|
|
Go to page [Previous] 1~2~3..9..15..21..27..31~32~33~34 [Next] | ||||||||||
Steve_Mollett Inner circle Eh, so I've made 3006 Posts |
If I were God, I would alter their brains so 'acts of sin' wouldn't be part of their 'free will' options.
Better still, being omniscient, I wouldn't have created them in the first place; no people--no sin, no strife, no problem.
Author of: GARROTE ESCAPES
The absurd is the essential concept and the first truth. - Albert Camus |
|||||||||
R.S. Regular user CT one day I'll have 184 Posts |
Acesover,
I really don't think you're understanding my posts. Are you reading them in their entirety? (seriously) "Just an add on. Your Sandy Koufax comment and the sharp and blunt rocks is one of the most stupid comments here on the Café." Why is it "stupid"? Because perhaps you find it incongruous with your notion of a loving God? Here's what we know: 1) God condones stoning human beings to death for certain "crimes." 2) God's punishments are just. 3) Some humans have indeed stoned other humans to death in observance of God's "laws." Presumably, the "stoners" have done a good deed, as they have done God's will. 4) It would be contradictory for God not to do something himself that he himself has commanded as a just punishment. 5) God, as Jesus, would have stoned to death an Israelite for breaking one of his laws. To not do so would be contradictory to his own word. 6) In order to stone someone to death, Jesus would have had to pick up some rocks and hurl them at the law-breaker. He would be able to facilitate a quicker death for the law-breaker by choosing which rocks and how hard to throw them. So if you find the notion of Jesus stoning someone to death offensive, or immoral, or just plain silly, then you need to explain why. This is not merely an exercise in harmless speculating about the unknowable. The fact is that actual human beings have been and continue to be stoned to death in the name of religion. A recent example... http://www.rawa.org/temp/runews/2010/08/......air.html One last question - would you yourself stone an Israelite to death for the "crime" of homosexuality? As a good Christian, you would have to, right? And I do get the feeling that you are a good Christian, Acesover. Ron PS - I prefer Bob Seger's "Night Moves." :)
"It is error only, and not truth, that shrinks from inquiry." Thomas Paine
|
|||||||||
Carrie Sue Veteran user Auburn, MI 332 Posts |
So if you were God, you'd create robots, or nothing at all. Well, those would be options of course, but you're not God.
Thank God. We have the God we have, and we have the world we have. You can't have true love without free will, and free will brings with it the possibility of sin. Sin is that which goes against the nature and character of the True God, and He has a right to punish those who act sinfully. Which is why we need a Savior. But I'll stop there. Carrie |
|||||||||
Steve_Mollett Inner circle Eh, so I've made 3006 Posts |
I think you should.
In answer, I would create nothing at all. Why annoy myself by creating unruly creations who respond badly to my 'directions,' while simultaneously submitting them to the miseries of survival on this ball of dirt. It would be a greater act of love to NOT put them through all of that.
Author of: GARROTE ESCAPES
The absurd is the essential concept and the first truth. - Albert Camus |
|||||||||
R.S. Regular user CT one day I'll have 184 Posts |
Quote:
On 2011-01-04 19:50, Carrie Sue wrote: 1) Why must a god "create" something - anything? He is presumably perfect in every way, and lacking in nothing. Why do you automatically assume that a god must create something - especially humans? It does not logically follow that if there is a god, then he must create other beings. But you seem to ascribe SO much importance to humans. Could it be that god was made in our likeness, rather than the other way around? 2) The god we do have (IF we do) is apparently the god that Richard Dawkins describes: "The God of the Old Testament is arguably the most unpleasant character in all fiction: jealous and proud of it; a petty, unjust, unforgiving control-freak; a vindictive, bloodthirsty ethnic cleanser; a misogynistic, homophobic, racist, infanticidal, genocidal, filicidal, pestilential, megalomaniacal, sadomasochistic, capriciously malevolent bully.” 3) You are using "free will" as your god's "get-out-of-jail-free" card. Whenever you find his "laws" offensive, you deflect criticism from him and direct it to the choices of humans. 4) Which "true God" of the thousands of gods are you referring to? 5) And would this "savior" just happen to be one that coincidentally shares your worldview? What we need is common sense and the freedom from religious indoctrination. Yet another example... http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-......boy.html Ron
"It is error only, and not truth, that shrinks from inquiry." Thomas Paine
|
|||||||||
landmark Inner circle within a triangle 5194 Posts |
"Do you think Jesus had a good throwing arm, like Sandy Koufax? Would he choose blunt rocks or jagged rocks for more cutting ability?"
Don't know, but I'm sure that He wouldn't pitch them on Yom Kippur.
Click here to get Gerald Deutsch's Perverse Magic: The First Sixteen Years
All proceeds to Open Heart Magic charity. |
|||||||||
Pakar Ilusi Inner circle 5777 Posts |
Answer me these please...
If God was so angry with any of it, why doesn't he change it? He certainly has the power to do so. Or... If God knew what was going to happen why does he get angry when it happens? If God knew he was going to get angry beforehand, is it "real" anger? Or God is just playing the part in the "script" that he wrote himself? If it is not "real" anger why does any of it matter at all? Why not forgive people who God knows will do wrong because he preordained it? He made Hell, so he made it for the ones he knew beforehand would do wrong (eg the Pharaoh). Why does God punish them when God wrote the "script" that way? Why not just forgive everyone if he is The Most Benevolent? Why does any of it matter anyway to the MOST Powerful Being since it cannot affect him at all? If it could, God would not be the Most Powerful. Please answer me these...
"Dreams aren't a matter of Chance but a matter of Choice." -DC-
|
|||||||||
S2000magician Inner circle Yorba Linda, CA 3465 Posts |
Quote:
On 2011-01-04 21:30, R.S. wrote: Where has it been established that God must create anything? |
|||||||||
Jonathan Townsend Eternal Order Ossining, NY 27297 Posts |
Sorry, where has it been established that there must be even one "god".
Not that I'd wish to deny anyone their (hopefully) comfortable beliefs and Faith which can offer great benefits.
...to all the coins I've dropped here
|
|||||||||
Pakar Ilusi Inner circle 5777 Posts |
Even more to the point...
Where has it been established that there MUST EXIST any God or Gods?
"Dreams aren't a matter of Chance but a matter of Choice." -DC-
|
|||||||||
LobowolfXXX Inner circle La Famiglia 1196 Posts |
Pakar fell HARD off that ol' theism wagon!
"Torture doesn't work" lol
Guess they forgot to tell Bill Buckley. "...as we reason and love, we are able to hope. And hope enables us to resist those things that would enslave us." |
|||||||||
acesover Special user I believe I have 821 Posts |
Pakar,
Your questions are so shallow. There is a difference in knowing what will happen as God does, as opposed to making it happen. God does not determinie what man will do with his free will. However he sees and knows the future. I for example know that you will die. However I did not or will not make it happen. But believe me. You will die and I know it. But I will not cause it to happen. Your question why if God is so angry with it why doesn't he change? Ask yourself, why don't you change and make God happy as you have the free will to do so? I do not know that God gets angry when it happens but I do know that it definitely makes Him sad when one loses their eternal soul because of sin. So I guess it does make Him angry at the stupidity of some people when the truth is ther but they refuse to see it because it does not fit their lifestyle. They need that instant gratification so they make up any excuse to rationalize that they are correct. Let them go. Have at it. Enjoy. You are asking questions and answering them at the same time when discussing if God gets angry. Do you have any rational thoughts or do you just ramble? As I stated in the beginning of this post your questions are very shallow. It seems like you jumped into this thread in the middle somewhere and are just spouting childish rhetoric. I would just like to end by saying what I have said several times before. I am not a missionary and am not trying to convert anyone. So believe what you want and I will do the same. We are not hurting each other so I am going to leave it at that. This is just becoming annoying trying to answer questions that have been answered already. It was quite an experience but I cannot stand up to this constant badgering as can Carrie because as I said quite honestly I do not care what you believe. It is your choice to believe as you wish. I have the same choice and we have both chosen. However our choices are quite different. Decide and live your life as you see fit and I will do the same. Just got to say, Its been interesting. Hope good things for all. I am sure things will work out for you and you will be happy. I am done here but will continue to read this thread but will not post any more to it. So have at it and point out how wrong I am. It is your perogative to do so...remember you have "free will" given to you by God. As the Vulcans say...Live long and prosper.
If I were to agree with you. Then we would both be wrong. As of Apr 5, 2015 10:26 pm I have 880 posts. Used to have over 1,000
|
|||||||||
R.S. Regular user CT one day I'll have 184 Posts |
Quote:
On 2011-01-04 22:25, S2000magician wrote: Hi S2000, It hasn't. I was just responding to this: On 2011-01-04 19:50, Carrie Sue wrote: "So if you were God, you'd create robots, or nothing at all." She seems to imply that a god who does NOT create humans is somehow illogical, or that creating humans would be a priority of a god. Thus, my response. Ron
"It is error only, and not truth, that shrinks from inquiry." Thomas Paine
|
|||||||||
Carrie Sue Veteran user Auburn, MI 332 Posts |
Ron,
I am implying nothing like that. I said that was was one option for a God. There are actually four: 1. No creation at all. 2. Only good is permitted. (a robotically beneficent universe) 3. Neither good nor evil. (an amoral world; right and wrong are not even categories for consideration) 4. The universe we have. (the only one in which love is genuinely possible, because freedom is a precondition for love. Have you ever considered why we recognize that love is the supreme ethic? Where love is possible, freedom is necessary. Where freedom is real, suffering is also. This helps me understand why there is suffering in our world. It can pretty much always be traced back to the free will people have to honor God's laws or to not. Carrie |
|||||||||
Jonathan Townsend Eternal Order Ossining, NY 27297 Posts |
Carrie, maybe there are some more options.
a) There is just what you see around you b) There is a feeling or hunch about there being something more c) There is evidence beyond your own experience of something more d) There is confirmed procedure for accessing that something more e) That something more comes from one and only one 'place' f) There are confirmed procedures for accessing that place to get confirmed results Or failing to get to f we could find that b is helpful as an "as if" and go from there by social convention When we get to d - we have something to discuss in terms of "things other people can explore with you" :)
...to all the coins I've dropped here
|
|||||||||
S2000magician Inner circle Yorba Linda, CA 3465 Posts |
Quote:
On 2011-01-05 05:54, R.S. wrote: Hi, back atcha! I wouldn't have inferred that from Carrie Sue's post, but it's not a completely unreasonable inference. Personally, I don't believe that God had to create people; I think He wanted to. "Why?" you might ask? I don't know. If I remember to, I'll ask Him when I see Him. |
|||||||||
Steve_Mollett Inner circle Eh, so I've made 3006 Posts |
To quote the old lady in the film, "Cold Turkey":
"It's all a buncha b_______t!"
Author of: GARROTE ESCAPES
The absurd is the essential concept and the first truth. - Albert Camus |
|||||||||
R.S. Regular user CT one day I'll have 184 Posts |
Quote:
If I remember to, I'll ask Him when I see Him. What makes you so sure you will see him? In order for that to happen... a) There first must be a God. b) You would have had to pick the correct religion out of the many to choose from. c) Assuming a and b have been met, you would need to be judged worthy by the God of your religion (the "correct" God). The odds appear to be against you. Ron
"It is error only, and not truth, that shrinks from inquiry." Thomas Paine
|
|||||||||
S2000magician Inner circle Yorba Linda, CA 3465 Posts |
Quote:
On 2011-01-05 19:37, R.S. wrote: Call it faith. |
|||||||||
R.S. Regular user CT one day I'll have 184 Posts |
Quote:
On 2011-01-05 19:39, S2000magician wrote: Indeed. The exact same faith that muslims, mormons, hindus, etc. have that they will utlimately be united with their Gods. Ron
"It is error only, and not truth, that shrinks from inquiry." Thomas Paine
|
|||||||||
The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Not very magical, still... » » Another column to promote discussion. (0 Likes) | ||||||||||
Go to page [Previous] 1~2~3..9..15..21..27..31~32~33~34 [Next] |
[ Top of Page ] |
All content & postings Copyright © 2001-2024 Steve Brooks. All Rights Reserved. This page was created in 0.08 seconds requiring 5 database queries. |
The views and comments expressed on The Magic Café are not necessarily those of The Magic Café, Steve Brooks, or Steve Brooks Magic. > Privacy Statement < |