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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Not very magical, still... » » Dissassociation replicating the feeling of a K Hole (0 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

LLL
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Morning,

Bit of a strange request. I'm looking for some resources on recreating the feeling of disassociation that Ketamin users experience when they are stuck in a K hole. I work in the drug and alcohol sector and want to include this in my training so that workers can experience a simular feeling.
Any ideas would be greatfully received.

Thanks
Andy
The basic tool for the manipulation of reality is the manipulation of words. If you can control the meaning of words, you can control the people who must use the words.
horganpaul
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I don't mean to be smart but can I make a point :


1) explaining to someone who has never been in a "k hole" what its like is equivalent to trying to explain to someone who has never drunk alcohol what its like to be drunk.

You can create a disassociative state (I'm going to be shot for using the "s" word) using hypnosis quite easily - assuming you know what you're doing.Can I ask if you have any experience of using hypnosis in either a stage or treatment room setting ?
LLL
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Hi HorganPaul,

Thanks for the response.

I appreciate this is more for performers, but thought it would be a good place to get any references from experienced people (quite a few people on here also work in a theraputic setting as well) that might help me find something that would be suitable. Just a nudge in the right direction would be great.

I also appreciate that it is difficult to describe to someone the experience of a K hole, hence the question. I would, however, contest that it is difficult to explain to someone the experience of being drunk, we have drunkbuster goggles that can at least part recreate this experience.

I do have experience with hypnosis, outside of the theraputic setting. I am fairly well read on ormond mcgill and milton erikson however I am by no means a hypnotist, just someone who is interested in the area, as I have been performing magic for about 11 years. (not professionally anymore)
My backgroung is cognitive behaviour therapy, Brief solution focussed therapy and Motivational interviewing.

As you can probably appreciate I don't want to start doing inductions in the training room. I'm looking for more of pseudo hypnotic technique to replicate this.
Maybe you are right and this is the wrong place to have posed the question, but worth a shot hey?

Thanks for your time.

Andy
The basic tool for the manipulation of reality is the manipulation of words. If you can control the meaning of words, you can control the people who must use the words.
horganpaul
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Hey Andy ,

I do indeed also work in the theraputic side of the art , however I'm very careful about not using theraputic methods when doing a stage type demonstration of hypnosis.
If you didn't want to use an induction as such prehaps you could use a couple of progressive relaxation techniques to bring them to the disassociative state.
There are many scripts you could use , easily found through a google search.

Thanks

Paul Horgan
dmkraig
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Andy, there is a problem with your terminology, making a simple answer impossible.

First, you request information on RECREATING "the feeling of disassociation that Ketamin users experience." That's very easy to do by way of regression.

Then, however, you say you want to do this because "it is difficult to describe to someone the experience of a K hole." To me this sounds like you don't want help RECREATING this in someone's mind. Rather, you want to CREATE it in someone's mind even though they've never experienced it before.

This is a much greater challenge. Once a person was hypnotized, you'd have to completely and thoroughly describe the experience. Have the person experience the dissociated feeling while they are actually dissociated (for safety). And if that's not difficult enough, you'd also have to hope that your description appeals to the mind of the hypnotized person in a way that the person experiences just what you want them to experience without confabulation that takes them away from your desired imagery. If this sounds complex...it is!

Respectfully, this is not something for a person who is merely "well read." Rather, it is more appropriate for someone who is both trained and experienced in therapeutic hypnosis work.

My suggestion: Learn 3D computer animation, create a visionary experience that mimics the experience you wish to convey, and then either show it on a very large TV screen or project it on a wall so that it becomes immersive. This will take no longer to learn to do than the training and experience you'd need in hypnotherapy.
LLL
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Horganpaul, thanks for your reply. Yes I think that may be what I'm thinking about. When I was younger we used to do this thing where someone would lie on the floor and you would hold up there arms and then you would slowly lower them down; as you did this it would feel to them like they are sinking into the ground. I guess that is more what I was looking for rather than the classic sort of hypnosis..
Thanks again for the response.

dmkraig - your absolutely right, wrong word indeed. I will just clarify the training is not for clients, it's for a spectrum of different people who work in the field and what I am proposing in the OP would have been a tiny part that is not necersary to include. (I just like to try and create interactive and unique experiences for people on the courses, nothing worse than death by powerpoint IMO )
I completely take on board your comment, and be assured I'm not the type of person that would try to wing it because I'm well read.

Thanks for the suggestion about the animation, it's an interesting idea and something I will definately look into.

Thanks for your time gentlemen.

Andy
The basic tool for the manipulation of reality is the manipulation of words. If you can control the meaning of words, you can control the people who must use the words.
MobilityBundle
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I have no training or experience on this topic, but consider looking around YouTube. For example:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JgJYxGgGXO4

(And related links).
stoneunhinged
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So...let me think...I have mental powers...STRONG mental powers...and I am going to take a wild, wild, guess...relying only on my POWERS:

Did this thread begin in the Pennies forum?

LOL!
critter
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Punch them in the kidneys until they sweat, take away everything they care about, and then throw them in a ditch. Preferable with some type of infection.
This also works for creating a heroin experience, meth experience, etc.
"The fool is one who doesn't know what you have just found out."
~Will Rogers
LLL
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Mobilitybundle thanks for the link..

stoneunhinged.. no I was trying to aviod the egos.. posted in the hypnotism forum.. mistake

critter.. as you were..
The basic tool for the manipulation of reality is the manipulation of words. If you can control the meaning of words, you can control the people who must use the words.
critter
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*Disclaimer* The preceeding comment was satire. Critter does not endorse assault and battery as a method of instruction. Not publically, anyway.
"The fool is one who doesn't know what you have just found out."
~Will Rogers
landmark
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Replicating the feeling of an A Hole? Shouldn't be difficult to locate.
What?
Oh . . .
Never mind.
Atticus R. Cane
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Track down a drug recognition expert. They are trained and certified people that the police call to find out what somebody is trippin on when they don't have a clue.
LLL
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Thanks Atticus, but I don't see how that would be useful for what I have requested in the OP.
The idea was to try something a bit different, that's not really been done before.. I have no problem explaining verbally the feeling, and exploring everything else with the people on the course around Ketamin, this was just something I wanted to add in there.

Andy
The basic tool for the manipulation of reality is the manipulation of words. If you can control the meaning of words, you can control the people who must use the words.
Pakar Ilusi
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Disassociation replicating the feeling of a K Hole?

Use Hypnosis. Smile

(Feelings of other holes can also be replicated. Smile )
"Dreams aren't a matter of Chance but a matter of Choice." -DC-
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