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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Not very magical, still... » » What are "rights?" (0 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

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mastermindreader
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You are now arguing circularly. You still haven't answered where those rights come from. You have merely posited an arbitrary assumption that is directly contrary to the laws of nature.
gdw
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Well, apparently the claim that these truths are self evident was good enough for others, wh you yourself have appealed to.
It's amazing, people will criticize you for "biting the hand that feeds you," while they're busy praising the hand that beats them.

"You may say I'm a dreamer, but I'm not the only one."

I won't forget you Robert.
mastermindreader
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Quote:
On 2012-01-25 22:53, gdw wrote:
Well, apparently the claim that these truths are self evident was good enough for others, wh you yourself have appealed to.


Those are philosophical and Deist ideas popularized during the Age of Reason and designed to serve an ideal created by men, NOT natural laws.
landmark
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I'm still working on how the assumption of self-ownership (already a formulation that could only come out of a very specific historical consciousness) extends to property. It's a total non-sequitur.
LobowolfXXX
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Why do you think the assumption of self-ownership could only come out of a very specific historical consciousness?
"Torture doesn't work" lol
Guess they forgot to tell Bill Buckley.

"...as we reason and love, we are able to hope. And hope enables us to resist those things that would enslave us."
kambiz
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Natural law assumes that we are mere animals dictated by the changes and chances of the natural world. Surely the very ability for a human to be able to reason before acting on something is a validity that we are more than just mere animals.....

It is that "thing" that elevates us above the animal kingdom which is the link that puts all humans on an equal footing in terms of rights....surely whether I was born with a stronger genetic ability to run like Usain Bolt and you weren't has NOTHING to do with who has the more rights....

The day we truly recognize the reality of our essential oneness will be the day we will finally be truly free

Kam
If I speak forth, many a mind will shatter,
And if I write, many a pen will break.
.....and when I consider my own self, lo, I find it coarser than clay!
LobowolfXXX
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If anything, I would sooner suggest that our ability to reason puts us on a higher plane of responsibilities than a higher plane of rights.
"Torture doesn't work" lol
Guess they forgot to tell Bill Buckley.

"...as we reason and love, we are able to hope. And hope enables us to resist those things that would enslave us."
kambiz
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I wasn't saying that Lobowolf Smile

Kam
If I speak forth, many a mind will shatter,
And if I write, many a pen will break.
.....and when I consider my own self, lo, I find it coarser than clay!
critter
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Quote:
On 2012-01-26 03:29, kambiz wrote:
Surely the very ability for a human to be able to reason before acting on something is a validity that we are more than just mere animals.....


I believe that other animals can reason, although I'm not aware of any conclusive study on the matter. I believe that the old misconception that they lack the ability to communicate has been debunked though.
"The fool is one who doesn't know what you have just found out."
~Will Rogers
stoneunhinged
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Smile
critter
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Yuck. I hate popcorn. Why anyone would want to eat food that smells like farts is beyond me.
"The fool is one who doesn't know what you have just found out."
~Will Rogers
mastermindreader
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Popcorn farts are nothing compared to what you can fire off after eating a bag of White Castles!

The question is, though, do you have inherent right to defend yourself in this manner?
critter
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Excellent point, Bill Murray in Ed Wood.
All you'd need to weaponize it is a plain Bic lighter. Don't tell Al Kwayder though.
"The fool is one who doesn't know what you have just found out."
~Will Rogers
Jonathan Townsend
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Quote:
On 2012-01-26 12:37, stoneunhinged wrote:
:pop:


Yup, lots of fun at open book tests too.

I'll give you this nice barometer if you tell me the height of this building.
...to all the coins I've dropped here
LobowolfXXX
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Even Doctor Crow has to open the book.
"Torture doesn't work" lol
Guess they forgot to tell Bill Buckley.

"...as we reason and love, we are able to hope. And hope enables us to resist those things that would enslave us."
critter
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What the **** does any of that have to do with popcorn or farts?
"The fool is one who doesn't know what you have just found out."
~Will Rogers
Steve_Mollett
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Eh, so I've made
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What we KNOW is that we, popcorn and farts exist.
We also know that old farts often gather in small bars.
Author of: GARROTE ESCAPES
The absurd is the essential concept and the first truth.
- Albert Camus
critter
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Quote:
On 2012-01-26 19:44, Steve_Mollett wrote:
What we KNOW is that we, popcorn and farts exist.
We also know that old farts often gather in small bars.


See, now that's good science!
"The fool is one who doesn't know what you have just found out."
~Will Rogers
landmark
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Sorry I don't have anything to add to the popcorn discussion.

Quote:
On 2012-01-26 00:06, LobowolfXXX wrote:
Why do you think the assumption of self-ownership could only come out of a very specific historical consciousness?

The idea that you "owned" your body would be incomprehensible for much of pre-capitalist society. The body is subject to the will of God, community, and your masters/lords.
gdw
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Forgetting the determinist view for now, who controls you?
It's amazing, people will criticize you for "biting the hand that feeds you," while they're busy praising the hand that beats them.

"You may say I'm a dreamer, but I'm not the only one."

I won't forget you Robert.
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