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ASW
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On 2011-05-30 18:01, landmark wrote:
ASW,
Let's agree that hundreds of thousands would not try to fake things. But, just to be difficult, let's suppose that American scientists were able to somehow fake whatever transmissions were received around the world. Certainly scientists have been fooled by clever tricksters before in history.



Ask yourself: is it plausible that anyone in the sixties (or even now) could fake radio signals identified by telemetry experts (astronomers) staffing radio telescopes in a foreign country pointed at the moon?

Answer: no.

If more people used their brains, such monumental stupidity would die from lack of oxygen.
Whenever I find myself gripping anything too tightly I just ask myself "How would Guy Hollingworth hold this?"

A magician on the Genii Forum

"I would respect VIPs if they respect history."

Hideo Kato
gdw
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On 2011-05-30 11:59, RS1963 wrote:
One way to look at C.T.'s is take the "Moon landings were faked" for an example. If that were the case. Countries such as China, Russia, and even our allies. As well as every other country that spies on the U.S.) would have shouted that from every mountain top there is. There would have been no way that the U.S. could have or would have been able to pay any nation off to keep quiet. Besides the claims of the landings being faked have so many holes and misconceptions or just flat out no understanding of science, physics or much of anything else. There are very few C.T.'s that hold much water.


It's a rare occasion that I consider something you post to make sense, let alone something I agree with.

:thumbsup:
"You may say I'm a dreamer, but I'm not the only one."

I won't forget you Robert.
Dennis Michael
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You mean Obama was really born in America?
I am going to get millions from some dead guy in Africa?
Jane Fonda is a friend of Vietnam Veterans?
Wiki Leaks never happened.
Dennis Michael
ASW
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On 2011-05-31 06:22, Dennis Michael wrote:
You mean Obama was really born in America?
I am going to get millions from some dead guy in Africa?
Jane Fonda is a friend of Vietnam Veterans?
Wiki Leaks never happened.


1) Good example.

2) A scam which likely involves a small-time criminal conspiracy. But not an example of a Conspiracy Theory. For a start, these scams actually happen. There is nothing theoretical about them - except the imagined reward for allowing Mr.419 to use your account to store his 40 million dollars.

3) If you know your history then it's hard to see how you thought this was relevant or illustrative.

4) Uh, what's the point of this? To clarify: yes Wikileaks involved a conspiracy. Again, NO it's not an example of a Conspiracy Theory. However, if you had written, "Wikileaks was a front company for Sarah Palin designed to make the Obama administration look bad" then THAT would have been an example of a nutball, off the wall, slack-jawed, grade A idiotic, capital C capital T, Conspiracy Theory.

Any questions?
Whenever I find myself gripping anything too tightly I just ask myself "How would Guy Hollingworth hold this?"

A magician on the Genii Forum

"I would respect VIPs if they respect history."

Hideo Kato
LobowolfXXX
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On 2011-05-31 09:58, ASW wrote:
not an example of a Conspiracy Theory. For a start, these scams actually happen.


Ah, but that's cheating. If the Black Sox scandal hadn't been uncovered, I think it's possible (despite the obviously much small number of people who would have to have been in on it) that people who believed it would have been dismissed as conspiracy theorists along the same lines as those who believe that the moon landing was faked.
"Torture doesn't work" lol
Guess they forgot to tell Bill Buckley.

"...as we reason and love, we are able to hope. And hope enables us to resist those things that would enslave us."
landmark
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Quote:
On 2011-05-30 23:30, ASW wrote:
Quote:
On 2011-05-30 18:01, landmark wrote:
ASW,
Let's agree that hundreds of thousands would not try to fake things. But, just to be difficult, let's suppose that American scientists were able to somehow fake whatever transmissions were received around the world. Certainly scientists have been fooled by clever tricksters before in history.



Ask yourself: is it plausible that anyone in the sixties (or even now) could fake radio signals identified by telemetry experts (astronomers) staffing radio telescopes in a foreign country pointed at the moon?

Answer: no.

If more people used their brains, such monumental stupidity would die from lack of oxygen.

Send an unmanned transmitter to the moon--or, rough and smooth.
Woland
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Have you ever looked at the stats the White Sox racked up in the 1919 series?
ASW
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Quote:
On 2011-05-31 10:56, LobowolfXXX wrote:
Quote:
On 2011-05-31 09:58, ASW wrote:
not an example of a Conspiracy Theory. For a start, these scams actually happen.


Ah, but that's cheating. If the Black Sox scandal hadn't been uncovered, I think it's possible (despite the obviously much small number of people who would have to have been in on it) that people who believed it would have been dismissed as conspiracy theorists along the same lines as those who believe that the moon landing was faked.


It's not cheating. How many people conspired in the Black Sox conspiracy versus the number of people who would have had to keep quiet for the moon landing? Literally tens of thousands in the latter case. It's just not plausible that so many people could be so disciplined. In the case of the Sox, a far smaller number were involved and they still got caught.

The key is to ask yourself - always - is this theory plausible?
Whenever I find myself gripping anything too tightly I just ask myself "How would Guy Hollingworth hold this?"

A magician on the Genii Forum

"I would respect VIPs if they respect history."

Hideo Kato
Magnus Eisengrim
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Once again he glanced at his rival in the opposite cubicle. Something seemed to tell him with certainty that Tillotson was busy on the same job as himself. There was no way of knowing whose job would finally be adopted, but he felt a profound conviction that it would be his own. Comrade Ogilvy, unimagined an hour ago, was now a fact. It struck him as curious that you could create dead men but not living ones. Comrade Ogilvy, who had never existed in the present, now existed in the past, and when once the act of forgery was forgotten, he would exist just as authentically, and upon the same evidence, as Charlemagne or Julius Caesar.


George Orwell 1984
The blood-dimmed tide is loosed, and everywhere
The ceremony of innocence is drowned;
The best lack all conviction, while the worst
Are full of passionate intensity.--Yeats
Jonathan Townsend
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Quote:
On 2011-05-31 12:33, landmark wrote:...
Send an unmanned transmitter to the moon--or, rough and smooth.


Just retask a few satellites to send the right transmissions so it looks like it's coming from where folks think the moon is. No sense in being clever and risking anyone aiming their own radar or lasers off target and bouncing a signal off "the wall" by accident.
...to all the coins I've dropped here
Woland
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It is possible to change the historical record, but not if too many contemporary witnesses or participants preserve their own accounts first.
Scott Cram
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There's a corollary to Occam's razor that applies to conspiracy theories:

When the same set of facts can be explained equally well by:

1. A massive conspiracy coordinated without a single leak between hundreds or even thousands of people

-OR -

2. Sustained stupidity, confusion and/or incompetence

Assume stupidity.

Also, it's helpful to remember that a conspiracy is simply the legal term for 2 or more people making an agreement to break the law. Was 9/11 a conspiracy? Considering there were 4 planes involved, I'd say it was either a conspiracy, or one extremely talented and coordinated person!
Woland
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Joe Jackson led the series with a .375 average. How is that throwing games?
landmark
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Quote:
On 2011-05-31 18:26, Jonathan Townsend wrote:
Quote:
On 2011-05-31 12:33, landmark wrote:...
Send an unmanned transmitter to the moon--or, rough and smooth.


Just retask a few satellites to send the right transmissions so it looks like it's coming from where folks think the moon is. No sense in being clever and risking anyone aiming their own radar or lasers off target and bouncing a signal off "the wall" by accident.

I have to admit, I was proud of the rough and smooth part.
LobowolfXXX
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I liked the rough/smooth bit, too. I should have said something at the time.
"Torture doesn't work" lol
Guess they forgot to tell Bill Buckley.

"...as we reason and love, we are able to hope. And hope enables us to resist those things that would enslave us."
Dennis Michael
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ASW: My post was meant to be humorous, not really needing a reply.

Conspiracy theories will always exist. They deflect from the actual problems and it's generally involved in politics on both sides.

As long as people focus on theses issues, the real issues go unaddressed.
Dennis Michael
Woland
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The rough and the smooth - isn't that a book by Claude Levi-Strauss? And I wonder if that's the same Strauss family as DSK, too. Now there would be a conspiracy except that Gobineau worked it over a long time ago.
ASW
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Sorry Dennis. With these loony conspirators it's sometimes hard to spot a parody!
Whenever I find myself gripping anything too tightly I just ask myself "How would Guy Hollingworth hold this?"

A magician on the Genii Forum

"I would respect VIPs if they respect history."

Hideo Kato
Turk
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Quote:
On 2011-05-30 18:01, landmark wrote:
ASW,
Let's agree that hundreds of thousands would not try to fake things. But, just to be difficult, let's suppose that American scientists were able to somehow fake whatever transmissions were received around the world. Certainly scientists have been fooled by clever tricksters before in history.



Landmark,

Please! Stay on topic and don't try to shift into the Global Warming controversy. (grin) I'm still trying to deal with the CT's moon landing and JFK Assassination assertions.

Mike
Magic is a vanishing Art.

This must not be Kansas anymore, Toto.

Eschew obfuscation.
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