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Mindpro Eternal Order 10587 Posts |
"The best response I got was that it could work as advertising for a live show."
I don't by for a minute that the majority of those that are all enthralled with street hypnosis trend have any kind of a live stage show. The fact is they migrate to street hypnosis because it's quick and easy, and do not have to sustain all of the learning, writing, creating, testing, production, blocking and many other elements that go into a live stage show. They'd actually have to become hypnotists. |
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quicknotist Special user 888 Posts |
Dmkraig,
I know the question wasn't aimed at me but I feel compelled to answer. When I first did "impromptu" hypnosis, the only other people I saw doing similar was Sean Michael Andrews and Brian David Phillips and it never occurred to me there would be so many people now running around doing it for free. Apart from one or two people, a bit of pre-show publicity around venues and some TV and Radio, oh and my friend's kids' bunny rabbit(!) I haven't done any for free for over three years. I make money out of it by simply offering a roving performance as an alternative to a stage show. I've also picked up lots of stage performances in "unusual" conditions which other hypnotists have turned down using a variety of excuses. Rather than be resented by (what would usually be) the competition, we happily co-exist as they (some of who have trained with me) happily admit that although they probably could do what I do, they still prefer not to cut their shows short or perform for so few people, under such "difficult" conditions. As a consequence, I travel lighter, work for less time, more often and probably charge more than they would. My agent is able to promote me for everything from private dinner parties to corporate brand promotions and enjoys the positive feedback. It is also very rare for me to perform without picking up a client or two for my hypnotherapy practice, but as well as my agent restricting distribution of my direct contact details and rightly so, I'm probably too comfortable, complacent and lazy too push this as much as I could. Then, of course there's the training and mentoring - but it's not really that big an earner for me. And not just, as you might think, people looking for a cool party trick or even wannabe mentalists/hypnotists, but some very serious businesspeople, one or two mainstream entertainers (in other fields) and even a politician. Anyone who knows me or my training will tell you I take safety and ethics very seriously, to the point of paranoia. I really do think I'm only beginning to scratch the surface of possible sources of income with this and maybe if I have a quieter year this year, I'll be forced to creatively and imaginatively look into it further. |
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Dannydoyle Eternal Order 21219 Posts |
Quote:
On 2011-01-18 11:44, Zerububle wrote: This is nonsense. There can be no debate till people like Bobser stop throwing out name calling and arrogance and simply HAVE a debate. He runs into something he can't understand (which happens quickly I might add) then it is name calling and there ya go. With his attitude in general I have a hard time imagining him doing therapy at all! Oh now lets see the difference in what you define street hypnosis. First LARGE difference is CONCENTING individuals. It is not understood because BOBSER keeps telling us different. Then you jump in and defend him out of loyalty to street hypnosis. So how are YOU to be taken seriously? We tarnish everyone with the same brush precicely because you guys all stick together no matter what as soon as Streey Hypnosis is mentioned. Tell Bobser he is full of crap, call him out for name calling, act like you don't agree with the BS that is being spread. OTHERWISE WE ALL AGREE! It is the outrageous claims, the "well it is POSSIBLE". Yea "possible in that 3% is "possible". Come on. You guys also need to accept the fact that guys who have been out there for decades may indeed know things as well. We might not all be fools and probably understand things pretty well. Ant offers 0 new, just a different hula skirt on the same dancer. Oh and I hope I don't have to keep saying I do not throw Quicknotist into the same mix.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus <BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell |
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Mindpro Eternal Order 10587 Posts |
Well explained, but I suspect you are the exception to the rule. I would think very few others have a bigger profit-producing picture, agency representation, a hypnotherapy practice and so on. I also believe the only reason you have all of this is because you took the time to obtain training and learn and understand hypnosis. A few others may have too, but I not not believe this is the norm.
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bobser Inner circle 4178 Posts |
Remember this Danny?
Quote:
On 2011-01-15 11:11, Dannydoyle wrote: That's not just evidence Danny. that's' actual PROOF that this thread was actually doing ok before you posted the above insults. Now I did in my last post suggest we stop and indeed offered the hand of friendship. But it looks like you've rejected that. Fair enough, we both know where we stand. However the thing you need to learn is that you cannot continue making robust statements without getting robust replies. Nobody in here is scared of you. You simply cannot stop the cut and thrust of debate by bullying people. And you Danny are a bully. I've been watching you bully people on here for a couple years now. Their either too new or too clever or too cock sure or too opinionated. You're a bully mate. And I never could stand bullies. You even do what bullies do when they're up against it like making silly statements such as " I don't include quicknotist in this" as if he's daft enough to roll over getting a big up from you. That was truly embarrassing. Now listen, I want you to stop going over my old posts and re posting them. It doesn't make any sense and it's boring. And it's not very clever. Let me give you an example: earlier in this thread James posted a clip linked to something in your past which could be viewed as potentially ***ing. Although it was true he made a genuine error as he meant to post it to you in a PM. Yes I'm sure the guy who posted that clip was a nutter and a liar, but incase you didn't notice nobody, including me, jumped on that bandwagon in order to give you a hard time. Not one person even mentioned it. That's how ADULTS react. But if that were you, some poor b-st-rd would have got hung out to dry. So lets stop all this sh-t now. In closing the main reason why you and people like you have no place in real hypnosis is this: It's not so much that your standard of hypnosis is lacking, but rather the standard of your investigation into what could be a beautiful art is totally bankrupt. You don't know and you don't want to know. And to anybody who steps forward with an idea you use your bullying tactics. The hypnotic world doesn't need any more Big chiefs sitting round a fire exaggerating stories of days gone by. it's looking for braves. And you, by definition are not one of them. Neither am I. They're all out there, better than you and me put together. I can live with that but for you it's anathema. So you're a stage hypnotist in Branson. Waaaaay! Go t-ss yourself off on it.
Bob Burns is the creator of The Swan.
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mindpunisher Inner circle 6132 Posts |
James
>>>> Sadly there is no debate. Until certain individuals can see past their belief that street hypnosis (as defined as aggressive egotistical attacks on passing innocents) is different to street hypnosis (as defined as impromptu performances of hypnotic suggestion carried out with concenting individuals for the purpose of growth, personal and business) we are unlikely to make any headway <<<<< You could argue thast Ant is one of the main promoters of street hypnosis. He is certainly one of the most active. If you watch the MA dvds you will hear him say that in certain cases to drop any pre-talk and go straight in for a rapid induction..He also advises that if someone shows concern over what they will be made to do - lie to them telling them they will have the most amazing experience of their lives and won't be made to to do anything silly. He advises you to say this even if you do have something silly planned and then just go ahead and do it anyway. How can street hypnotist not be defined in any other way than as aggressive egotistical attacks on passing innocents. So you are telling me I should seek therapy or business advice from someone approaching strangers in the street? Someone that doesn't even charge for their services? someone that has no insurance and could be potentially breaking the law?That's got to be one of the funniest things I've ever heard. Perhaps doctors and lawyers should take to the streets and offer advice and treat unsuspecting strangers for free. Perhaps psychiatric nurses should adminster medication or injections to complete strangers on the street for free? Perhaps they should sneak up on them, distract them and inject them before they realise whats happening? Perhaps you could create a new branch of psychiatric medicine? Im curious if you or the other street angels even know about safety guidlines for public demonstrations of hypnosis? If you do you completely disregard them. Stage is just a context as is the street. There are bad stage hypnotsists. However by definition street hypnotists show very little regard for health and safety or depth of knowledge of the "art". Show me on video just one that does. As for ethics or abuse the guidlines were created by a panel of experts by the home office to prevent "abuse" after much research. You think because you believe you are creating a "new" art you don't have to abide by them? Street is a watered down ***ised form of what usually takes place on a stage. You're even using the same skits and usually the ones that are well worn and not used much these days. Of course if you want to debate that go ahead... >>>>earlier in this thread James posted a clip linked to something in your past which could be viewed as potentially ***ing. Although it was true he made a genuine error as he meant to post it to you in a PM. Yes <<<<<< Error my backside. This is a well worn tactic deployed through desparation on here... Ant has tried it a few times and failed miserably with myself. It obviously never worked this time either. |
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Dannydoyle Eternal Order 21219 Posts |
Bobser how is my asking you to back up your claims being somehow insulting? Unless you can't do the things you say you can then it may indeed be.
As for the link to rip off report, pile on. It was obviously done by a child so whatever. I am a bully because I simply ask you to provide proof of what it is you say? How is that a bully? Seems to me that if you can't back up your bs then you should not spout it. Yep take a stance like "I never liked a bully" and make yourself feel all warm and fuzzy, and then you can concentrate less on how much it sucks to be caught out for your bs. Bobser, let me just say I am out there doing shows for a paying audience. 6 nights a week. Not walking up to an unsuspecting person and hoping that they are in the 3% who it might work on. The ONLY one here who has exaggerated a story seems to be you! But I agree we don't need that going on. You claim that we have no place in "real hypnosis"? I agree if you define that as ambushing unsuspecting people at a pub or coffee shop and hoping they are the 3% who are going to fall for it. Yep if that is "real hypnosis" then count me out. I wilL NEVER understand that "art" as you so laughingly put it. You claim I am a bully, but who is the one always calling names and winding people up? I simply come from a part of the world where if you run your big mouth you get asked to back it up. If you walk up and try to do this nonsense on us we would probably punch you in the face for it. So I ask you to clarify, to back up your claims so the confussion is gone. You get arrogant, and mean and call names and then just go over the deep end. Grow up. You act like a child before puberty who has been chastised. Just slow down, take a breath and realise that much of what you "believe" is just that, a BELIEF. So again if you will grow up and answer questions when asked, and not spout fantasy land nonsense you can't back up then we are ok. Yep I am a bully, but you do the name calling. (Project much?) You try to bully people into silence with your arrogance and name calling when all I wanted was you to do what it is you say you can do. Why is that so tough? This is why I seriously think you guys need your own forum here. Not because there is no validity to what you are doing. I never have said that. I am saying that when people are talking about stage hypnosis and you chime in with this stuff it does not make sense and ends up being very confusing. You are drawing the Jedi Mind Trick crowd that this forum is not dedicated to. Again, I am not saying what you do holds no validity. Not by a longshot. YOU are not really so accepting of other opinions where the meat meets the bone. You get all huffy and upset at the slightest hint that street hypnosis may not be as cool as you think. I REALLY think you guys need a forum of your own, much like the street magic guys have. Would make things easier.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus <BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell |
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Zerububle Elite user Poole 430 Posts |
F'in 'ell MP. Bit to far with that last post. Your not really a very nice person at all it would seem. Have a read back through this and many other topics and you will note that MP and Danny consistently attack other users.
I am happy to retire from this one leaving you both to pat yourselves vigorously on the back or something similar. |
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bobser Inner circle 4178 Posts |
Quote:
On 2011-01-18 22:32, Dannydoyle wrote: And there lies the problem. I'm going to let you into a little secret Danny. This IS our forum! Not yours. But you're not tied. You've asked 12 or so times in this thread for me to 'prove it'. I don't remember anyone ever having the audacity to ask anyone else in here to 'prove it' in the several years I've been here. It's both bad manners and silly. You know I can't PROVE anything as I know YOU can't. If I give you a youtube clip you'll claim it's set up. The next thing you ask me to fly to America and show you. Silly.
Bob Burns is the creator of The Swan.
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Dannydoyle Eternal Order 21219 Posts |
Bobser I can back up EVERYTHING I claim I do. I would have not claimed anything you put up was a set up, but still you choose not to put things up. You speak in platitudes, you speak in generalities and nonsense and get angry and petulant when you get called on it. I have asked many people to show examples of what they are talking about. Sure, why not?
At first it was quest to learn. I was genuinely curious about what it is you claim you can do! I asked MANY times in another thread, and in an extreamly polite manner and respectful manner what it was you do. Do you remember this or do I have to show you? I was looking to be educated and you chose to be evasive, non responsive and cryptic. So we arrive at the show me portion of our show. You seem to be the keeper of who and who is not a "real hypnotist". You act arrogant and superior and the keeper of a greater knowledge and right where the rubber meets the road you can do it maybe 3% of the time. WOW that is cool. Then you try to act as if this is some great revelation. The sad part about the whole thing is exactly what Richard pointed out. I said that the percentage was extreamly low to start off with. You said no and started to flame me. So once you started the flames, yea put up or shut up is a pretty easy way to prove you are full of it and acting like a child. But to take new people down the road of looking for that elusive 3% (which in reality is probably a LOT lower.) is crazy. To act as if that 3% is the norm is even crazier. Why not stop talking in platitudes, why not stop flaming people and just talk in reality for a thread or two? See how that works out? See you guys complain about flames this and name calling that and look at Jims last post. It always ends with a flame throw of some sort. Why is it you guys all seem to do that? You can't help yourselves, then you cry and whine when someone flames you. What do you expect?
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus <BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell |
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mindpunisher Inner circle 6132 Posts |
Quote:
On 2011-01-19 02:32, Zerububle wrote: Which part isn't nice? Where have I attacked you or anyone? I think the comparisons of other professions are quite valid. And any references made about MA are factual. You can find them on the Dvds. At least I don't "attack" the public. Or "Bosh" them, or hack into their heads, or turn them into "hypnochimps" by lying to them for my own amusement. You think that is nice? |
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Zerububle Elite user Poole 430 Posts |
Are you saying that I do?
If you are then that's slanderous. If not, then why to you insist on telling me repeatedly. Buggerit! Hooked back in again. Dang you MP |
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mindpunisher Inner circle 6132 Posts |
There are no attacks on anyone james just factual references. Are you telling me that they are acceptable? Do you ever take part in these group "attacks"? Bosh a few punters, create a few hypnochimps in between the personal and business advising? Do you agree or condone it?
Simple question. |
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dmkraig Inner circle 1949 Posts |
Quote:
On 2011-01-19 10:35, Zerububle wrote: Uh, actually it would be libelous. Slander has to do with speech. Libel has to do with writing. |
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dmkraig Inner circle 1949 Posts |
Quote:
On 2011-01-18 13:55, quicknotist wrote: First, I'd like to thank you VERY much for your comment. I appreciate it. I like your idea of doing this as an alternative show. However, from your description, I would respectfully say that what you're doing is not what most people would consider impromptu hypnosis. It sounds like you would be at an event and doing your act within the confines of that event. This is markedly different from what most people would consider impromptu hypnosis: walking down the street and quickly hypnotizing some stranger. From your description, I would say you have either invented or are one of the early promoters of a new style of entertainment hypnosis, and I compliment you on your original thinking and approach. Quote:
It is also very rare for me to perform without picking up a client or two for my hypnotherapy practice, but as well as my agent restricting distribution of my direct contact details and rightly so, I'm probably too comfortable, complacent and lazy too push this as much as I could. I think this is very common for those who do hypnotherapy as well as entertainment. Quote:
I really do think I'm only beginning to scratch the surface of possible sources of income with this and maybe if I have a quieter year this year, I'll be forced to creatively and imaginatively look into it further. Form your description I think you are on to a good thing. It is a different approach to entertainment hypnosis. Frankly, from what I've seen, I think many performers are satisfied to stay with what worked in the past and not move toward anything new--as well as being afraid they might not succeed. Thanks again for your insight. I may have to consider offering this, too. |
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Maserati New user 92 Posts |
[/quote]
Uh, actually it would be libelous. Slander has to do with speech. Libel has to do with writing. [/quote] HA you just quoted Spiderman!! |
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Zerububle Elite user Poole 430 Posts |
Quote:
On 2011-01-19 12:09, dmkraig wrote: Note I start with 'are you SAYING that' which is why I used slander rather than liable. I realise he wrote it but as this is just a forum it didn't seem to matter. MP - while I agree that jumping out on people etc is not very nice or indeed productive I can easily comprehend different approaches and reasonings for impromptu street hypnosis... Only an idiot would fail to |
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Dannydoyle Eternal Order 21219 Posts |
Quote:
On 2011-01-19 12:23, nikstokes wrote: Uh, actually it would be libelous. Slander has to do with speech. Libel has to do with writing. [/quote] HA you just quoted Spiderman!! [/quote] Actually he quoted J. Jonah Jameson, but why quibble?
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus <BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell |
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quicknotist Special user 888 Posts |
Quote:
I may have to consider offering this, too. You should. If nothing else it creates a point of difference - even if you just end up negotiating a stage show where the client might not have considered one at first. That's just one of the things that makes it a workable business model. I'm happy you finally got a decent answer to your question. |
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Dannydoyle Eternal Order 21219 Posts |
Quicknotist is talking about opening new markets. Always a good thing. (This incidently is why I have never lumped him in with the ambush hypnotists.)
I personally would not feel comfortable doing things in that fashion. My show is what it is and I have more work than I know what to do with. But if I was starting or looking to expand it could make for an interesting evening. I have to say I did a show in Branson when we first opened when we had 12 people in the audience. I refused to cancel shows and get that reputation so we did a very informal, sort of deal exactly like what he is talking about. It DID create a whole lot of facination to be certain. But also it was not "ambush hypnosis" either. It is that middle ground he speaks of.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus <BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell |
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