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Dannydoyle
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Odd how you miss the point. Were you in a cave on Mars with your fingers in your ears during the Bush tax cut and the election? ALL THEY SAID was that these were benifits for the RICH! You are being willfuly ignorant. They screamed about tax breaks for the rich and how the middle class got NOTHING from the tax cuts. Now that they expire on the watch of the Messiah, well suddenly they are ok for the middle class. Wow the media is fair as can be I must say.

I threw out ol Paul because he was one of the loudest mouths shouting what I am saying.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus
<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
balducci
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Quote:
On 2010-12-14 21:24, Dannydoyle wrote:

Odd how you miss the point. Were you in a cave on Mars with your fingers in your ears during the Bush tax cut and the election? ALL THEY SAID was that these were benifits for the RICH! You are being willfuly ignorant. They screamed about tax breaks for the rich and how the middle class got NOTHING from the tax cuts.

No need to be insulting, Danny. If they "screamed about tax breaks for the rich and how the middle class got NOTHING from the tax cuts" they they were being disingenuous. As I said, I do not recall those particular screams, not as you describe them. Remember, even though there is significant overlap, I am not exposed to the same identical media that you are. So maybe I missed what you heard. What I heard and do recall were complaints about the tax cuts on the highest income brackets, but not the lower. As I also said, I recall the Democrats campaigning on no new taxes for those in the lower brackets.
Make America Great Again! - Trump in 2020 ... "We're a capitalistic society. I go into business, I don't make it, I go bankrupt. They're not going to bail me out. I've been on welfare and food stamps. Did anyone help me? No." - Craig T. Nelson, actor.
EsnRedshirt
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Hey, Danny, I find calling Obama "the Messiah" to be offensive and confrontational. Even Carrie can tell you why. And there are some liberals who think that it would be a fine idea to let -all- of Bush's tax cuts expire so as to help pay off the deficit that some people are so concerned about. Of course, there are also liberals who are quite happy with the tax deal, because it extends unemployment insurance and helps out the unemployed (among other things.)

Don't paint liberals with such a broad brush- the one big problem many liberals have with Democrats is that they have too many different opinions and just can't agree on anything and get it done.
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Dannydoyle
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I find much of the hyperbole and you saying Sarah Palin is dumb confrontational and offensive so what? When you choose to stop using hyperbole to make a point then get back to me with what you do and do not find offensive. Till then it is disingenuous and you should be able to admit that.

You are right about one thing, the dems can't deceide on if a fart smells. They have been in control for 2 years now and the republicans could NOT stop them, yet NOTHING GOT DONE! Go figure.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus
<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
Payne
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Quote:
On 2010-12-15 00:59, Dannydoyle wrote:

They have been in control for 2 years now and the republicans could NOT stop them, yet NOTHING GOT DONE! Go figure.



Nothing? Really? Are you sure about that?

How about

Health Insurance Reform, to recognize health care as a right, not a privilege and put a stop to the worst abuses by insurance companies including discrimination against people with pre-existing medical conditions. [OPPOSED BY 100 % OF HOUSE REPUBLICANS]

The Economic Recovery Act, to save and create millions of jobs and cut taxes for 98 percent of Americans. [OPPOSED BY 100 % OF HOUSE REPUBLICANS]

The Student Aid and Fiscal Responsibility Act, to make the largest investment in college aid in American history. [OPPOSED BY 100 % OF HOUSE REPUBLICANS]

Wall Street Reform, to rein in reckless practices on Wall Street, end taxpayer-funded bail-outs and "too big to fail" institutions, and protect and empower consumers. [OPPOSED BY A MAJORITY OF HOUSE REPUBLICANS]

Extension of Unemployment Benefits, to extend benefits to millions of Americans who have lost their jobs in the Bush recession and to stimulate economic activity.

Cash for Clunkers, to jumpstart America's auto industry and spur the sale of 700,000 new vehicles. [OPPOSED BY A MAJORITY OF HOUSE REPUBLICANS]

Credit Card Holders Bill of Rights, to ban the worst practices by credit card companies and provide tough new consumer protections. [OPPOSED BY HOUSE REPUBLICAN LEADERS]

Hate Crimes Prevention, to extend federal protection to people who are victims of violent crime because of their gender, sexual orientation, gender identity, or disability.

The Education Jobs and Medicaid Assistance Act, to save or create the jobs of 161,000 teachers, and thousands of police officers, and firefighters while closing tax loopholes that encourage big corporations to ship American jobs overseas.

The Lilly Ledbetter Fair Pay Act, to restore the rights of women and other workers to challenge unfair pay and help close the wage gap where women earn 78 cents for every $1 that a man earns in America. [OPPOSED BY A MAJORITY OF HOUSE REPUBLICANS]

The HIRE Act, to provide tax incentives for businesses to hire more Americans (4.5 million Americans have already been hired) and unleashing billions of dollars to rebuild highways and other infrastructure, and to crack down on offshore tax havens for the wealthy.

Children's Health Insurance legislation, to provide affordable health care coverage to 11 million children, who would otherwise go without coverage.

Tobacco Regulation, to have the FDA regulate the manufacture and marketing of tobacco, especially to children.

Statutory Pay-As-You-Go (PAYGO), to bring back the Clinton-era rule that requires all new policies that reduce revenues or expand entitlement spending be offset over five and ten years and therefore not increase the deficit. This spending rule led to the record surpluses during the Clinton Administration.

Increasing the minimum wage

Caregivers and Veterans Omnibus Health Services, to provide help for those who provide care to disabled, sick, or injured veterans and improve health care services to women veterans.

They might have even been able to do more if the Republicans had said more than "No" to most everything brought before them.
"America's Foremost Satirical Magician" -- Jeff McBride.
MagicSanta
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Before you get too excited about the health care reform due to it my wife lost her insurance because the company she got her additional insurance beyond medicare pulled out of the county and no other ones would take new customers. In addition she had to change prescriptions plans and get to pay more, way to go team!
LobowolfXXX
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On 2010-12-15 02:03, MagicSanta wrote:
Before you get too excited about the health care reform due to it my wife lost her insurance because the company she got her additional insurance beyond medicare pulled out of the county and no other ones would take new customers. In addition she had to change prescriptions plans and get to pay more, way to go team!


No, no...things like that won't happen. That's just the Republicans trying to scare you.
"Torture doesn't work" lol
Guess they forgot to tell Bill Buckley.

"...as we reason and love, we are able to hope. And hope enables us to resist those things that would enslave us."
Dannydoyle
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Wow Payne and I thought they were going to focus like a LASER on the economey LOL. All that legislative genius and some pretty historic approval ratings to boot. Wow. http://www.gallup.com/poll/108856/congre......-14.aspx

Oh and "save or create" a job? Puhlease. Fairly pathetic when you must make up new terms to show your success.

I should re state. Yes they got some things done. Aparantly not so much anyone actually liked.
Danny Doyle
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<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
HerbLarry
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Quote:
Payne wrote:

Health Insurance Reform, to recognize health care as a right, not a privilege and put a stop to the worst abuses by insurance companies including discrimination against people with pre-existing medical conditions. [OPPOSED BY 100 % OF HOUSE REPUBLICANS]



Someone PLEASE explain to me how taking money from one person and giving it another, Obamacare, is a Right?
Also explain why if I buy Fire Insurance after my house burns down it's not covered or Theft Insurance after a robbery or Flood insurance after a flood or need I go on?
You know why don't act naive.
ed rhodes
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Quote:
On 2010-12-15 00:59, Dannydoyle wrote:
I find much of the hyperbole and you saying Sarah Palin is dumb confrontational and offensive so what? When you choose to stop using hyperbole to make a point then get back to me with what you do and do not find offensive. Till then it is disingenuous and you should be able to admit that.

You are right about one thing, the dems can't deceide on if a fart smells. They have been in control for 2 years now and the republicans could NOT stop them, yet NOTHING GOT DONE! Go figure.


If I called Sarah Palin "the Antichrist," there would be a point. You can't compare calling SP's intelligence or people skills into question with referring to BO as "The Messiah."
"All the world's a stage, but the play is badly cast!" - Oscar Wilde
EsnRedshirt
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HerbLarry- "taking money from one person and giving it [to] another" is also known as "collecting taxes". I know some people don't want anybody to collect any taxes, but there must be some sort of way to pay for government. Even minimal government.

There's only one way to eliminate the deficit while also lowering taxes- and that is to completely gut every social program possible. Which, when we already have 10% unemployment, can only make the economy worse- because a lot less people will be able to spend anything at all.

As for pre-existing conditions, you're comparing apples and oranges. Or in this case, property and people. Why should we not allow discrimination against people with pre-existing conditions? Because they are people.
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ed rhodes
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I remember a cartoon in The Phoenix (local free liberal paper) that had an arch-conservative super hero (called "Average White Middle-class American Man) Sitting at the breakfast table the day after the inaugeration (sp) saying; "Ah, a new day, filled with change." He looks at the paper and says; "What! Obama's been President for a whole day and the economy's not fixed yet!" The last panel is him hammering a "Palin - 2012" sign onto his lawn.

I didn't vote for Obama expecting him to fold his arms, blink and everything would be better. Things are getting better the only way they can, slowly. We have YEARS of mis-management to try and correct and an opposing force who has stated that their only agenda is to "deny Obama a second term."

Unless he kicks a puppy or spits on a orphan, I intend to vote for him in the next election.
"All the world's a stage, but the play is badly cast!" - Oscar Wilde
HerbLarry
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On 2010-12-15 10:08, EsnRedshirt wrote:
HerbLarry- "taking money from one person and giving it [to] another" is also known as "collecting taxes". I know some people don't want anybody to collect any taxes, but there must be some sort of way to pay for government. Even minimal government.

There's only one way to eliminate the deficit while also lowering taxes- and that is to completely gut every social program possible. Which, when we already have 10% unemployment, can only make the economy worse- because a lot less people will be able to spend anything at all.

As for pre-existing conditions, you're comparing apples and oranges. Or in this case, property and people. Why should we not allow discrimination against people with pre-existing conditions? Because they are people.


So taxing people is somehow a Personal Right? Great! You owe me, and everyone else owes me...$1,000 a year. Thanks!!

On the second point I would also like some have a house insurance, food insurance, transportation insurance, computer and other electrical things insurance, sexual pleasure insurance, gas & electric insurance, etc. etc. Hey why not? I'm a people too. Don't let the fact I don't have these things get in the way. That's descrimination.
You know why don't act naive.
EsnRedshirt
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Okay, I'll let you opt out of paying taxes, provided you use absolutely no government services. So get off the road- I paid for that, and you didn't.
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critter
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Anyone not paying taxes is also banned from libraries and can either home school or pay for private school for their kids, who also are not allowed to play at public parks. Not that it matters, 'cause ya' can't use the roads to get there.
"The fool is one who doesn't know what you have just found out."
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Magnus Eisengrim
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They'll have to pay to have their own fresh water pipes and sewers installed.
The blood-dimmed tide is loosed, and everywhere
The ceremony of innocence is drowned;
The best lack all conviction, while the worst
Are full of passionate intensity.--Yeats
HerbLarry
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EsnRedshirt:

You didn't answer my question of how is Obamacare a Right. You commented on how it's paid for.
Wanna answer the question?

I answered your non answer with a logical response.

If you can answer, and HealthCare is a Right, then how come Housing, Food, Clothing, Energy in whatever form, Transportation, Recreation, Pleasure, etc. etc. aren't also? Or are they? Where do these Rights originate? Where the others did, in the Constitution? IMHO Food, Housing, Clothing would be the top three Rights. Wonder why they aren't spelled out? Please enlighten me.

Anyone else wanna answer? Inquiring minds want to know.
You know why don't act naive.
critter
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Your taxes also pay for programs which assist in housing, telephone, energy, and food expenses for those who are incapable of sustaining themselves. The gov even has case workers to help these people use those things. I've even heard that many cities have free public transportation. Your entire premise is flawed.
Life is a right, and it is the duty of every humane individual to help preserve it.
"The fool is one who doesn't know what you have just found out."
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Dannydoyle
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Really? That is the DUTY? Seriously where is that in the constitution?
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus
<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
critter
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Notice I said the duty of every HUMANE person.
Correct me if I'm misunderstanding, but did you really just say that there is no duty to protect life itself? Is that really what you said?

Constitution, eh?
Oh, look at that. It's right there in the Preamble:
"promote the general Welfare"

Welfare
welfare n. 1. health, happiness, or prosperity; well-being. [<ME wel faren, to fare well] Source: AHD
http://www.usconstitution.net/const.html
"The fool is one who doesn't know what you have just found out."
~Will Rogers
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