Just saw Ronn Lucas's show on DVD recently. Ronn put a puppet on his puppet's knee and it was talking. Anyone know how that's done? It's a cool idea.

http://m.youtube.com/index?desktop_uri=%......gP-vVQ-4

Ventriloquism. Not the answer you wanted huh? ;-)

The puppet's puppet is an effect several people use.
Here's a video of Kenny Warren - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5cNepuNiB0o

I'd bet Dan has some pics on Ventriloquist Central of the mechanisms.

Tom

Jerry Lane does a bit like that as well that he used at Venthaven a couple of years ago. Kenny Warren is one of my personal favorites though. He is good.

Steve

http://www.thedummyshoppe.com

Do you think Jerry or Kenny would freely share how it's done or are these secrets?

Whatever this effect is called I think it's ingenious. Who was the originator of it?

One of these days I want to invent a few new effects to advance the art of vent. =)

I've seen full size figures with a single hole drilled in their rib cages. The smaller puppet then has a control rod that fits through the main figure's body so that the ventriloquist can control it from inside. Wish I could remember where I've seen this...but Tom's probably right. I probably saw it on Dan Willinger's site!

-Philip

Philip is right, I've seen examples of these small figures myself. Unfortunately, I don't remember where other than I know it wasn't on Dan's site - I think it was in a book.
The only thing I never liked about the ones I've seen do it, is that usually, the little figure doesn't look like it's on the bigger figure's knee, it looks like it's just stuck on the front of the bigger figure. I've always thought that the rod with the control that fits through the bigger figure's body, should be more on the side of the smaller figure instead of sticking straight out it's back, that would help have the smaller figure positioned properly to create the illusion.
I've thought about making one for myself, but it's one of many things on a long list of project ideas.

I remember Kenny Warren sold an extra a few years ago on eBay. That may be where I caught a glimpse of the control rod. I've never seen one that was physically attached to the figure during the performance, like Ronn Lucas did in that clip. In Ronn's version, I believe the smaller puppet probably contained animatronics because its head moved around. Since it was filmed for TV - having a crew to remotely operate the figure makes sense.

MT:

Here is a youtube video you may be interested in.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C3Zn3M-WMzM&NR=1

I've seen that clip before, I've seen quite a few vids over the years of someone using a dummy's dummy, and that's the only time I've ever seen the dummy's dummy not attached to the main figure, but then Ray Allen doesn't appear to have the typical setup there, looks like he's sitting behind a desk or something.

Years ago Jeff Dunham did a bit with the dummy on the puppet's knee. He did it with Peanut and the little dummy on the knee looked like Jeff! Peanut told Jeff he had a really ugly dummy and then he brought out the little lookalike. Funny bit..operated the same way as Kenny Warren's and Jerry Layne's character on the knee (the dummy..not the bit) .

Mark
markwade@kidshowvent.com

I love this bit. I think Ray had someone else under the table working the second puppet.

B

Bob,

Having someone under the table working the post, is that a NO NO?

A "NO NO"? I wouldn't say so, just not the typical setup for the average vent.

I was teasing Bob because of a "NO NO" comment he made in another thread

When I first saw that clip, I figured he was using foot pedals. One to turn the head & one to work the mouth. We may never know.

p.s. I bought the two mini figures & a custom body from Kenny Warren. Al Stevens made these figures & if Al gives me his blessing I will post pictures of the setup.

Troy

Hi Troy,

The dummy-on-the-dummy is a great bit even if it's old as the hills! In addition to the aforementioned examples, Stanley Burns also did a version of it, and I did some repair work for Paul Winchell on a "Little Paul" dummy that he built in the 50's for Jerry Mahoney to use.
I also recall seeing a photo of an old vaudeville vent (whose name escapes me) using the 'dummy-on-dummy'.

There's nothing new under the sun, but with some imagination you can breathe new life into old concepts and make it seem new again.

HA HA;

Since I started training as a ventriloquist last year a few of my friends feel I am doing a dummy with a dummy routine

Sometimes a thing is right in front of you and you don't see it. Many many years ago, when I was in grade school, one of my more casual playmates, finding out that I was a ventriloquist, told me that his dad built vent figures. I was fascinated because, back in those days, it was pretty much Jerry Mahoney figures in the Sears catalogue or build one's own out of styrofoam and papier mache (I had both). We went to his house, which was only about six blocks from my own, and, sure enough, his dad was building vent figures out of bass wood and balsa wood. I told him I was going to save up my allowance and buy one from him. He smiled and GAVE me a miniature vent figure head, about the size of a softball. It was excavated for eyes (which he hadn't put in yet) and had a moving mouth, of course. It had yellow yarn hair. I was ecstatic! I glued in marble eyes and built a body and, as he was a small figure, I made him a leprechaun. He was too small, though, for the shows I was doing, generally on proscenium stages, so, after a time, I retired him.

Still got the head, though the control stick is gone and the bottom of the neck is a bit ragged (It is, I believe, balsa. Found it in a trunk during the massive cleanup I'm doing in the house this summer...and took it up to put it in the dining room bookcase to think about.
But for some reason, until just now, I hadn't thought of a "dummy with a dummy" routine. Well, that'd be perfect for his size, wouldn't it! Hmmmm.

-Philip

Great story Philip, I always enjoy reading your posts, go for it!!!