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WDavis Inner circle 1276 Posts |
Tony,
what makes this section bizarre is that as you put it "We exist in harmony in this section of the Café." cheers, isid0re |
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Oscar999 Elite user 401 Posts |
Just an observation:
In Richard Webster's video, Techniques for Psychics he reads the Tarot for a real client. And during the course of the reading he sets up a card revelation with the Tarot deck and at the end of the reading "reveals" a face down Tarot card which the participant had set aside earlier. To me, the card trick aspect of the revelation within the context of a reading was wholly unecessary, reducing the reading to the level of a stunt. Just another magician saying, "look what I can do." If you've seen the video, you'll recall that the client did not seem to be impressed by the card trick at the end either. And my guess is, it casted a shadow of disingenuiousness on the whole affair. But, echoing some the praise for Eugene Burger, if you watch his video, Eugene Goes Bizarre, you'll see some really outstanding pieces of magical theater performed with Tarot cards (like Retribution and the Haunted Pack). So, certainly it can be done. Oscar |
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LarsRuth Loyal user Frankfurt, Germany 212 Posts |
I'd like to move this thread a little bit back to topic.
Of course it's very tempting for me to believe, that the Tarot has indeed supernatural powers, but the rational part of myself sees the Tarot and it's effects on people from a more psychological point of view. The pictures are architypes that connect directly to a more or less extent with someones subconsciuos mind or even the collective subconscious (C.G. Jung)and can bring certain elements of the subconcious mind to the conscious mind. So why does a person (who has not become addicted to the cards, and does not need to ask the Tarot if it is better to bring an umbrella to the planned hiking trip or not...)needs consultation from the Tarot? Usually there is a problem that needs to be solved or an important question that needs to be answered. The big chance of a tarotreading is IMHO to find a new approach to the problem, the possibility to gain a new insight, to find a new method to solve a problem that hasn't been thought of before. Since no card in the tarot is purely good or purely bad, a sensitive reader can often offer valuable insights and valuable counsel and advice to his clients. I think that is the true "magick" that comes from the tarot. Just for the record: I don't want to offend anyone who believes in true supernatural powers of the tarot. (apologies for possible grammar or spelling mistakes, english is not my first language and its 6.30 a.m. ... ;o) |
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The Curator V.I.P. Beware Vampire, I have 3910 Posts |
Quote:
On 2010-06-22 22:19, Tony Iacoviello wrote: You forget to name the Holy Kard Duck Worshippers (Khanar) like me. |
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Tony Iacoviello Eternal Order 13151 Posts |
Look again, I mentioned you by name.
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mota Inner circle 1658 Posts |
I like ducks and am very happy to see someone worships them.
The magick isn't in the tarot, it is in the reader and also in the relationship between the reader and the sitter. The tarot is just an effective tool to access that part of you that gets blocked by "logic" such as in this thread. That's not the part of the mind you can best do readings with. As far as this topic goes...I am confused. Many very accomplished and respected performers have used tarot for magic tricks with good response. If you are OK with using tarot in magic and someone else isn't that is their problem, not yours. This is not a black and white issue. It isn't about whether it is "wrong". It is about being true to yourself. If you do something you don't believe in, such as tarot readings, you are being a phony to yourself and the person you are reading. You have right to be as fake as you want to yourself but to deceive others about your sincerity to get money is wrong. If you are ok with being dishonest to others about who you are that is something you need to look at for yourself. If you like being that way get out three cards and get a crew on the streets...it isn't any different. The question of this topic just doesn't make sense to me...decide for yourself if it is wrong or not and act accordingly and consistently. If you seek someone else's approval or opinion you are wasting your time. In topics such as these there will always be people who passionately agree and disagree with you. While I would never do a magic trick in a reading I recently found out it can be done effectively. A close friend sent me a message a while back...it was how he used the special ability of the Carnie tarot in a serious reading. I must admit it works well. It just isn't for me though I gave it a lot of thought. It was a very strong way to do a reading. It is a big world and there are many ways to do things. One more thing I will add with edit...last week I did a reading (ok, it was palm but humor me). The woman had me wait until her husband left. He is a Texas minister (got the picture?) and was against tarot, palm, and pretty much everything interesting and fun. She still wanted her reading. Just because they say in public they are against it doesn't mean in private they are. Gypsies, tramps and thieves We'd hear it from the people of the town They'd call us gypsies, tramps and thieves But every night all the men would come around And lay their money down |
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The Curator V.I.P. Beware Vampire, I have 3910 Posts |
Palm reading is Holy Kard Duck's favorite. Be blessed.
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Van Helmont Elite user 488 Posts |
Quote:
On 2010-06-23 02:43, The Curator wrote: Palm drinking is mine! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ESVFYPcOuQ4
The Epiphany Before Christmas: this day (12/23/13) I leave the Café for good!
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Van Helmont Elite user 488 Posts |
Quote:
On 2010-06-23 02:43, The Curator wrote: Palm drinking is mine! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ESVFYPcOuQ4
The Epiphany Before Christmas: this day (12/23/13) I leave the Café for good!
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The Curator V.I.P. Beware Vampire, I have 3910 Posts |
I must remind you that Tony "Doc" Shiels reads the foam marks in Guiness (the Great Unknown In NESS).
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handa Inner circle Pittsburgh, PA 1357 Posts |
I think that you can be a skeptic and still respect others' views, beliefs, and fears. In fact, I think that it is a balance of artistic integrity and understanding an audience that makes art interesting.
People may choose to not offend sensibilites or feed fears (I believe the latter is more of a problem for routines using tarot cards) while others may choose to make their audience deal with them head-on. It is an interesting choice, and I have enjoyed artists who have worked both sides of the coin. George Carlin comes to mind as one who deliberately crafted his later routine to literally offend everybody in the audience. He alienated some and entertained others, including me. He also made me think about my own beliefs in the process. In either case, I honestly feel that ignoring the significance our audience places upon the items we choose to use as props is the foundation for a badly-constructed presentation. Chris |
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mota Inner circle 1658 Posts |
You like palm reading and ducks? You may be a genius after all!
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Steve_Mollett Inner circle Eh, so I've made 3006 Posts |
An old theater professor from my college days once said:
"There is no right or wrong in art, only good and bad."
Author of: GARROTE ESCAPES
The absurd is the essential concept and the first truth. - Albert Camus |
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H2Odesign Regular user the Armpit of the Panhandle 193 Posts |
Quote:
On 2010-06-22 13:29, gaddy wrote: I love this version; this is one of my most successful effects with 'regular' or tarot cards; perception is always a matter of perspective. |
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J.Warrens Inner circle Canada 1098 Posts |
I am quite ok with any who may find anything I perform as "wrong".
There are (believe it or not) SOME (but not many) who will declare you a "devil worshipper" for even standard magic tricks. You win some, you lose some. Artistic vision and entertainment are my chief goals, and yes, you can't always please everybody. You can look for an answer outside of yourself if you like, but you won't be gaining anything real. The answer is inside of YOU only. Cheers. |
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H2Odesign Regular user the Armpit of the Panhandle 193 Posts |
Quote:
On 2010-06-23 05:11, The Curator wrote: This is the Oracle Docc mentions in System 88, my search is finally over. Has anyone seen the Doc or the monster of late, I have some questions in my froth that need addressing? http://www.unmuseum.org/lochness.htm And I always thought the answers were in the cards... Larry |
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Lord Freddie Inner circle 1093 Posts |
I use tarot cards for readings, so for me personally to perform what could be construed as a "magic trick" would be a bad judgement on my part. The only effects that I feel comfortable using tarot cards for are ones that have a divination / prediction theme to them. Other than that, Black Hart's "Power of the Tarot" is something that is feasible in the context in which I use them.
An Ambitious Tarot routine is not something that's for me! |
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The Curator V.I.P. Beware Vampire, I have 3910 Posts |
Quote:
On 2010-09-13 04:02, Lord Freddie wrote: While not a specific tarot deck, the story here uses a deck of cards as a divination tool in an ambitious card routine. Let'say that only lack of imagination is a limit to creativity. http://www.surnateum.org/English/surnate......nTri.htm |
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