Thanks Wanlu,

Soon videos will be available for wiewing on youtube, I'm still working on my “V’s” while typing

The analogy towards Pro Vents not needing multiple movements is not entirely correct. It takes multiple mechanical movements to "animate" a Hard figure. Whether they are "needed" is up to the individual performer and his/her act. John Pizzi uses movements extensively to animate "Andy" throughout the show. Always has. Nowadays most Vents with soft figures gyrate the body in ways that a hard figure cannot, and also have created a movement not built into the puppet. The annoying moving "left Arm"(hmm..that's a movement). Jeff has multiple movements on Daddy D. Have you ever seen "Peanut" just stand still throughout a show? "Achmed" has multiple movements. Ken Groves has multiple movements on his main character C.W., and uses them throughout the show. Dan Horn's act would be mush if he didn't animate "Orson" with multiple movements of his body, including eyebrows. Many of his laughs come just from these movements. As Wanlu said, "What works for you works for you!"

Thanks Duane,

It’s just what I wanted to say.

Keep up the good typing

Buzz

What was said about the soft figures is true, but the original post was about multiple mechanical animations in hard figures. "Animating" a soft figure, or "animating" a hard figure even, is different than talking about "mechanical animations".
But if we want to list people people who use a lot of mechanical animations, often, as opposed to those who use a few, I think you are going to come up with a shorter list, starting with one who was mentioned, Jeff D. - and what hard figure is he most known for? And how many mechanical animations does that figure have?

Guys - I sitll say that "having the animations" doesn't mean that you have or need to use them all the time (or at all, for that matter). Animations certainly cost a lot of money to add to the relatively high cost of most figures from the better figure makers. I would love to have had a few more animations on three of my hard figure vent family but, alas, they were not born with them and I am just happy they can do what they can. The senior member of my family, "Grampa B", has the additional upper lip sneer and I'm glad he does, He also cost a wee bit more than the other guys but since that particular animation fits Grampa to a tee, in certain situations in the routine/script I am writing/developing for him, I am happy he can do it. I'd LIKE to have had wiggling ears on two of my other figures and would also have been able to use the upper lip sneer on them as well. Sometimes the very nature of the figure doesn't allow the creator to add certain movements and I can understand that and why. Still, I contend that having those animations could be useful at times. It's kinda like a secretary who can type 100 WPM. She can use that "ability" (animation) in an office setting but would rarely use it when out in public. HOWEVER, should she be doing a comic routine on stage in an office setting, she might certainly be able to use that ability to enhance her routine. IMHO:o)

You go Buzz!!! Your enthusiasm is appreciated by all and you have our support! Get figures with as many animations as you want and can afford. Use them when YOU want, not when WE would, if we could. Just be aware that matering all those control levers will be very challenging. Again, IMHO:o)

So, I finally got a ventriloquist that understands me and is on my side; someone that has the facts and can answer questions with the knowledge of an experienced artist; and what do you do, post a message that has good points, and pertains to the thread with comments that make sense.

So you want to know how I am going to address your points?????

Duane, please answer the man.

I am sure that most, if not all vents here at one time wished they had an additional movement to include in a routine to create a enhanced effect.
I can’t put every movement in a figure, and I am not now ready to decide what I will want, I need to gain experience first.
captKirk;

In fact I need to perform for the first time, first.

I am also into firearms, when Sig Sauer offered me a deal on five pistols, I could not resist it.

Do I need five Sigs, NO! Did I want five Sigs… YES;

I own five additional pistols that I don’t use all the time, but fire them when I want to… They are there when I want to use them.

So getting back to the point before Wanlu posts that I need to start the firearm thread. J/K.

Sorry Walnu, just had to say that.

The future figure will have more features; that for sure, what movements will be in him? That I don’t know.

It will give me a new project to play with.

Capt, thanks for the comment on enthusiasm, it is greatly appreciated.

I am sure that most, if not all vents here at one time wished they had an additional movement to include in a routine to create a enhanced effect.
I can’t put every movement in a figure, and I am not now ready to decide what I will want, I need to gain experience first.
captKirk;

In fact I need to perform for the first time, first.

I am also into firearms, when Sig Sauer offered me a deal on five pistols, I could not resist it.

Do I need five Sigs, NO! Did I want five Sigs… YES;

I own five additional pistols that I don’t use all the time, but fire them when I want to… They are there when I want to use them.

So getting back to the point before Wanlu posts that I need to start the firearm thread. J/K.

Sorry Walnu, just had to say that.

The future figure will have more features; that for sure, what movements will be in him? That I don’t know.

It will give me a new project to play with.

Capt, thanks for the comment on enthusiasm, it is greatly appreciated.

I don’t know what happened,

CaptKirk; was to be on the top line, so please mentally move it up

Thank you

Hahaaa, I was just thinking, we've had more "dispute" over figure animations than we did on the topic of lip control, which is highly unusual for vent forums .

I just wanted to pop back in on this thread because it's really exploded into something big. Just thought I would add my two cents to this.

I can't speak yet as a performer, but as a viewer, I remember a vent that come to church when I was younger who had a figure that what are considered the "big 4" in figure animations: moving mouth, moving eyes, blinkers, and moving eyebrows.

As a performer, his figure manipulation was great, (though his lip control was awful, another topic for another time) but he had one problem: he overused the eyebrows. Excessively so.

Frequent use of blinking, eye movment, and mouth movement doesn't irritate me very much as a spectator. But watching him twitch the figure's eyebrows at least once after every line the figure spoke didn't augment the act; it detracted from it. To me, the eyebrows are a trick that should be used sparingly in a performance, maybe once or twice to emphasize a point (or flirt with an audience member). When it is overused, like this vent did, it makes the figure look robotic and has a tendency to plunge the figure into the Uncanny Valley.

I wanted to mention this not to spur an argument, but merely to illustrate a point from the other side of things. Having extra animations will strengthen your act, no doubt, if used appropriately; but it is important not to get carried away. I say this because while the strengths of having multiple animations have been mentioned, and the strengths of minimal animations have also been mentioned, the weaknesses of them haven't been discussed as much. Again, thanks everyone for contributing to the topic and making such an incredibly interesting discussion!

Once again as a correction, the "original" post never mentioned hard or soft figures. The question steered toward how many mechanical movements a particular figure had or could have, without being too complicated. Soft figures today are built with multiple movements. This isn't a point to be argued. The question was by someone new to the art, trying to get opinions that could help him make a decision possibly for a new partner.

I think we all have our own viewpoints according to what we know and what we do. Haven't we "beaten this dead horse" enough?

Mark
markwade@kidshowvent.com

Maybe not a point to be argued, but pointing out that I need correction does just that, and I'm curious, how many soft figures come with MECHANICAL movements. Is there a new line of soft figures out there I am not familiar with? If there is, then I stand corrected, it was wrong to read into the original post that it was about hard figures, in which case, I apologize for my error.

Here I am "beating the proverbial dead horse"! The only soft puppets I know of that had animations had winkers (Jet and Steve Swanson's characters and a few Verna Finly's), but I can't think of anything else, unless you are considering the Axtell mechanical birds. I know for a fact that Peanut, Jeff Dunham's buddy, has no moving anything except mouth. I recommended Mary Ann Taylor to Jeff after Verna gave up puppet making and she (Mary Ann) has not added anything additional to the original character (few if any of her puppets have movements other than the mouth).

I think you're right, blueshawk1, this was a discussion about vent figures and somehow it lopped over into soft puppets. Have at it , guys, with all the animations you want on a vent figure.
If it makes you happy..go for it!

Mark
markwade@kidshowvent.com

You're right Mark, it's whatever makes the person happy. Like I said in a post on page 2;
"In the end, to me, a vent figure is a very personal thing so it's all about whatever works for the person getting the figure, there is no absolute right or wrong."

I agree enough said on the topic. By the way, Axtell is coming out with blinking eyelids on the Ostrich April 2011.

I appreciate the kind plug from Mark, but we have several mechanical features available when wanted. As far as I know, we have the only true L/R moving eyes in soft sculpture. This character (Bubba a country Hick moonshiner) also has moving eyebrows.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6Zz5DxxBmi8

We also offer Blinkers:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ztME6YrdK4M

In addition, we can do spitters, wiggling ears and will be more than happy to work with you if you want some other feature. Strange things do happen when a retired engineer is married to a puppet maker.

Nuff of my tooting our horn. We have no opinions on what is right or wrong in this area. We just want to work with folks to give them the most choices available so that THEY can make the decision about what is right for them.

Steve
http://www.thedummyshoppe.com

Folks, you have to see the fabulous work done by Steve and his wife at the Dummy Shoppe. You'll LOVE what they do..guaranteed!
And..you can see them if you come the Vent Haven ConVENTion (sorry..that was plug!).

Mark
markwade@kidshowvent.com

I wish I could get to the convention and see them in person. As I've indicated in other threads, I'm mainly into hard figures, but every now and then, I see some soft figures that really catch my eye and interest me, and I've seen more than a couple on Steve's site, but my favorite is "Rusty Bob". If I were going to buy a soft figure right now, he'd be the one.