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Woland
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The standard is not "set" by industry, Bob. The fashion industry spends an enormous amount of time and money to discover what the customers themselves are finding fashionable, then they attempt to follow it.
magicalaurie
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And what percentage of the general population are those customers, Woland?

And, "attempt to follow it"?
critter
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"The fool is one who doesn't know what you have just found out."
~Will Rogers
mastermindreader
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Quote:
On 2012-03-22 13:55, Woland wrote:
The standard is not "set" by industry, Bob. The fashion industry spends an enormous amount of time and money to discover what the customers themselves are finding fashionable, then they attempt to follow it.


I'm not talking about fashions, as you know, but about false standards of beauty and the attendant health risks:

http://www.medicalnewstoday.com/releases/76241.php
Woland
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Hi Magicalaurie,

Actually I think the photograph you posted supports my argument. Such outlandish and fanciful creations, which designers include in their collections to get press, don't sell. You don't see young women walking around in such get-ups.

On the other hand, the fashion and style choices of the Duchess of Cambridge resonate with the public, and her taste seems to be consciously emulated by many customers.

Successful designers don't impose their ideas on the public, they achieve success by reflecting the developing public taste. Fashionistas spend lots of time and money observing beautiful, fashionable people to find out what the trends are going to be.

Bob,

The article you link makes an unsupported claim that the prevalence of eating disorders among professional fashion models is increasing. Since I think there are no reliable data on the prevalence of eating disorders among them now or in the past, the claim is possibly true, but aint necessarily so.

Moreover, the fact that professional fashion models, who work in a stressful and demanding environment, which is often a weird and eccentric environment, might have various disorders of adjustment, does not really help us find out if part of the intent of the Israeli law - to prevent eating disorders in the public by controlling who may be photographed - is reasonable or likely to succeed.

If the intent is to prevent young women with eating disorders from working as fashion models, that is an aim that could succeed.

But it will not change the image of beauty and attractiveness in the Zeitgeist.

I continue to think that the reason we are seeing increasingly skinny and barely pubescent fashion models is related to the increasing neoteny of our culture over the past 400 years or so.

First was the invention of "childhood" as described by Phillipe Ariès in 1960. Then came the creation of "adolescence." Now we read about people in their 20s - formerly a decade well into adulthood - who lead puerile lives.

We are afraid of growing up (Peter Pan, anyone?) because growing up means growing old, and growing old means dying.

Thus our image of beauty is no longer the Rubenesque (let alone Maillolesque) young woman but a skinny girl.

And yet we age more during the first year of our life than we do in all the threescore-and-ten years that follow, God willing.
S2000magician
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Quote:
On 2012-03-22 17:40, Woland wrote:
Hi Magicalaurie,

Actually I think the photograph you posted . . . .

I'm pretty sure that magicalaurie didn't post a photograph.
Dannydoyle
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I am shocked when Bob asked for a link none of the math geeks came up with "The Golden Ratio".

http://www.intmath.com/numbers/math-of-beauty.php

Guess I am the most math geeky. But know that I am going to sort of disagree with the idea of "The Golden Ratio" as it pertains to human perception of beauty in one another. I thin the jury is still out.

I think Wiki actually covers it better. Imagine me saying THAT! http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Golden_ratio
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus
<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
Woland
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Thanks, S2000Magician! My apologies, Magicalaurie and critter!
S2000magician
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My pleasure.

(You might want to visit your oculist: magicalaurie's and critter's avatars should be impossible to confuse.)
Woland
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You're right about that. I've been having headaches for a week because I need to revise my prescription. But I think my confusion had to do with the fact that critter simply posted the picture, without a comment, and I saw it as a continuation of the previous post, which was a comment. Looked at quickly. Always a mistake.
S2000magician
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Quote:
On 2012-03-23 10:30, Woland wrote:
. . . critter simply posted the picture, without a comment, and I saw it as a continuation of the previous post, which was a comment.

I knew that; I was just yanking your chain.
critter
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I just think that chick is as thin as an envelope, which can't be healthy for her.

I really need to update my avator, that doesn't look anything like me anymore.
"The fool is one who doesn't know what you have just found out."
~Will Rogers
magicalaurie
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Some have suggested that fashion designers are lazy and find it easier to design clothing for coat hangers than real bodies. I think those folks might be onto something there. Also would cost 'em a little more to make clothes larger than size zero, I expect. Imagine all the girls, and I got stuck shopping with a couple of them one day, defining themselves as a "zero". And striving to do so.

Kate Middleton's said to be about 15 pounds underweight now, compared to when she and William were engaged. She's a busy girl, though- a Dutchess, even, as you mentioned. Hopefully the fact she's so busy is all there is to it for her. She's a lovely lady.
Woland
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Thanks, S2000.

critter, I think the girl in the picture probably is thin, but it is hard to tell how thin from that picture. She doesn't look happy, but I think that's the bored look they like them to have.

I don't think it is laziness on the part of the designers, magicalaurie, but the impression that the styles that are being created today drape better on a thin body, and achieve the look that the public wants to have.

As far as the Duchess of Cambridge's weight is concerned, I would take anything in the British press with a big grain of salt. Although they do seem to like her.

I still don't think you can legislate a change in the Zeitgeist.
magicalaurie
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Quote:
On 2012-03-23 13:51, Woland wrote:
...As far as the Duchess of Cambridge's weight is concerned, I would take anything in the British press with a big grain of salt. Although they do seem to like her...


I've got two seeing eyes of my very own, Woland. All you gotta do is take a look at a few pictures of the girl. No Xlarge grain of salt required.
critter
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"Thin as an envelope" was a joke... 'cause the coat is shaped like an envelope...
It must have been a bad joke since I'm explaining it Smile
"The fool is one who doesn't know what you have just found out."
~Will Rogers
magicalaurie
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Quote:
On 2012-03-23 13:51, Woland wrote:
...the impression that the styles that are being created today drape better on a thin body, and achieve the look that the public wants to have...


Again, what percentage of the general population does this "public" represent, Woland?
Woland
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Hi critter, the joke was understood, but the girl is thin. My point about the garment was just that nobody in their right mind would expect anyone to buy it for anything other than a fancy dress costume.

magicalaurie, I will defer to your judgment on the Duchess of Cambridge's appearance.

As to what percentage of the general population is represented by the fashion-buying and trend-setting "public" who want the look that the designers are trying to achieve, I would say no more than 15% or 25%, but that is not a scientific estimate, just an impression.
critter
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Ain't no thang.
"The fool is one who doesn't know what you have just found out."
~Will Rogers
mastermindreader
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Woland-

Here is a link to an article about a scientific study that has linked social pressure to be thin to anorexia. It is exactly the reason that underlies the Israeli legislation:

http://www.foxnews.com/health/2012/03/02......y-finds/
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