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Dela New user Germany 7 Posts |
Hi everybody,
a good friend of mine studied hypnosis a few years back. Because the subject interested me and the fact that learning alone is more difficult than learning with someone I joined him. He has done several courses with a pro and he wanted to deepen his knowledge and experience. So he told and taught me anything he knew and worked with me. He hypnotized me many times and vice versa. But it was all therapeutic hypnosis. Classic inductions of serveral techniques.Now I am very interested in learning stage hypnosis. Are there any good bokks and would they suffice? Or should I look for some trainer for stage hypnosis. Those classic inductions work very well and I am quite confident with them and have helped many of my friends with several Problems. I know about many problems that can occur when dealing with hypnosis and how to solve them. So I am not unexperienced with hypnosis itself but are there big differences regarding stage hypnosis? I know I'll have to learn new inductions... |
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Mindpro Eternal Order 10585 Posts |
Welcome. Thanks for the brief background, this is something that many new here seem to forget to do. Based on what you have described in your post I would think by now you should realize that the very best training of hypnosis is in a live hands-on, mentoring, coaching or training situation. Books and DVDs can always enhance and assist you in your continuing education, adding new techniques, elements and aspects to you skills and knowledge base, but there is no substitute for live training - especially with hypnosis - especially especially with stage hypnosis!
This question is also a question that is asked here practically on a weekly basis, and in many cases several times a week. One thing I suggest is to learn to use the Search function on this forum, as it will offer you a great deal of information and insight, and allow you catch up with what's already been discussed here. Yes there are big differences with stage hypnosis, the most important (and often overlooked) is you must be a performer, an entertainer first! You then add the hypnosis element to build on that. This includes many things over and above clinical hypnosis such as audience and participant management and safety, performance environments, sound, and preparation - for the best or worst case scenarios. These are just the very tip of the iceberg for starters. Best of luck. It's great to see someone expressing an interest in wanting to do it right, rather than trying to find the quick-fix route into stage hypnosis which rarely ever works. |
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dmkraig Inner circle 1949 Posts |
I would just like to add to what Mindpro stated by emphasizing this:
"you must be a performer, an entertainer first!" YOU MUST BE A PERFORMER, AN ENTERTAINER FIRST! This means you also need to know how to walk onto and across the stage, blocking, how to smile, how to project, and how to speak clearly, etc. Some people naturally have these skills. Other take classes in stagecraft, dance, martial arts, speech, communication, NLP, etc. to learn them. As you progress, you may also want to take some classes in business, accounting, sales, etc. You might want to learn about BOR sales and either buy books to sell, have them ghost written for you, or learn to be a good writer. |
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ThePhilosopher Regular user Menlo Park, CA 122 Posts |
One of the most important elements of hypnosis is the conviction the subject has that you can hypnotize them. You need confidence to be able to transmit that--practice, practice, practice! I learned more about hypnotism for personal experience than books. It is such a complex and personal art, that it is hard to put all the details into words. I am not saying that you can just forget the books, but that you have to take the methods and techniques to make them your own... and that can take a lot of time.
- Nathan
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Dela New user Germany 7 Posts |
Thanks for all the answers and advice.
I am not new to the stage. I have performed a little magic show some years back. I know how to present myself. I do some juggling on a regular basis and that's all just hobby. I work in the sales business and I'm doing some teaching ofr others. So I think I've got a godd idea of how to speak in front of people. Yes, I know that there can be no substitute to being trained by someone who knows the matter. Unfortunately there is no one around me from who I could learn. So I thought I could maybe read some book regarding the matter and train myself... As I said I hypnotize on a regular basis but I really want to move on from where I am now. |
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ThePhilosopher Regular user Menlo Park, CA 122 Posts |
I highly suggest Reality Is Plastic by Anthony Jacquin (who is on these forums quite a bit)
- Nathan
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mindpunisher Inner circle 6132 Posts |
Quote:
On 2010-09-06 11:35, ThePhilosopher wrote: Not if you want to learn stage hypnosis it is fundamentaly flawed. Anything to do with street hypnosis is a poor version of stage. You are better of finding products that teach you stage principles and not pick up bad habits. |
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Anthony Jacquin Inner circle UK 2220 Posts |
RIP contains zero information about stage hypnosis. For that I recommend Deeper and Deeper by Jon Chase. Better still go and do his training. Very thorough
Anthony
Anthony Jacquin
Reality is Plastic! The Art of Impromptu Hypnosis Updated for 2016 Now on Kindle and Audible! |
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Mindpro Eternal Order 10585 Posts |
Thank you Anthony. I'm glad you finally said that. It's important that the many newbies on here or those expressing an interest in performing hypnosis know and understand the difference from stage hypnosis and street hypnosis.
Here's the problem I have here. I really and honestly like and respect Anthony and his work. He has positioned himself here as someone with knowledge and coincidentally has products to sell. The thing I like about Anthony is that he can chime in with good advice from time to time. However many of his posts are just thanking posters for their praise, but when he does offer advice it is nice. The problem I have is many younger and newbies do not understand or distinguish the difference between street, stage and clinical hypnosis, and really do not have much interest in the true understandings and workings of these, and how and why they differ. They only want to get to the "good stuff". So what happens is they read or watch Anthony's materials and somehow think that makes them a hypnotist, and even worse start offering advice and critique to others here. Remember, this is a Stage Hypnosis forum first and foremost. It's very hard to normally express this without it being taken as bashing Anthony, which I am not. As I said I like Anthony and he has found a niche which is very nice for him. It's just that Anthony creates a book and dvds (and now live events) and admittedly expresses they are designed for magicians, who perhaps want to add a hypnotic element to their repertoire, or perhaps learn some very basic introductions to hypnosis. Doing a magnetic fingers test doesn't make you a hypnotist. It seems the purpose of his concept (enhancing magicians with basic knowledge) is becoming lost based on what many have posted here, with the thinking that they can watch these dvds and somehow expect to go out and be a hypnotist. This is affirmed by the many that come on here and say "this test worked, but I couldn't get them to go into hypnosis to respond to...". I'm so glad Anthony has made an attempt to clarify this. There is sooooooo much more in being a stage hypnotist than is expressed in his materials. I think there is an assumption that if you follow his materials you will be able to be a stage hypnotist. To be a stage hypnotist you must first and foremost be a performer, an entertainer. This is only the tip of the iceberg, as there are many other concerns including audience management, command and personality, safety, abreactions, and literally dozens more. Anthony's work is great for what it is. What is important is to understand what it is...and what it's not. I've been taking in many things that have been said and expressed here in regards to books, dvds, courses, trainings and other materials that are available. To confirm my beliefs I have purchased some of these things being discussed here, and I can tell you most of it is terrible (not speaking of any of Anthony's work here just to clarify), offering you only bits and pieces be someone with an arrogant, pompous personality and attitude. I understand the importance of confidence but that's not what I'm taking about. Even their live performance footage is embarrassing, and that is the foundation of what they are teaching! I'm truly considering reviewing material of this type here to offer an honest criticism, but have refrained from doing so thus far. I think it's important for those who people look up to as an "authority" or "educator" to clarify the differences and what things are and are not. Stage hypnosis is not quickly learned, it's a process of learning, understanding and practicing the art and science. There are many layers to what a pro make look easy or effortlessly. |
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bobser Inner circle 4178 Posts |
Quote:
On 2010-09-06 13:02, Mindpro wrote: I'm not totally sure if I agree with the above statement. I think that maybe that's how it started out in the minds of most people when this room was created, but I believe that we've all witnessed a hybrid emerging over the years where 'impromtu hypnosis' has quite possibly overtaken 'stage' (if you read the posts I believe that to be the case). And you can see why, especially here in The UK. For example: if I want to do a stage show this weekend I'll need: venue, insurance, license, advertising, lighting, sound system and loads of money in my bank account to make up for the loss I'll make because I won't sell enough tickets! But if it's 'the hypnosis' I love and want to do then I can just walk into a pub and zap half a dozen people over a pint of lager. So you can see why interest is flooding towards inpromptu hypnosis. And I would even put forward an arument that says, that just like stage, 'good' impromptu is not easily learned either. Like stage, it is also a process of learning, understanding and practicing the art and science in order to make it look easy or effortlessly. Although I do NOT claim to be a stage hypnotist per se, I have performed stage and can say that there are many stage hypnotists that would struggle in impromptu situations. That's simply a fact. And yes, obviously many impromptu hypnotists would die on stage. However, I simply see the two as somewhat different in nature, carrying different skills and totally none competetive. If we were watching two screens with Danny Doyle doing stage on one and Anthony Jacquin doing impromptu on another, the main common denominators we would witness would be how totally and completely in control these two highly skilled indivivuals would be. But slightly different skills would be on show and I also think a different kind of 'bottle' is needed in both sets.
Bob Burns is the creator of The Swan.
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ThePhilosopher Regular user Menlo Park, CA 122 Posts |
I apologize for the bad reference. I have only use hypnotism in the context of my work in mentalism, and have done little for larger groups. I would agree with bobser, that good impromptu is also an art that requires much work.
Perhaps for those of us that only practice impromptu, a thread on the difference between the two would be helpful (since that was also part of Dela's original question).
- Nathan
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mindpunisher Inner circle 6132 Posts |
>>>I have performed stage and can say that there are many stage hypnotists that would struggle in impromptu situations<<<
Complete ********---street hypnosis is a weak derivative taken from stage hypnosis. Its for those that don't want to or hve the ability to be professional and are in it for the attention rather than the money. Its an amatuer pursuit where the output is a very badly performed stage routines. Any decent stage hypnotist that wants to do impromtu could spend an hour or so learning impromtu walkups.(or creating them themselves) There is absolutely nothing special about them. Lets be honest look at those that do it! The question to ask is why would they want to? I guess everyone is different. I just don't get it personally. As for bottle? Walk in front of 100s or 1000s of people. Hire a venue and risk capital... I think that takes a lot more bottle than getting someone to slump forward in a pub and take away their wallet? Its gainiing opoularity because its cheap any one can do it and it appeals to those that need attention. Perfect for magicians and schoolboys.. |
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bobser Inner circle 4178 Posts |
Well, we only know what we individually know, don't we? And I completely disagree with what you're saying. That's because I know that I'm correct. And I know that I'm correct because I listen to people, and a couple guys who do decent stage shows have told me that they (not all stage hypnotists but... THEM)would feel uncomfortable standing before a group of ten people 'hoping' that they can hypnotise the 'one' standing before them, while being closely watched by the other nine. Yet they know they'll have no problem in stage where the somnambulists will run to be hypnotised. Indeed those somnambulists have been planning to run to the stage and go into hypnosis since they saw the advertising poster 3 weeks prior. Now then... WHY would these particulat stage hypnotists say that to me unless it was, for them personally, simply true? Why can we not just believe them and move on?
To get information, in order to become wiser, all we have to do is listen to people who have experiences that have been different to ours. Then we get to know more, as opposed to being closeted, and have people laugh at our archaic beliefs. If one cannot recognise, relate and assimilate what another educated person is saying, then it is completely impossible to learn anything new. I hope this has helped you today.
Bob Burns is the creator of The Swan.
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mindpunisher Inner circle 6132 Posts |
I did say a decent stage hypnotist! My very first attempt at a show I had six people and got 2 from the 6. I was very lucky I guess. I was so uncomfortable I nearly **** myself.
Hypnosis is hypnosis its just a process. Street or Stage are just contexts. And yes you get good at where you practice. Feeling uncomfortable is an internal thing. Stage hypnotists felt uncomfortable on the first few shows they did. I feel uncomfortable about a lot of things. But going ahead making mistakes and correcting them is all part of learning. I felt extremely uncomfortable about jumping back on stage with no practice. What we are really talking about is motivation. If those stage hypnos you talk about were motivated enough they would overide the uncomfortable feelings and just do it. After a few times it becomes comfortable. They just don't have enough reasons to go through the uncomfortable part. feeling uncomfortable does not equate with not being able to do it. It just means they don't value it enough to go through the learning process. But if they really wanted to or were motivated they could. That applies to most things in life. |
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Dela New user Germany 7 Posts |
I think right now that I should take some time and take personal training.
I know some rapid inductions but I think you would put them in the impromptu hypnosis field and not fit for stage hypnosis. As I said, I've hypnotised quite a few friends and relatives. Some for therapeutic reasons, some just for the curiosity of those people and I even have done some hypnosis on a birthday party. But all with the knowledge I have. Now I think it's about time to move on and stick my nose into some real stage hypnosis techniques. I will watch out for the book Deeper and deeper and then I guess I'll just have to travel to the other side of the country to get the personal training. Sucks a bit but I seems to be necessary. Thanks a lot for all the insight. |
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bobser Inner circle 4178 Posts |
Y'know what? I'm gonna' start self-harming any day now.
Bob Burns is the creator of The Swan.
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mindpunisher Inner circle 6132 Posts |
I'm not disagreeing with what you say or what you've heard. I'm only saying that those stage hypnotists feeling uncomfortable or not could do impromtu if they wanted to.
Now put those razors down you don't want to spoil those pretty boy looks. |
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bobser Inner circle 4178 Posts |
.... had a bet of £50 with Barry & Stuart I'd get you to admit I'm a 'pretty boy' before the end of September. Ta very much.
Bob Burns is the creator of The Swan.
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mindpunisher Inner circle 6132 Posts |
Not as pretty as Barry Or Stuart though. clean livin baby faces..
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bobser Inner circle 4178 Posts |
They did say they noticed how you couldn't take your eyes off them. They found you quite scary.
Bob Burns is the creator of The Swan.
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