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DaleTrueman Veteran user Australia 317 Posts |
What about sleight of hand? Does that count as a trick or not? I think yes.
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tnmagicgator New user Fayetteville, TN 60 Posts |
I don't mind people using the word "trick" to describe what I do or to make a request of me. I prefer to not use it myself; I'll offer to show them something "amazing" or "fascinating" or a magical effect. I guess it boils down to personal preference and semantics.
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funsway Inner circle old things in new ways - new things in old ways 9988 Posts |
In my books I define "trick" as what comes in the box or is found on the page of a magci book. An "effect" is what a magician does in a performance, with concern for setting, patter, character, etc. So, for me you can't "do a trick." -- but can play a trick on someone, which has nothing to do with magic.
the 'trick', the performer and the spectator should combine to produce something greater than the sum of the parts; or so it seems to this old fart.
"the more one pretends at magic, the more awe and wonder will be found in real life." Arnold Furst
eBooks at https://www.lybrary.com/ken-muller-m-579928.html questions at ken@eversway.com |
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RobertlewisIR Veteran user Colorado 367 Posts |
I don't really care for the word "trick," either, because for me its reminiscent of those cheap plastic "tricks" we all got in magic sets as kids. Nothing against them, as so many of us started there, but do I really want to compare what I do now to what I did then? I don't think so.
At the same time, the audience thinks in terms of "tricks," so it doesn't really bother me if someone says "go on, give us another trick." And to be perfectly honest, that's exactly what I'm doing, too, isn't it? I'm using deception to trick them, or a trick to fool them (or however you want to phrase it). Generally speaking, I don't offer to do tricks, though. I'll offer magic, perhaps. Or maybe illusion. Or depending on the situation, I might script it in a more unique way. Really, though, the bottom line is, no matter what you call it, the audience is going to call it a trick, so I say let's forget about the labels, try not to get hung up on what people call our magic, and just make the magic memorable, because that's what really counts.
~Bob
---------- Last night, I dreamed I ate the world's largest marshmallow. When I woke up, the pillow was gone. |
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coolini Regular user australia 176 Posts |
[quote]
Really, though, the bottom line is, no matter what you call it, the audience is going to call it a trick, so I say let's forget about the labels, try not to get hung up on what people call our magic, and just make the magic memorable, because that's what really counts. well said... |
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professorwhut Inner circle Posts R US sold me 1353 Posts |
After much soul searching about a signature, I decided not to have one.
TG Pop [aka ProfessorWhut] |
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professorwhut Inner circle Posts R US sold me 1353 Posts |
And for goodness sake, practice your "trick" until you can't do it wrong before you perform it.
Otherwise you will only be "tricking" yourself, and no "magic" will be involved.
After much soul searching about a signature, I decided not to have one.
TG Pop [aka ProfessorWhut] |
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Vick Inner circle It's taken me 10+ years to make 1120 Posts |
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On 2009-12-29 11:54, BrianMillerMagic wrote: Sorry you feel that way. I don't lie, I weave stories creating entertainment Creating an experience with the audience. If I weave a story about my date showing up 45 minutes early and what was done to do to get ready quickly where is the lie? Perhaps the word "effect", or "let me share something with you" or "have seen this?" or launching into the story Giving the effect no name, leaving it ambiguous allows the subject or audience room to interpret, can make it more personal How do you touch people emotionally or reach them intellectually if you promote your art as a lie? My Art is Never a Lie
Unique, Thought Provoking & Amazing Magical Entertainment Experiences
Illusions By Vick Blog of a real world working magician Magic would be great, if not for magicians |
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Vick Inner circle It's taken me 10+ years to make 1120 Posts |
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On 2009-12-30 13:40, funsway wrote: :ohyes:
Unique, Thought Provoking & Amazing Magical Entertainment Experiences
Illusions By Vick Blog of a real world working magician Magic would be great, if not for magicians |
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mhend Regular user Kentucky 108 Posts |
I understand and agree with many who say the word "trick" can cheapen the trade. But sometimes you have an audience that wants to be tricked...it's part of the fun. remember the old Jack Benny/Mel Blanc routine where Benny would ask the same old questions and Blanc would give the same answers? they performed it many times; sometimes the setting and costumes were different but the lines were always the same. the audience knew what the next line would be and loved it because of that...the delivery is what sold it. what a lost art!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O9s8U0O0XPE
"You should never, never doubt what no one is sure of." Willie Wonka
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The Burnaby Kid Inner circle St. John's, Canada 3158 Posts |
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On 2010-01-02 11:30, mhend wrote: Indeed. This whole thing, recognizing that there are different audiences out there that can be served by magic in different ways, is one of the reasons why I tried to develop the Archetypes theory. It's akin to genres in film -- saying that magic should be a certain way is like saying that all movies should be science fiction. Some audiences love to see magic that is aesthetically beautiful. Others couldn't care less. Some audiences want to have their imagination stirred by thoughts of what magic could be like if it were real. Others find such ventures an insult to their intelligence. Some audiences enjoy seeing big spectacles. Others are more amazed when they get to see magic intimate and close-up. etc. etc.
JACK, the Jolly Almanac of Card Knavery, a free card magic resource for beginners.
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Mr. Mystoffelees Inner circle I haven't changed anyone's opinion in 3623 Posts |
In my past, or maybe in a dream, I met a woman in a pub who offered to do a trick for me... it was magic...
Also known, when doing rope magic, as "Cordini"
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RobertlewisIR Veteran user Colorado 367 Posts |
No, Mandarin, it wasn't the past or a dream...it was Las Vegas.
~Bob
---------- Last night, I dreamed I ate the world's largest marshmallow. When I woke up, the pillow was gone. |
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base851 New user Houston, TX 58 Posts |
I think Andrew completely hit the nail on the head. Whether "trick" is verboten or acceptable depends on your approach. What I tell people is... when you watch a movie like Star Wars, or the Matrix, or whatever... we all know that they aren't really swinging laser swords, using The Force or being linked into a machine. But we willingly suspend our disbelief in order to allow ourselves to be entertained by the fantasy and visual experience. My job as the magician is to try to provide that visual experience. The audience's job (in my mind) is to suspend disbelief and enjoy the ride.
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tjaymagic New user 85 Posts |
This reminds me of what we are taught at degree level regarding TV, Film & Theatre, and it very much applies to magic, in all its forms.
The academic description of this is mis-en-scene, which basicly means 'all aspects of the scene'. In TV, Film & Theatre terms this is the acting, lighting, direction, camera angles, framing of the picture, costume, props, script etc. All these affect the meaning of what is on screen. This is no different in magic. We all decide on what meaning we want to give to our magic, so for a magician, his elements of mis-en-scene, is the prop/trick, his patter, framing - in regards to his audience (there are some effects that are spoiled if the audience can see what's going on behind the magician), costume, lighting, music, this also can cover physology and showmanship. The trick/sleight of hand move/prop is part of the mis-en-scene. Here is a very good example regarding this, if you perform a card effect where you use a prop to pick the card, and you only have two props to choose from a fob watch on a chain or a wand, which do you want to use, a wand, this can give the meaning of 'magic' whereas if you choose 'fob watch' this 'can' easily go into the relms of physcic. I could easily see a mentalist choose the fob watch thoug, though some mentalists may disagree with me! Trick is only part of what we do as a whole.
hey... ... what is this signature saying about me?!
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Anatole Inner circle 1912 Posts |
This discussion about "trick" reminds me somewhat of the perennial debate about whether or not magic is an art. In the final analysis, I think it's all in the mind of the beholder. The word "trick" need not have a negative connotation. It has been used positively in other fields, such as Will Rogers's acts where he did trick roping. Explorers such as Sir Richard Burton wandered the world looking for someone who could perform the Indian Rope Trick in the open air, and I doubt seriously that he ever asked anyone, "Have you ever seen the Indian Rope Effect?"
I always felt that substituting the word "effect" for "trick" was somewhat contrived. I'm sure that I'm not the only magician who prefaces an effect by saying, "For my next miracle I will need the assistance of a volunteer from the audience." To paraphrase the Bard: "What's in a name? That which we call a trick by any other name would be amazing." And I do think magicians spend too much time asking themselves "Is the word trick a good choice when performing before an audience?" or "Is magic an art?" I don't think the audience cares one way or another. What matters is--are they fooled and entertained? (The real trick is not fooling the audience anyway. As I once wrote in a magazine article, the name of the game is not so much fooling anyone. It's tricking them into suspending their disbelief so they recapture the sense of wonder they knew when they really believed in--MAGIC! ----- Amado "Sonny" Narvaez
----- Sonny Narvaez
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charliemartin Special user Rapid City, SD 779 Posts |
Does it really matter..my business card says magician. What do you do? Tricks.
Charlie |
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DomKabala Inner circle I've grown old after diggin' holes for 2827 Posts |
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On 2009-12-28 21:33, teedpop wrote: 1. Cheap... 2. Trick... I saw them in concert with Ted Nugent a few times in the day... Seriously I use the term "trick" without guilt all the time. I have heard many of the greats refer to what they perform as "tricks" & Frank Garcia, Johnny Thompson, Charlie Miller, Dai Vernon, John Mendoza, and many more of the greats used the term without remorse or guilt. Tricks, effects, endeavors, experiments, etc. is just a word and a means to an end, but not the end in itself. The end is great entertainment isn't it? Cardamagically, DOM
We don't stop playing when we grow old...we grow old when we stop playing.
God is enough, let go, let God. Gal 2:20 "Anything of value is not easily attained and those things which are easily attained are not of lasting value." |
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tjaymagic New user 85 Posts |
...Whereas on a forum, we can debate the meanings of these words...there is no right and wrong answer, only a well constructed point of view...well that's what I was told by a university lecturer anyhow!
hey... ... what is this signature saying about me?!
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jusakarman New user Jakrta, indonesia 70 Posts |
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On 2009-12-28 21:33, teedpop wrote: for me prefer said "let me show you something amazing" than "let me show you some trick's" ii don't want to become trickster..i want to become miracle worker, magician....
"for those magicians who place magic above comfort and reward" from book of wonder by Tommy Wonder (November 29, 1953 - June 26, 2006) ........
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