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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Ever so sleightly » » Cup advice (0 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

pslaughter
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Hey there,

Ok, I'm planning on adding a cups and balls routine to my street show. (big surprise huh?)

Here is the thing, I'm not really sure about what cups to get. Currently I've been using some copper cups that I bought at Magic Inc back in the early 90's. I've always been rather fond of them, probably because the are tough. The design is a little different, and I haven't seen any quite like them before. They have a big rolled lip, came in a nice copper finish, and have just held up. The thing is they don't hold a big load. Also they rock when there is a ball nested beneath the first and second cup when stacked as a unit.

So I'm thinking about getting some new cups. I'm just not real sure what to get. I know you guys are the ones to offer some suggestions.

Here are some of the things I'm looking for:
1) I'm partial to copper cups, so I'd like a copper set I think
2) I'm looking for a set that will hold up on the streets. They have to be able to take a beating. I don't want to be worrying about them getting scratched and dinged.
3) I'd like for them to be able to hold a decent sized load (at least some lemons, maybe moving to baseballs or tennis balls later)
4) I'd like for them to be able to accommodate using a decent sized set of working balls.

I know RNT2 and Gary Animal make some great cups. I'm just not sure what finish would be best for my purposes. I'd like to support Gary just because of all the crap he has been through lately. However, I'd like to be able to get moving on this and would prefer not to have to wait months to receive the cups.

So there you have it. Let me know what you guys think. Also let me know if I haven't thought of something that I should have!

Any suggestions would be appreciated!
Juliegel
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Ask Gary about getting a set of seconds. Seconds are cups that are normally placed aside due to some sort of defect such as lines or something. You can normally get them at a discounted price and it really does not matter if they get a little dinged. I have a set of seconds from Gary and I love them. They have small lines on them from the lathe work but besides that they are perfect and do everything you want. He has been spinning a lot of cups lately, there has to be a set of seconds in there somewhere.


As always,
Dylan
Sir Richard
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I don't know what to tell you. Your the one who has to decide. If you want quality you may just have to wait for your cups. I use the Phoenix cups & they are real work horses, as well as super-tough; however, they won't hold a larger load like a tennis ball or a baseball. However the Phoenix II cups made by RNT II will. Good hunting.

Sir Richard.
"In the land of Murphy there is but ONE law!"
Pete Biro
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STAY TOONED... @ www.pete-biro.com
Bill Wilson
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Take a look at these. Look pretty good for the money. Not to pricey, so if they get a ding or two it won't be the end of the world http://www.penguinmagic.com/p/742
Sir Richard
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BTW, you can fit a LaCross ball under the Phoenix cups really well.

Sir Richard.
"In the land of Murphy there is but ONE law!"
Bill Palmer
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Quote:
On 2011-04-21 23:36, wandboy wrote:
Take a look at these. Look pretty good for the money. Not to pricey, so if they get a ding or two it won't be the end of the world http://www.penguinmagic.com/p/742

They won't hold a tennis ball, though. The Phoenix cups will hold a tennis ball, if you get the tennis balls from China. They are tiny bit smaller than an American tennis ball.

Go to the cups and balls museum to see what is and has been manufactured.

BTW, if you get a set of Gary Animal's cups, you will have some really durable cups to work with.
"The Swatter"

Founder of CODBAMMC

My Chickasaw name is "Throws Money at Cups."

www.cupsandballsmuseum.com
pslaughter
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Thanks for all the responses.

I really appreciate being directed to the Phoenix cups. This set looks just like my favorite set from Magic Inc.

For those of you who are familiar with them, I have a couple of questions:

1) Do these still "rock" when there is a ball nested and the cups are stacked?
2) I'm not crazy about the balls that come with the cups, so what would be the best size to replace them with. The site show something about 1" X 7/8." I'd like to be able to replace them 1" balls but that must just be wishful thinking.

Thanks again guys!
Philtrum
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Hello pslaughter,
The Phoenix cups have very little attic space, which is why they come with the strange little balls. Even those don't really nest properly between two cups. As long as your routine doesn't require you to nest a ball or balls between two cups, they are a great heavy-duty cup.
Kelly
Sir Richard
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I use two balls in the attic with no problem, but then I'm a magician and know how to mis-direct, etc. If you want them a bit deeper and able to take a bit larger final load check out the Phoenix II cups at RNT II. I will keep on using my regular Phoenix cups however.

Sir Richard.
"In the land of Murphy there is but ONE law!"
Mobius303
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The pheonix cups were "fixed" with the Second run of them. They changed the shape and reworked them. They are sold through RNT2 and pics are on the site.
The originals take Donnie's 1 inch balls with no problems. I think they were meant for a 7/8 inch ball and a lacrosse sized load, though mine takes a regulation tennis ball on a soft surface with no problem.
Mobius
Bill Palmer
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The Phoenix cups were based on the Magic, Inc. "Charlie Miller" Cups, which were based on the Ross Bertram cups. The Ross Bertram cups originally were made to use with a 7/8" rubber ball. These balls are hard to find.

The Magic, Inc. cups tended to float some. You could usually use a ball that was actually 7/8" in size with them.

If you use anything larger than a ball that has an actual size of 3/4" with most sets of Phoenix cups, you will get the floating effect. However, your spectator is very unlikely to notice this, unless you call attention to it.

One problem is that most manufacturers don't quote actual ball size. When you buy a 3/4" ball from most of them, it means they have a 3/4" core. Donnie at RnT II is one of the few who gives ACTUAL size.

The Phoenix 2 cups are better designed.

BTW, let me repeat the other advice I gave you. Please visit the cups and balls museum. It will show you what is and has been available. Remember, almost everything in the museum is something I have acquired in less than a decade.
"The Swatter"

Founder of CODBAMMC

My Chickasaw name is "Throws Money at Cups."

www.cupsandballsmuseum.com
francisngkl
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Going through Bill's Museum is like walking through the history of cups, but be warned, it's very addictive...Its the only museum in the world that I visit so often and enjoy every trip I make
Carpe Diem, Seize The Day!
dcjames
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Hello Patrick -

The best advice I can give concerning picking a set of cups is three-fold:

1. Request a password and ID from Bill Palmer for his museum. There you can see detailed photos of more cups than you can imagine. Each set includes a description with great information such as material and final load size. Can't think of a better place to 'see' various cups past and present.

2. Decide on the details of your routine and the desired final loads before buying a set of cups. It's difficult to know what tools are needed before understanding the work to be done.

3. If at all possible, physically play with the cups before you buy. If you know someone with a collection of cups or have a friend who owns a particular set you may be interested in, ask to play with them for a bit to see how they fit your hands, etc. IMO this is the best way to really understand how the cups will feel and perform for you without buying numerous sets in order to find the best one for you.

Be forewarned, I personally started out wanting to learn a 3 cup routine and have turned into a bit of a cup collector myself. The cups and balls can become addictive. Just sayin'...

Best,

Doug
“Magic is very easy to do - poorly.”

Tommy Wonder
The Books of Wonder
Volume 2
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