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MagicSanta Inner circle Northern Nevada 5841 Posts |
I don't know, you seem a tad bit anti everyone who isn't Asian right now. Of course coming from an amazingly racist part of the world I can understand your having that position.
I saw an interview with M. Night Shayamalan and he mentioned that he went to college in the Mid West and there was only one Indian woman there so of course everyone fixed them up. She was a surgical student (already a doctor) and he ended up married to her. He said that to this day, regardless of how much money he has made, her parents are angry that she married 'down' because his family came from a different part of India that they consider a lower caste. Nice huh? Poor guy can't even escape biggots in the country his folks came from! |
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Pakar Ilusi Inner circle 5777 Posts |
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On 2010-07-04 23:21, MagicSanta wrote: Sorry If I came across as such. Here it is, I wanted to see an Asian Boy depict an Asian Boy in The Last Airbender. As it stood, the boy they picked didn't do a good job at it as the majority of the reviews have stated... I would actually be a bit miffed if they really did cast Denzel Washington as Superman, it wouldn't be correct for the role. Or Jackie Chan as Spiderman for that matter. Or if they decided to cast Edward Norton as Florence Nightingale for a serious Movie on her life. On a point someone brought up... The new Karate Kid is strange to me not on the Casting but on the title premise as it is NOT EVEN KARATE. It is KUNG FU as stated and shown in the Movie. As a life long Martial Artist I find that to be completely economically motivated, to play on it as a "remake". If you want to change the whole thing, call it something else I say. Callng Kung Fu "Karate", is a huge disservice to Chinese Martial Arts I feel. But maybe that's just me... I just would like to see a little intellectual consistency as an Actor and budding Film maker, it's not even a Race thing really... I'm guessing that's way too much to ask... Well... When money is everything in Movie Making, it suffers... Before you say... "It's just a Movie, who cares how much thought you put into it so just get over it..." I'll say this... "It's just a Magic Show, who cares how much thought you put into it so just get over it......" To some, some things mean more than to others. I'll stop there.
"Dreams aren't a matter of Chance but a matter of Choice." -DC-
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MagicSanta Inner circle Northern Nevada 5841 Posts |
Rotten white kid ruined the movie. Say, where is the thread about the honkified kid in the cartoons doing voices? The reason that kid was wrong for the Karate Kid is if his family went to China I doubt he would have gotten anyone to speak to him let alone train him. Of course the movie would have done great had a Chinese kid in China learned Kung Fu, millions would have watched that strange situation. When Bruce Lee (an American!) opened schools here in the US he was threatened by other teachers for teaching the white devil. Now you are mad because some movie sucks and it is because, seemingly, it was a white kid who they decided had the martial arts skills to pull it off. Boo f'n hoo. Do you think had some Asian American kid played the part it would have been a better movie? Hold on...have you seen this movie only people who watch little crappy cartoons heard of?
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Pakar Ilusi Inner circle 5777 Posts |
Santa, Santa...
I think you missed the point of my point. Exactly because of what Bruce Lee did, is exactly why an Asian kid should've been given the chance to play this Asian Role. Had it been a Caucasian role like a Cowboy kid, an Asian kid would've been a wrong choice for it. I have nothing personally against this boy Noah Ringer, he was the wrong cast for this role. The majority of reviews and fans of the Cartoon say this. Check it up yourself... Btw, I have not seen the Move "The Last Airbender" yet as I write this post... Will see it as soon as it plays here in Malaysia despite all of this. That is besides the point here... Bruce Lee, for all his talent, ability, "Westernization" and open mindedness was not picked to play a Shaolin Monk in a Series he co-wrote with himself as the lead, the "Kung Fu" series (lead by David Carradine). Bruce himself was said (by his close friends) to be angry with this decision. If he wasn't, than maybe I can agree with you Santa on your point. Strangely I think we are saying the same thing, the right person for the right job, regardless of ethnicity. And most of us Bruce Lee fans can only wonder how much better "Kung Fu" would've been better had Bruce been given the chance. I have no problem with the new Karate Kid as a Movie (though the action was a bit over the top for kids doing it). I liked it for what it is. What it ISN'T is "Karate". It was Kung Fu through and through. That was my issue. Relax Santa, I'm just saddened by Shayamalan's decision. Someone else made this into a "Civil Rights" debate that I just had to take part in, to my regret now... Still seeing the movie. That says something.
"Dreams aren't a matter of Chance but a matter of Choice." -DC-
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LobowolfXXX Inner circle La Famiglia 1196 Posts |
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On 2010-07-05 00:51, Pakar Ilusi wrote: I didn't think you came off that way, myself. I'm still curious as to your thought about same-race cross-national casting, e.g. Chinese actors in Japanese roles, etc. With respect to Bruce Lee and Kung Fu, Kwai-Chang Caine was mixed-race (part of his characterization was the racism he experienced not only as a partially Asian man in the USA, but also as a partially Caucasian boy in Asia), so Lee would have been racially "miscast" as much as Carradine. Too bad biracial MMA star Lyoto Machida wasn't around back then; he might have been a good choice.
"Torture doesn't work" lol
Guess they forgot to tell Bill Buckley. "...as we reason and love, we are able to hope. And hope enables us to resist those things that would enslave us." |
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LobowolfXXX Inner circle La Famiglia 1196 Posts |
Somewhat amusingly, the "Race Matters" site urges a boycott of the film, and takes Pakar's position, yet he's going to see the film; I disagree, but won't see the film, not for political reasons, but because I don't have interest in it (I think it's been pretty much a plottable downhill curve after a brilliantly promising start by Shayamalan.
So for the ultimate in respectful disagreement, I don't agree, but I'll boycott it for ya anyway! But why "should" Bruce Lee have been given the role of a half-Caucasian?
"Torture doesn't work" lol
Guess they forgot to tell Bill Buckley. "...as we reason and love, we are able to hope. And hope enables us to resist those things that would enslave us." |
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Pakar Ilusi Inner circle 5777 Posts |
In a perfect world, you get exactly the exact person to play any role. So I am given into accepting same-race cross-national casting if nothing can be done about it...
We are in an imperfect world, so we do our best with what we have. However, picking someone who is totally different in race or gender is just giving in to fears of prejudice I feel... Not their own prejudice but the perceived prejudice of their target Audience. With "Kung Fu", I wonder if that wasn't a rewrite to accomodate Carradine coming in, some say "yes", some say "no"... Even if that was how it was originally written by Bruce Lee, that still doesn't negate the fact that Bruce was still the BEST ACTOR for that role. He had both the knowledge of the Philosophy (he wrote it!) and the Martial Arts skill (he's freaking Bruce Lee!). That however is a whole debate all it's own. Anyway, that's the way it goes it seems...
"Dreams aren't a matter of Chance but a matter of Choice." -DC-
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Pakar Ilusi Inner circle 5777 Posts |
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On 2010-07-05 01:49, LobowolfXXX wrote: Thanks! I'll watch it for you! I am not an extremist by nature, if that's the way it is now then, like in Martial Arts, I'll just "go with the flow"... I'll give it a chance. M. Night always has nice shots. I just love watching Movies anyway. Just because I don't agree with someone's point of view doesn't mean I won't listen to it. As for giving them money for the ticket? Like I said, I just love watching Movies anyway... It is after all just a Cartoon Movie Adaptation... I REALIZE THAT. So, I'll go see it.
"Dreams aren't a matter of Chance but a matter of Choice." -DC-
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MagicSanta Inner circle Northern Nevada 5841 Posts |
Because it was a part time job? Parumpum!
Why didn't a Tiger Shark get the role in Jaws instead of a Great WHITE? Everyone knows the role was written with a Tiger Shark in mind and would have been more realistic but noooooooo, they use a Great WHITE. Ruined the franchise for me, I just wasn't buying the shark as anything but a Tiger. The reason they called it the Karate Kid was because it was a remake and the name has public recognition. If they called it The Kung Fu Kid then everyone would be whining about it being a rip off of the Karate Kid. Now as for it being kung fu rather than karate I doubt very many people know the difference or care that went to the movie. |
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MagicSanta Inner circle Northern Nevada 5841 Posts |
A couple things about the TV series Kung Fu. While I don't know if Bruce Lee was a writer of the show it ran from 1972 to 1975, had they hired Bruce they would have had to shoot him from an odd angle as he was dead for half of the time it was made. While Lee was considered for the role and the studio wanted him rather than David Carridine they wanted a more muscled guy rather than the sleight Lee. It should also be noted that Bruce Lee was not BRUCE LEE at the time they set things up for the series. While shooting the series Bruce made the movies that made him the legend he is today so had he gotten the role and he still died (granted unlikely) then he would not have achieved the status he did. I dare say while Lee was becoming a world wide superstar and Carradine was trying to get a pea from someones hand that Lee would have said he was happy not getting the gig.
The association for Asian actors at that time, and you can look this up if Balducci doesn't beat you to it, initially thought it was BS that Lee or another Asian didn't get the role but the series did make lots of work for them and also that Carradine was always cool to the Asian community. |
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Pakar Ilusi Inner circle 5777 Posts |
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On 2010-07-05 02:14, MagicSanta wrote: Santa. That's exactly my point. So until things change, I'll just "cry in my heart", as they say. Anyway, have a nice day.
"Dreams aren't a matter of Chance but a matter of Choice." -DC-
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MagicSanta Inner circle Northern Nevada 5841 Posts |
I checked and Bruce Lee is on film talking about a series he came up with called The Warrior that is a Chinese character in the old West.
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stoneunhinged Inner circle 3067 Posts |
As I said, Bruce was one of my heroes.
But he would have been wrong for Kung Fu (the greatest series in the history of television) for a dozen reasons. But the main one is this: Bruce was a great actor as a martial artist, but otherwise a poor actor. All anyone (including those who love him) has to do is watch the parody of Enter the Dragon in Kentucky Fried Movie, and one will realize that Bruce's mannerisms (and speech) border on silliness. It worked in Hong Kong films (and Enter the Dragon), but it certainly wouldn't have carried a series. Bruce's English was simply poor. No two ways about it. He sounded like Elmer Fudd. David Carradine took the ball and ran with it, and became Kwai Chang Caine. Bruce Lee would have remained Bruce Lee. |
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Pakar Ilusi Inner circle 5777 Posts |
Bruce Lee is still one of my greatest Heroes. Jeet Kune Do was the Martial Philosophy that changed my outlook and approach to the Martial Arts to this day...
So, I have to respectfully beg to differ concerning Bruce Lee not being able to carry the role of Kwai Chang Caine. He was perfect for it. Just because he acted a certain way in all his movies doesn't really matter, he was an Actor for much longer than he was a Martial Artist, he would've adapted. But we will never know... And, his so called "poor" English would've been perfect for the role! Remember the circumstances that that character was in and you would understand. However, it's not his English but it was more his accent that is perfect, as he had a Degree in Philosophy from an American University no less... One only has to read his writings to know that he had a good grasp of English. Carradine acted as Kwai Chang Caine very well, but Bruce WAS Kwai Chang Caine. He lived it. He really was a foreigner in the Western world expounding those philosophic gems and the Martial Arts to those he met and the masses! He did it so well that till today his words and teachings are still being used and emulated... Again, Acting as Kwai Chang Caine better than Carradine is subjective as Bruce never did that role, so we will never know. We each have our opinions. Mine is that it was one of the biggest missed opportunities in the history of the entertainment world to get it right.
"Dreams aren't a matter of Chance but a matter of Choice." -DC-
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uhrenschmied Regular user 135 Posts |
The only source I know of that claims Mr. Lee was the author of the show Kung Fu is his widow. She wrote his biography, on which the movie is based.
Here is what Mr. Carradine had to say about the matter: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3UAi-ReXmbk One thing is for certain. With Mr. Lee as lead, the show would not have made it for more than one season. CGI was not invented back then. Regards, |
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Pakar Ilusi Inner circle 5777 Posts |
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On 2010-07-05 09:45, uhrenschmied wrote: I don't get that bit uhrenschmied... What do you mean to imply?
"Dreams aren't a matter of Chance but a matter of Choice." -DC-
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uhrenschmied Regular user 135 Posts |
Pakar,
Mr. Lee died when the first season was aired. When Brandon Lee died during the making of the Crow, the studio used CGI in some shots to give a body double the his face. As far as I know this was the first time that technique was used. Regards, |
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Pakar Ilusi Inner circle 5777 Posts |
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On 2010-07-05 10:18, uhrenschmied wrote: Oopss... Forgot about that. But in alternate Universe where he did do "Kung Fu", maybe he would've have died then! I know, wishful thinking...
"Dreams aren't a matter of Chance but a matter of Choice." -DC-
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MagicSanta Inner circle Northern Nevada 5841 Posts |
To be honest with you had Lee made his movies then made the series that dude would have been elected God. I lived in the deep South where there were no Asians, I mean none, and Bruce Lee was a super star hero. People loved him and viewed him as a super man and mysterious. Since Lees death was basically acccidental had he been in the series he very likely wouldn't have died.
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balducci Loyal user Canada 227 Posts |
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On 2010-07-05 17:58, MagicSanta wrote: Accidental? He complained of a headache, took a pill, went to bed, lapsed into a coma, and soon after died. Are you thinking of Brandon Lee's cause of death? That was arguably accidental and could have been avoided.
Make America Great Again! - Trump in 2020 ... "We're a capitalistic society. I go into business, I don't make it, I go bankrupt. They're not going to bail me out. I've been on welfare and food stamps. Did anyone help me? No." - Craig T. Nelson, actor.
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