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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » The workers » » The Ambitious Card must include...? (6 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

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jonesc2ii
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Oxford, England
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I use a spectator's card which I control to the top with a hindu shuffle , then a tilt, a DL, and a slip.

But is this sufficient? No doubt some of you experts have all sorts of moves in yours, I would be interested to know what goes on in other members' Ambitious cards?
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Jonathan Townsend
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I guess it all depends on the presentation.
What is your take on the effect? What context to you put the 'card on top of the deck' into for your audience?

I haven't done a pure Ambitious Card since someone asked me why they should care about a dumb card that I keep putting on top of the deck. At that moment I realized that magic is NOT about being clever and getting a card to the top of the deck while people are watching for it to happen. The best I could get with that approach is resentment.

Instead I let the effect lie dormant until some better presentation came my way and made a routine that people could enjoy.
...to all the coins I've dropped here
Mago Mai
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You could have the deck spread faced up and insert the card face up in the middle of the deck.

Close the spread an do a Turn over pass while turning the deck face down.

I do this in my routine and people go wild about it...
Mago Mai
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Euan
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I'm trying to think what Malini would say..

I can't be sure but I would think he would have stopped after maybe one or two phases. The moves you use don't really matter, it's the drama you create and the mileage you get out of them that matters. If there's no drama, you have nothing.

--Euan
TheAmbitiousCard
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I use about 4 or 5 phases....

BUT... the good thing about the AC routine is that you can and should go with the flow and react to audience requests, such as...

"Hey you @#$%@#$% let me put it in face up"
and stuff like that.

My usual routine start close to Ammar's ETMCM 3 (i think) where I first learned it...

I start with a top change, or I
turn a card face up while selection is being signed. easy as pie. DL, its back on top.

Use the xxx-addition, display, thingamambob, and it's back on top again.

I then have someone put it in the middle face-up and do the turn-over addition, or bladder-control, or whatever and it's on top again.

Incidently, for that control, you must "go find" the face-up selection in the middle. Without descent patter this seems bad to me so I cover by saying "The nice thing about you putting it in face up is that you know where it is..., and you know how it got there"

I used to end with the pop-up move but now...
Since the card was put in face-up the last time, I do the Tilt with the card face-up
followed by a one-hand top palm while waving the deck. I toss the selection (now on top) on the table for misdirection as I lower the plamed card back to the deck.
So, the audience sees the card come to the top and they see it happen FACE UP!

Here's something to think about... Try coming up with a routine that does not require a Double-Lift. I think this promotes good thinking and expands your use of controls. I used to use DLs all the time but have started to use mostly controls and fewer double-lifts. Just my own preference.


And for practice, try to throw in a top change.


This is a fantastic routine to help with
o thinking on your feet
o audience management


I like what Daryl says in his video... it's kind of like playing jazz.. you know how it's going to start, you know how it's going to end but what happens in the middle is somewhat improvised.


Frank
www.theambitiouscard.com Hand Crafted Magic
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JackTheRipper
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I do agree a good routine goes with what a spectator wants. I used some phases from the AC routine in 5X5 Japan and have the card jump to my wallet a lot. If I have a huge crowd I use 3 signed cards and have them switch places, and do multi jumping to the top phases. I try not to make the routine into 'overkill'.

Lee
jonesc2ii
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Hmm. I'm not sure it's wise to pander to the audience too much. I was doing something recently and the spectator was as awkward as they come 'but I don't want to place the card there, I want to put it here' (somewhere in the bottom stock). OK you can deal with that kind of situation with an out, but it just wrecks your performance. Why a spectator would want to ruin your performance I don't know, but it happens. So you can go with it and change your plans, or you can be insistent (without being harsh) and get them to play along with the ruse you had planned.

Besides, what happens when the spectator says he wants you to make the card vanish from the deck and reappear inside the window of a passing car ?! Smile Smile
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KJfan
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Buy Daryl Ambitious card video.
His gimmick is also awesome.
marko
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Your routine sounds fine as it is for now, Jonesc2ii. It will evolve with time. I like to keep my Ambitious Card somewhat brief. The phases I use (three in total) are standard stuff (DL, Tilt), but the difficult part is coming up with good motivation to make the audience care why the card is coming to the top in the first place. Because of that, I'd recommend concentrating more on your presentation than the moves.
Thought: Why does man kill? He kills for food. And not only food: frequently there must be a beverage.
ggarcia
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Frank Starsini, I also do a version with the card face up 2nd from the top and then wave the deck while doing a one handed top palm. I get in position by placing the card face up in the middle of the deck and doing a top card cover pass. I like your idea of tossing the card to the table while re-adding the palmed card back on the deck. I was just doing a color change showing the card sank back down into the deck and then doing a pass and spreading the deck to proving it was back in the middle. Too much work. Do you mind if I use your idea.
jonesc2ii
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Quote:
On 2003-07-22 18:03, marko wrote:
Your routine sounds fine as it is for now, Jonesc2ii. It will evolve with time. I like to keep my Ambitious Card somewhat brief. The phases I use (three in total) are standard stuff (DL, Tilt), but the difficult part is coming up with good motivation to make the audience care why the card is coming to the top in the first place. Because of that, I'd recommend concentrating more on your presentation than the moves.


Yes, I introduce it by saying 'Most people don't realise but every deck has what we in the trade call an 'ambitious card', evidently in this particular deck it's the [seven of spades]'...etc...finishing with a slip allows me to just throw half the deck on top of the ambitious card and put the deck aside moving on to something else with a nonchalant shrug (and raise one eye-brow). Much later in my act I actually have the ambitious card yell 'Get me outta here' in a strange, strained, muted, 'thrown' voice. Hmm. Maybe that bit is hard to explain without seeing it! Smile
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Lonewolf123
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Mine begins with flip flip plot by Paul Harris, followed by a d. lift and and Erdnase color change to bring it to the top. This is followed by placing the top indifferent card to centre and voila...it comes back to the top...then turnover pass to bring to the top. This is then followed by the Blaine method of placing the actual card in the centre slightly outjogged and adding 2 cards onto it. By turning the deck over to show that the centre outjogged card is the real card, I turn and place one indifferent card to the other half...it ends with me doing a fast bottom deal. The Marlo tilt move is not effective and my close friends have actually caught on me placing them 2nd from the top...it's true...they know something is going on in the tilt...
Glenn Godsey
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Quote:
On 2003-07-22 22:46, Lonewolf123 wrote:
the Blaine method of placing the actual card in the centre slightly outjogged and adding 2 cards onto it. By turning the deck over to show that the centre outjogged card is the real card, I turn and place one indifferent card to the other half...it ends with me doing a fast bottom deal. The Marlo tilt move is not effective and my close friends have actually caught on me placing them 2nd from the top...it's true...they know something is going on in the tilt...

No offense intended, but we were doing the "Blaine method" before he was born. I'm not sure who gets the credit, but certainly not Blaine.

The Marlo "Tilt" or the Vernon "Depth Illusion" is extremely deceptive if done well and it will fool the most observant audience.

Best regards,
Glenn Godsey
ChrisMagic52
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I do the full routine Daryl teaches on his dvd plus Ultimate Ambition gimmick to end the routine. That always gets good reactions.
LeConte
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I posted an AC routine that only used one DL(to set-up the pop-up finish) in the secret sessions where I thought It was more appropriate since it involved discussing sleights like this thread does. No one seemed to notice it(maybe it sucked). Perhaps given that we seemingly can now discuss whatever we want outside the secret session room in threads like this, I should have posted it here in this forum where it would have been read by a much wider audience as I really needed some feedback on it....
Drive Carefully
bakerkn
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Quote:
On 2003-07-23 01:23, Glenn Godsey wrote:
Quote:
On 2003-07-22 22:46, Lonewolf123 wrote:
... the Blaine method of placing the actual card in the centre slightly outjogged and adding 2 cards onto it.


No offense intended, but we were doing the "Blaine method" before he was born. I'm not sure who gets the credit, but certainly not Blaine.

Glenn Godsey


Wesley James.
Paul
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Quote:
On 2003-07-22 16:39, Euan wrote:
I'm trying to think what Malini would say..

I can't be sure but I would think he would have stopped after maybe one or two phases. The moves you use don't really matter, it's the drama you create and the mileage you get out of them that matters. If there's no drama, you have nothing.

--Euan


I agree, the moves don't matter, the spectator never sees them anyway. Ask yourself what are you trying to prove and who are you trying to please.If what you've got works for you, that's all you need.

Paul.
Dorian Rhodell
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You know it's kind of funny but whenever someone posts about the AC routine, everyone else posts back about the various different ways to get the card to the top. It seems like everyone has a version or a handling, many people write, talk, and post about it, and it is still a trick with no definitive ending. I was talking on the phone with Uncle Paul (as he is sometimes reffered to) and he pointed out to me that each time the card is re-inserted into the deck, the conditions become more stringent. Even if the deck is tied up with a forklift on top and inserted into a steel press, in a vacuum chamber no less, the bent card still comes to the top. Theatrically, I am inclined to say that this trick has no ending. So maybe so much of this energy and time coming up with clever ways to control the card could be better spent if we brainstormed and gave this classic of magic a killer and definitive ending.

What do you guys think?

Take care,

Dorian Rhodell
MacGyver
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Well, the only ending I can think of would involve vanishing the deck sans card so that it couldn't be put into the middle, it would always be on top.

I usually do this when I want to covert my AC routine into card to pocket routine, ending with the deck in my pocket.

Some purist don't like the AC because there is no point, but that is ignoring the simple child-like magic value of a card impossibly going where you want it to.

One of the properties that most think of when they think of magicians is how do they control cards so even when you put it in the center it can be on the top, or how we know what cards are without seeing them.

The AC is the climax of card control in the laymens eyes, because its not just finding a card while shuffling, its actually watching the card goto the center and appear on top.
Dorian Rhodell
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Hey MacGyver,

From your post, I'm a little confused about the last three statements you posted.

1) I don't understand what being a purist has to do with an effect that has no point (I assume you mean theatrically speaking).

2) I thought lay people aren't suppose to know magicians "control" cards. Lay people might wonder how we do things in general, but for some reason I doubt they lose sleep at night wondering how magicians control cards to accomplish an effect.

3) Isn't the whole idea behind an AC routine the impossibility of the card rising to the top as you stated in your post? So how can this be the climax of card control when apparently no control ever took place?

I do agree with your statement regarding there being a "simple child-like magic value" in the routine. That's what makes the routine so great.

Best,

Dorian Rhodell
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