The Magic Café
Username:
Password:
[ Lost Password ]
  [ Forgot Username ]
The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Ever so sleightly » » Appeal of the Chop Cup (0 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

 Go to page [Previous]  1~2~3~4~5~6 [Next]
Dr. Magic
View Profile
Veteran user
355 Posts

Profile of Dr. Magic
What an incredible story. My wife cam in the room and asked what I was laughing at. Mr. Palmer, thanks for taking the time to share it with us.
bishthemagish
View Profile
Inner circle
6036 Posts

Profile of bishthemagish
And just where did the Billy McComb half dyed hank routine come from? I remember listening to the Ken Brooke audio tape and the answer might surprise some. Don't get me wrong I liked Billy McComb, and have great respect for Billy McComb and Don Alan.

My dads act was ripped off by many magicians over the years word for word. A lot of my stuff has been pinched. Jack Gwynne's stuff was pinched by dealers.

It seems that if the magicians is out there performing - they get copied. Some say Don Alan was the most copied magician of his generation.

Just a few thoughts and opinion.
Glenn Bishop Cardician

Producer of the DVD Punch Deal Pro

Publisher of Glenn Bishop's Ace Cutting And Block Transfer Triumphs
Andrew Zuber
View Profile
Inner circle
Los Angeles, CA
2662 Posts

Profile of Andrew Zuber
I'd heard that about Don Alan before. Interesting stuff...

Looks like more people need to write these things down then. I'd like to go on record right now as saying I invented Triumph in 1998.

That settles that.
"I'm sorry - if you were right, I would agree with you." -Robin Williams, Awakenings
cupsandballsmagic
View Profile
Inner circle
2706 Posts

Profile of cupsandballsmagic
Quote:
On 2011-02-13 12:22, bishthemagish wrote:
And just where did the Billy McComb half dyed hank routine come from? I remember listening to the Ken Brooke audio tape and the answer might surprise some. Don't get me wrong I liked Billy McComb, and have great respect for Billy McComb and Don Alan.

My dads act was ripped off by many magicians over the years word for word. A lot of my stuff has been pinched. Jack Gwynne's stuff was pinched by dealers.

It seems that if the magicians is out there performing - they get copied. Some say Don Alan was the most copied magician of his generation.

Just a few thoughts and opinion.


Sadly Bish, that seems to be the way magicians are, and there are people right here in this very forum who will take your work, work out a deal with and then steal it from under you nose without so much as giving you a mention, and they are thought of so highly too. No, I am not talking about anybody posting to this thread, just a low life with morals lower than a snakes belly, in fact I shouldn't say that, it's insulting to snakes, they are pretty nice creatures.
Andrew Zuber
View Profile
Inner circle
Los Angeles, CA
2662 Posts

Profile of Andrew Zuber
Sadly that's the risk in sharing ideas or performing publicly. It's amazing that some people will steal the work of others like that. Stealing a wallet is one thing - you keep it a secret and don't tell anyone you took it. You just spend the money. Stealing a performance, however, is the lowest of the low. Not only do you take it, but you proceed to go on stage and display it in front of people. It's like walking up to a group of strangers, pulling out the stolen wallet, and proclaiming that it's yours. And to make matters worse, those strangers might even be paying you to see a wallet which you shouldn't have to begin with. Pretty gutsy if you ask me.

And for the record, I didn't ACTUALLY invent Triumph in 1998.
It was '96.
"I'm sorry - if you were right, I would agree with you." -Robin Williams, Awakenings
cupsandballsmagic
View Profile
Inner circle
2706 Posts

Profile of cupsandballsmagic
Quote:
On 2011-02-13 13:24, Andrewzuber wrote:
And for the record, I didn't ACTUALLY invent Triumph in 1998.
It was '96.


That's the last time I perform my card stuff in front of you! Smile Smile Smile
Bill Palmer
View Profile
Eternal Order
Only Jonathan Townsend has more than
24279 Posts

Profile of Bill Palmer
Quote:
On 2011-02-13 12:22, bishthemagish wrote:
And just where did the Billy McComb half dyed hank routine come from? I remember listening to the Ken Brooke audio tape and the answer might surprise some. Don't get me wrong I liked Billy McComb, and have great respect for Billy McComb and Don Alan.

My dads act was ripped off by many magicians over the years word for word. A lot of my stuff has been pinched. Jack Gwynne's stuff was pinched by dealers.

It seems that if the magicians is out there performing - they get copied. Some say Don Alan was the most copied magician of his generation.

Just a few thoughts and opinion.


Read Billy's book, and you will know EXACTLY where it came from -- 25 Years the Wiser.

The difference between Billy and Don was that when Billy used material that came from someone else, he let you know. Don believed that once he did a trick, it was HIS and nobody else had the right to use it.
"The Swatter"

Founder of CODBAMMC

My Chickasaw name is "Throws Money at Cups."

www.cupsandballsmuseum.com
Andrew Zuber
View Profile
Inner circle
Los Angeles, CA
2662 Posts

Profile of Andrew Zuber
The more I read about it, the less appealing Don Alan seems to me.
"I'm sorry - if you were right, I would agree with you." -Robin Williams, Awakenings
cupsandballsmagic
View Profile
Inner circle
2706 Posts

Profile of cupsandballsmagic
Quote:
Read Billy's book, and you will know EXACTLY where it came from -- 25 Years the Wiser.



There's a few hidden gems in that book (I have never been able to find the fishing reels he mentions though...)
bishthemagish
View Profile
Inner circle
6036 Posts

Profile of bishthemagish
Quote:
On 2011-02-13 14:42, Bill Palmer wrote:
Read Billy's book, and you will know EXACTLY where it came from -- 25 Years the Wiser.

The difference between Billy and Don was that when Billy used material that came from someone else, he let you know. Don believed that once he did a trick, it was HIS and nobody else had the right to use it.

I have read it - Listen to the Ken Brooke audio tape and I think it tells a different story.

Cheers!
Glenn Bishop Cardician

Producer of the DVD Punch Deal Pro

Publisher of Glenn Bishop's Ace Cutting And Block Transfer Triumphs
Pete Biro
View Profile
1933 - 2018
18558 Posts

Profile of Pete Biro
I won't bother looking it up, but trust me. I did a variant of the half-dyed silk waaaaaaaaaaaaaaay before I heard of Billy's version IT IS IN THE ENCYCLOPEDIA OF SILK MAGIC, credited to Loyd Enochs. I still have the special dye tube Enochs sold with it. Then took it out and revived the routine when McComb published his version. Dyed my own silks, and on one trip to Japan found a silk merchant with solid red, solid white and half red/white and bought a dozen sets. When McComb lost his I gave him a couple of these sets.

I don't recall the Ken Brooke tape (I have it somewhere) but I recall sucker silk being a Frank Lane idea. Ken and Pat Page had great routines with it.
STAY TOONED... @ www.pete-biro.com
cupsandballsmagic
View Profile
Inner circle
2706 Posts

Profile of cupsandballsmagic
I have the Ken Brooke version, the tubes are really small but they work beautifully.
Pete Biro
View Profile
1933 - 2018
18558 Posts

Profile of Pete Biro
Is it half dyed or just the sucker silk version?
STAY TOONED... @ www.pete-biro.com
The Burnaby Kid
View Profile
Inner circle
St. John's, Canada
3139 Posts

Profile of The Burnaby Kid
Quote:
On 2011-02-13 14:56, Andrewzuber wrote:
The more I read about it, the less appealing Don Alan seems to me.


There are a great many magicians whom will disappoint you when you learn more about what they're like in real life. It can be really frustrating. It doesn't get much better if you know them in real life, and they're sweethearts, and their magic stinks.

Just focus on their roles in magic. Bill's analysis of Alan being a stylist is insightful. There's a lot to be learned in studying him through that filter.
JACK, the Jolly Almanac of Card Knavery, a free card magic resource for beginners.
cupsandballsmagic
View Profile
Inner circle
2706 Posts

Profile of cupsandballsmagic
Sucker Silk Pete.
Andrew Zuber
View Profile
Inner circle
Los Angeles, CA
2662 Posts

Profile of Andrew Zuber
I hear you, Andrew. Pete Biro is a nightmare to be around. Smile

In all seriousness, I've been lucky to meet some very impressive, VERY friendly people in magic (including Pete.) It's one of the things I like about this that bugs me about working comedy clubs. A lot of the comics I've met (and usually the NOT so famous ones) are horrible, obnoxious people to be around. On the other hand, you'll be hard pressed to find a friendlier place in town than Dean Dill's shop on a Wednesday afternoon.

That's why I've decided to work on being a horrible, obnoxious magician. Not just passive aggressive, but flat out mean. I think it'll suit me well.
"I'm sorry - if you were right, I would agree with you." -Robin Williams, Awakenings
inhumaninferno
View Profile
Elite user
452 Posts

Profile of inhumaninferno
This thread has morphed into something else...

Regarding "...pinching other's material and calling it your own", there are two operative phrases at work. "Calling it your own" is a lie. "Pinching other's material" is theft. If I rightly purchase a publication of the routine or am taught the routine by the originator, then I have a right to do it-no theft there. "Calling it my own" is still a lie. The lay audience does not care about either of these...they just want to have fun.

As previously mentioned, if you continue to do someone else's routine (that you have rightly acquired) without replacing anything that is "you" then you are doing a disservice to yourself and to the art.

A tribute is a different story. Both Frank Everhart, Jr. and myself here in Key West present "Sam, The Bellhop" pretty much as taught to us by Sr. and present it as a tribute. Though Sr. made "Sam" famous and his name was on it even when the effect was marketed...Sr. was the first to admit he did not invent it. Sr. bought it-for a drink-yet, he made it his own and gained fame within the world of magic for that effect.

Staying on topic, I stand by my likes for presenting the chop cup and bowl routine as previously mentioned.
bishthemagish
View Profile
Inner circle
6036 Posts

Profile of bishthemagish
If I remember right - the Ken Brooke audio tape talked about the trick - I think it was called Circus silk - or something like that.

When I started doing close up my closer was the chop cup. Then I added the cups and balls and the cups and balls became my closer - and I started doing chop cup with a dice cup. And the dice cup became my opening trick and it has been this way for about thirty years.

Cheers!
Glenn Bishop Cardician

Producer of the DVD Punch Deal Pro

Publisher of Glenn Bishop's Ace Cutting And Block Transfer Triumphs
Pete Biro
View Profile
1933 - 2018
18558 Posts

Profile of Pete Biro
The Northern accent may have sounded like "CIRCUS" but what Ken did was "SUCKER SILK". Bish, your PM is not "ON" can you PM me with who Ken mentioned as the creator? I can't find my audio tapes.
STAY TOONED... @ www.pete-biro.com
Andrew Zuber
View Profile
Inner circle
Los Angeles, CA
2662 Posts

Profile of Andrew Zuber
Glenn - that's exactly the info I was looking for (in terms of doing a chop cup and a cups and balls routine in the same set.) Cheers!
"I'm sorry - if you were right, I would agree with you." -Robin Williams, Awakenings
The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Ever so sleightly » » Appeal of the Chop Cup (0 Likes)
 Go to page [Previous]  1~2~3~4~5~6 [Next]
[ Top of Page ]
All content & postings Copyright © 2001-2021 Steve Brooks. All Rights Reserved.
This page was created in 0.2 seconds requiring 5 database queries.
The views and comments expressed on The Magic Café
are not necessarily those of The Magic Café, Steve Brooks, or Steve Brooks Magic.
> Privacy Statement <

ROTFL Billions and billions served! ROTFL