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Profile of Logan
Kaliix makes a very interesting point, but I must point out one thing.

Kaliix, this is in no way an attempt to offend you or anything of that nature, tis not my intent.

That said, it IS true that after doing a pen thru bill effect, heat is on the bill BIG TIME - and why not right? You just jabbed a pen in there and they hear you rip it out - OUCH, obviously they are worried about the wellbeing of their money.

But with effects like Misled and JPT, where there is no ripping or jabbing - in other words no emotional drama (if you can call it that) that would make the audience cringe and wonder about the condition of the bill - you can't compare it to the pen thru bill effect.

The melting thru phase of both effects (Misled/JPT) are MAGICAL plain and simple. It looks gorgeous and it melts brains - but if I were a spectator, honestly speaking I would want to examine BOTH straight up. If this were a pen thru bill effect, I would just want my cash back thank you very much.

The fact that both, pen thru bill and Misled/JPT, project different types of effects (one is a jabbing/ripping and restoration whilst the other is melting thru a bill) will definitely garner different emotions and thus different responses to the effect as well as the props.

I'd just thought I'd clear that up though. I do pen thru bill alot as well and Misled too, so I am familiar and can distinguish the different responses to both effects.

I just don't think you can place them up at the same level of judgement, that's all.

Anyway, take care all,

You've been hit by, you've been struck by, a smooth criminal.

Singapore's Hairiest Corporate Comedy Magician!
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Profile of Kaliix
No offense taken man. The world's just no fun if we agree on everything.

Actually, I think you may have a point. The difference in the penetrations can effect how people react and what they intuitively want to inspect.

I don't do Misled as much anymore, but I don't remember people wanting to really inspect the pencil after doing it. If I remember the instructions for Misled, it gave handing out the pencil as one of the motivations for removing the pencil in the first place (in order to do the set up).

In that case the pencil is inspected before hand, taking the heat off it after the penetration. This probably the better way to handle the issue of pencil examinability in either Misled or JPT.

Misled is better though in the respect that you can easily clean it up afterwards so that the pencil may be handed out.
The greatest obstacle to discovery is not ignorance; it is the illusion of knowledge.
~Daniel J. Boorstin
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Profile of Logan
Hey Kaliix bud,

Yes, you are right about the Misled instructions, the pencil is handed out before hand so less heat is on the pencil and that is indeed an advantage seeing as you end dirty as you do with JPT. But even so, clean up is a sinch and I love that - just preference.

As I've stated in one previous post in this thread, I still prefer Misled - whilst I applaud Russ and his creation (it is brilliant) it's not something that I can appreciate, that's all.

Take care Kaliix,

You've been hit by, you've been struck by, a smooth criminal.

Singapore's Hairiest Corporate Comedy Magician!
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Profile of truthteller

Good points. And yes, JPT does have some nice touches, but I still contend that overall Misled is a more versatile prop. Admittedly, this decision is based on my days from having performed Misled prior to the Copperfield presentation. I cannot speak to the published Misled instructions specifically as the handling I worked out was prior to the re release. But I contend, as a tool for penetration effects, I give Misled the nod.

As for your suggestion to incorporate the pencil into one's larger performing concept, that would work. But as a performer who has spent years defining a style and selecting material that reflects said style, to change all that in order to do a pencil through bill effect belies misplaced priorities.

I would say most performers should be seeking effects which suit them, not becoming magical chameleons who shift shapes every time a new product hits the shelves.

I agree that there are ways around the examinability issues, but these really haven't been worked out by Russ. So, when one purchases the effect with the assumption they will be able to do it, I think it is of value for them to know that this is something with which they will have to contend. I believe firmly that any problem can be solved, but the first step is to recognize the problem. When it comes to Misled v. JPT, Misled has an advantage over this regard, as released.

I do however eagerly look forward to seeing JPT revamped much as Wenk's Misled was. I do feel that there is potential latent within the concept and cannot wait for someone to show me it fully realized.

Good thoughts,


Also, I would like to encourage everyone with a different opinion from mine to post their thoughts on the site. I think the value of sites like mylovelyassistant, as well as this one, come from intelligent, thoughtful people posting their own ideas about an item, whether they disagree with the official view or not. Thanks for taking the time to reply to me here, and I hope I will see your thoughts there, as well.
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El Paso, Texas
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Profile of jamesmwood
I really appreciate the polite debate -- point, counter-point -- between Kallix and truthteller.
I like the *debate* because it allows the pros and cons to be laid out and discussed in a thorough way.
I like the *polite* part because egos don't get involved. Instead it's like overhearing two really bright
and experienced colleagues share their perspectives with respect for each other.
Thanks, fellas!
Jim Wood
El Paso, Texas
magic 12376
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Wilkes-Barre Pa
115 Posts

Profile of magic 12376
I have been performing misled for aprox 18 to 20 years. It in all my years as both a performer and former magic dealer in my opinion is the best may be handed out before or after or both. Angles are very goodthe authenticity of the effect is flooring. I also like the idea of a pencil, to a lay audience I just think there is less heat. Somehow seems that they have always become more suspicious of a pen. ie cornelius perfect pen. I do fully admit I have not yet familiarized my self with just passing through, or perhaps I am not recognizing the name, but Until that time I,personally have to give my vote for misled. It is one of my favorites.... But you know what they say.....different strokes for different folks.
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