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Chezaday Inner circle Naperville, IL 1673 Posts |
So, out of curiosity I picked up a can of Valspar primer and their Satin Black. When I get a chance I'll try it on some scrap and we'll see what happens. I would feel much better if there was a new brand of paint that I can trust to deliver a quality finish. After my experience with the new Krylon formula, I really have given up on the brand.
Steve |
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Ray Tupper. Special user NG16. 749 Posts |
Quote:
On 2011-03-07 22:17, Thomas Wayne wrote: I'm glad you highlighted the appropriate phrase. It can be applied to a timber substrate and used a sealer/primer. It cannot be applied to other finishes without jeopordising the finish as a whole....Because it does not stick! If a hard finish is applied over an interim coat of shellac,it will be prone to chipping,due to the lack of adhesion between the shellac and the coating beneath it. If shellac is applied to a softer finish,it will craze. That was my initial remark regarding your posting,of the misleading information,about being able to apply shellac between coats of a different finish.The fact that you cannot bear to be called out speaks volumes. It's nice to see you wiki-ing and googling away trying to fight your corner. We're talking woodfinishes here aren't we?Not 747's. Ray.
What do we want?
A cure for tourettes! When do we want it? C*nt! |
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Thomas Wayne Inner circle Alaska 1977 Posts |
Simply put, Ray, you have absolutely no idea what you're blustering about - which is probably why you're now shifting to a personal attack level. FYI, I pulled up the Wiki info for you - I have no need to research (on any level) that with which I am already very familiar.
If you know what you're doing (and are using the right product), shellac is very effective as a seal coat between different layers of finish - both to prevent interaction between the layers and also to promote adhesion. But don't feel bad about your ignorance; it's what I would expect from someone who thinks "two pack polyester [and] UV lacquer" are the most durable finishes available. The fact is, neither is anywhere near as durable as the plethora of multi-part urethane and epoxy finishes available in just about any city in the world. TW (PS: Yes, we are talking woodfinishing here, Ray, since pool cues are pretty much all wood, and exotic wood at that. In fact, many of the woods I use are among the most oily and difficult to finish in the world. Be sure an let me know the next time you're called upon to "French polish" a large piece of Cocobolo with Wenge and Camphor Burl inlays.)
MOST magicians: "Here's a quarter, it's gone, you're an idiot, it's back, you're a jerk, show's over." Jerry Seinfeld
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1906Alpha1906 Special user North Cacky Lack 516 Posts |
Chez, good for you. Just be a little careful on the nozzle because it can seem to come out quite heavy and fast at first. Would like to hear how you like it. I personally find that the Valspar has a richer color to it than the Krylon does these days.
-Alpha |
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Ray Tupper. Special user NG16. 749 Posts |
Here's a project I'm working on at the moment.
It's a grandfather clock,circa 1680,that has been in a housefire.It suffered heat and smoke damage and I was recommended to repair it by two members of the British horological society. The pictures show it as it is today,stripped off,repaired and ready for polishing.(Guess what I'll be using) It is burr walnut,boxwood stringing,ebony,satinwood,walnut,afromosia,and lacewood. The barley twists on the hood are oak then covered in gesso,which makes a smooth substrate for gilding. There's a picture of it with the back page of todays Sun newspaper,just so there's no doubt. As for your offer of advice,I think I'll pass thankyou. Sorry for hijacking the thread Chez. Ray.
What do we want?
A cure for tourettes! When do we want it? C*nt! |
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Michael Baker Eternal Order Near a river in the Midwest 11172 Posts |
Oh, the horror.... the bandwidth horror!!
Two distinct threads here... Chezaday, Super Hero vs the evil Krylon Empire.... and reruns of SNL's "Point/Counterpoint"... "Jane, you ignorant slut!"
~michael baker
The Magic Company |
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Pete Biro 1933 - 2018 18558 Posts |
I've seen Thomas' (and Porper's pool cues) be ready to spend upwards of $20K for one. They Have to be bullet proof! And they are.
STAY TOONED... @ www.pete-biro.com
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Thomas Wayne Inner circle Alaska 1977 Posts |
Quote:
On 2011-03-08 08:40, Ray Tupper. wrote: I don't consider a discussion about how to solve Chez's problem a "hijack" - but then, I also haven't plugged up the thread with a multitude of unrelated photos of a non-magic-related project... As for whether or not shellac can be used for a resist/barrier between coats of other materials as I initially suggested, it absolutely CAN and is all the time. I mix my own shellac, but here's a link to a product that comes pre-mixed and ready to go. By the way, I just found out it's a stock item at most Tru-Value Hardware stores: http://www.woodworkweb.com/shop/finishin......oat.html This linked page contains a good bit of information about the product, but just to drive my point home (and put the lie to Ray Tupper's nonsense) I'll copy a few relevant bullet points from that linked page: Quote:
Guaranteed Compatible with ALL Finishes 'Nuff said (hopefully). TW
MOST magicians: "Here's a quarter, it's gone, you're an idiot, it's back, you're a jerk, show's over." Jerry Seinfeld
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Magic Researcher Elite user 406 Posts |
That is a nice clock case and shellac would be the finish of choice on such a period piece. That would keep things as original as possible. Do not snif the alcohol while French polishing.
I can not quite read the fine print on the Sun News. Is there a column on wood finishing there? MR
Repeating a falsehood often and loudly does not make it true.
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Michael Baker Eternal Order Near a river in the Midwest 11172 Posts |
Quote:
On 2011-03-08 06:57, 1906Alpha1906 wrote: I have been mostly happy with Valspar. It's a good idea to remember to invert the cans and clear the nozzles if the cans are to sit for any length of time, as they tend to clog if you don't. If they don't completely jam up, they spray irratically and in worse case scenarios, splatter and drip all over the upper part of the can. Before you know it, you have a pool of paint dripping from the upper well and you've painted half your hand. The Valspar colors are more vibrant than most comparable Krylon colors, but that's a matter of taste and a matter of project at hand. Some props look good with intense colors, some look better when a bit muted. Valspar sprays thick, no doubt. Opacity is very good, with fewer coats needed for the same compared to Krylon. I think Chance Wolf once commented about Krylon's thin formulation. But because it does spray thicker, it requires a different touch when using, especially if you are used to using Krylon. The satin colors are more forgiving, but I've found the high gloss to be a tad more tricky. Too heavy a coat (which is really easy to do) gives you a surface that dries with tiny bumps, not like orange peel, but more the feel of gnats that landed in wet paint. Too light a spray, and you get a surface that's like fine sandpaper because the paint dries before the particles flow together. If any reason to like Krylon, it is because of the above problem. I have found I get a better finish with Krylon gloss black, as long as all coats can be applied in the first hour. But... hitting a new coat after a waiting period (supposedly 24 hours), or masking and layering another color over the black, and you're playing Russian Roulette with you project.
~michael baker
The Magic Company |
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Chezaday Inner circle Naperville, IL 1673 Posts |
Very interesting .. I knew I could count on you for some sound advise. I've still got a ton of old Krylon but, I'm starting to run into problems with clogging and spattering. It's very aggravating ...
Steve |
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Michael Baker Eternal Order Near a river in the Midwest 11172 Posts |
Quote:
On 2011-03-10 12:38, Chezaday wrote: In my case, that takes the form of anecdotal f-ups.
~michael baker
The Magic Company |
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Chezaday Inner circle Naperville, IL 1673 Posts |
Oh .. I've made some decent mistakes myself, and most weren't in the shop. Anyway .. has anyone had any luck using Krylon and Valspar together? Are they compatible?
Steve |
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Craig Dickens Veteran user 376 Posts |
Have you checked with any industrial paint stores in your area? Mine still carries Krylon original ( industrial) in all colors. Hardware and the various home centers do not carry it here.
e-mail at:magicaldickens@aol.com
website: www.dickensmagic.com |
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Michael Baker Eternal Order Near a river in the Midwest 11172 Posts |
Quote:
On 2011-03-10 17:43, Chezaday wrote: I'm sure your actual mileage will vary... I've used Valspar over Krylon and I'm sure at times it has worked. I never really documented it. I don't know if this was Valspar enamel over Krylon lacquer, or what. Krylon over anything, including itself is a crapshoot. Krylon just doesn't play well with others. I'm also a bit curious as to how the new Valspar quick dry, top-coat anytime will work with it's previous formula. Of note... the new Valspar says "top coat anytime". This may not be the same as recoat anytime. Grainger has some of the old style Krylon still in stock, but the website shows it as clearance, and while supply lasts. I'm very close to finding a source for non-spray lacquers, and switching to airbrush.
~michael baker
The Magic Company |
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Chezaday Inner circle Naperville, IL 1673 Posts |
I think it was Grainger that carried the industrial version of Krylon, this was simply the old formula. I took a quick look at their website and sure enough it's on clearance .. that's not a good sign.
Any other sources Craig? Steve |
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1906Alpha1906 Special user North Cacky Lack 516 Posts |
Quote:
I'm also a bit curious as to how the new Valspar quick dry, top-coat anytime will work with it's previous formula. Of note... the new Valspar says "top coat anytime". This may not be the same as recoat anytime. The Valspar "Top Coat Anytime" works great. as It does what it says. I am currently working on two projects where I put it to test and its working just fine. one color is Purple, and the other is Red. I allowed only one day to go by, and then put top coat on, and just sat back and waited (with a tingle in my spine) to see if a wrinkle, then cracking would occur, but NOTHING! *smile* So, I put another layer on, and still no cracking, wrinkle, of lifting, so I am pretty confident that it works as it says. Now, the Recoat stuff will wrinkly and crack even after the allotted time! I was building a Dollhouse and used that formula, and left it over a weekend, and sprayed some more, and it wrinkled and cracked..... Top coat anytime is your best bet. At least for me anyway. All in all, I normally don't use spray paints, I use precatalyzed, air compressor, spray guns, air bursh guns, etc....but when I do use spray paints, I use Valspar. Very True what Michael said as well about vibrant colors, as they are vibrant, and sometimes too vibrant and can make something look 'Circus-like' if you aren't careful, but all-in-all, I prefer Valspar. Never mixed krylon with Valspar - that would be interesting to see if they get along. Krylon over Valspar may work better than Valspar over Krylon due to the fact that krylon has a 'bad attitude' *haha* -Alpha |
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Craig Dickens Veteran user 376 Posts |
I have a store near me that still stocks the original Krylon but I found this online. Never dealt with them and a $150.00 minimum. but still available.
http://www.themanstoreonline.com/Krylon-......aint.htm
e-mail at:magicaldickens@aol.com
website: www.dickensmagic.com |
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Chezaday Inner circle Naperville, IL 1673 Posts |
Dude, you're awesome Craig .. hopefully it's current information, otherwise I'll just cry.
Steve |
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hugmagic Inner circle 7655 Posts |
It asys it is original forumla but does that mean it has the lacquer. I did not think they would be able to sell that in California and they had there little logo saying they were green friendly.
If I thought I could store the stuff with no problems, I would buy a few cases and put back. It is a good price. I wonder if they have the Ultra Flat Black. That was a great paint. Richard
Richard E. Hughes, Hughes Magic Inc., 352 N. Prospect St., Ravenna, OH 44266 (330)296-4023
www.hughesmagic.com email-hugmagic@raex.com Write direct as I will be turning off my PM's. |
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