once again act surprised and state that I now understand why this is... ummmm.... and how you could mistake..... ummmm... I then turn the pad over and show that I have drawn a TEDDY BEAR. The audience laughs again and I just stare around. I then pull a tab that is attached to the drawing to reveal that the teddy bear is playing with BASKETBALLS... the routine ends, everything is understood full circle, and I move on with the close up show. That is EXACTLY how the routine goes... that's the way it was scripted to ENSURE that it doesn't go too far. I will admit that the routine is "on edge" and I had a judgment to make as a professional. After my second show on the first day, Jep stopped me in the hallway to say that he was already getting compliments about my close up show and about Eric Jones' close up performance. At that moment, I decided the routine was funny enough and not too far over the edge, so I made a decision to continue performing it. If anyone was offended, I ensure you that was not my intention as you can see from how the routine is structured. I will apologize if anyone WAS offended, BUT, stretching the truth to make your story seem more dramatic is... well... silly. It was also stated that I didn't do any "good magic" or "good entertainment" in my close up show. While you are certainly entitled to your own opinion, I will respectfully disagree. I did change one of the close up effects that I was performing on the second day. I was performing a coin across routine that I have been performing for years called "Your Personal Safe". While in England a few years back I started getting a man on stage to act the part of a woman and he is instructed to talk in a high-pitched voice. The routine ended up being one of my most entertaining pieces, and although it got good laughs I didn't think it played as well during this convention, so I took it out and replaced it with "Jacob's Ladder" which got an audible response in EVERY room that I performed in. I then closed with my signature effect "TORN" which I personally consider to be one of my finest works. I have no way of knowing if anyone was offended due to the fact that throughout the entire convention I was either helping some with routines or holding court in the lobby, as Geoff said. Throughout the whole time not once did I have anyone come up to me displeased or angry. I actually BOOKED three more conventions at this convention, got some GREAT compliments from Dan Harlan and Gene Anderson, and I made many great new friends. As always I had a great time at this convention, it was an honor to be apart of a great close-up lineup with:: Eric Jones (absolutely flawless and smooth) Ed Ellis (what a thinker) Jon Allen (hilarious and creative) and Terry Ward who I did not get to see. Hope to see you guys all soon!!! Daniel Garcia
-Truth is made up of two things... FACT... and the ability to believe it-
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Mr. Mystoffelees Inner circle I haven't changed anyone's opinion in 3623 Posts |
Danny-
This spec agrees 100% with what you have related. I never heard the "bomb", and the "balls" routine was exactly as you described- pretty tame, really, and quite funny. For me, Torn is one of the very best card MAGIC routines there is, and I was thrilled that you performed it! One of the highlights of the show for me... I am a greybeard, but my grandson and I both really enjoyed your magic and your humor... it was a good presentation, DUDE! Jim
Also known, when doing rope magic, as "Cordini"
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Chezaday Inner circle Naperville, IL 1673 Posts |
Daniel speaks the truth .. it's all there, every bit of his routine. I was there and I'll stick up for him.
Steve |
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Mr. Mystoffelees Inner circle I haven't changed anyone's opinion in 3623 Posts |
Really, the only downer for me at Magi Fest is the practice of "reserving" seats for the big shows. I was in the special "first 100" that get to go in a bit early, and was surprised to find hats, coats, drinks, even children laying over four seats, etc. I paid for my seats a year early, was at the door early, yet someone with more important things to do gets the choice seat.
I have absolutely no problem with the Magi Fest authorities reserving seats for those they feel deserve it, but having your kid go down early (and how did they get in?) to reserve a bunch of seats while you sit in the bar is just wrong...
Also known, when doing rope magic, as "Cordini"
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Dweller 0 Posts |
This was my first time at magi fest. I thought it was a great experience. Enjoyed it all. Im new to magic at 38 yrs old. Its an experience I wont forget. Just a side note my favorite magician was Authar Trace. Amazing stuff for sure.
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No Show the Magician New user Reynoldsburg, Ohio USA 36 Posts |
I had a great time at this convention. It was awesome seeing old friends, current friends, and making new ones - Shayna Reed and Jon Allen were my favorite new friends - for obvious reasons to each of them. Chris Korn hanging out in the lobby and bar was awesome too.
Just to address the conversation at hand on the last few pages - Danny's performance was hilarious! I was the spectator he involved in the BALLS routine and I think it is brilliant, funny, and some other third complimentary thing. I never heard him once drop the F-Bomb in his performances or lecture. Danny's performance, in my mind rivaled David Williamson's past few years of performances during the close up show at Magi Fest. Which, if you don't remember, was an audience involvement Mr. Wizard effect and playing a drum set, bringing out a highly valued cups and balls set just to put it away and go "nah nah nah na boo boo", laying a kid down and vanishing a silk and making it reappear in a kids bum. Hysterical! All of it. THe audiences rolling on the floor. Nothing too magical - but very entertaining. Now, for those of you complaining about what Danny did - what's the difference in his performance and Williamson's? Danny had a great time and everyone else was too. And Danny actually did do several magic effects. That Jacob's Ladder fooled everyone I knew in the room. Twas very good Mr. Garcia. Torn was awesome live. I'm not even going to try to address the inuendo and language as Craig has handled that nicely. I also agree strongly with Jon Allen - just have to know your audience or at least try to feel them out. For me when the ground rules aren't laid by the client before hand, I have "feelers" for every audience. If they go with it, I'm letting loose the material that I love to do. Which for me is setting up the scene and allowing them to make the connection or the jump to the joke I didn't tell or the inuendo I didn't make (ex. - doing a sponge balls routine with blue colored balls - I don't make an off color reference. I just open the door and they dive through it). But I digress. I wasn't going to address this. All in all, Magi Fest was awesome. I'm not calling anyone haters, but I think you should just say the material wasn't for you. Or maybe you didn't like the delivery mechanism for the material. Or maybe you want to buck the "what's hot" right now genre. Who knows. I had a good time and I know many others that did too. See you all next year!!! Aaron DeLong |
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