Hey everyone,

For those of you who follow my new YouTube project Magic Monday Madness, we've reached 2000 total views! Small potatoes, but as a thank you, here is the second bonus Teaching Session video, the "Vanishing Coin" trick:

http://youtu.be/7uJTN-4Qi8A

Even if you're not brand new to magic, you may have forgotten about this one. Great piece of impromptu magic that anyone can do.

If you enjoy, please subscribe to the channel and share with your friends on Facebook, Twitter, etc: http://www.youtube.com/MagicMondayMadness

Best,

Brian

When I see a "magic trick revealed" video on Youtube, I think it's done by a kid who believe magic is about tricks, is about showing off : "I know how it's done and you don't (but I'm a cool guy and I'll teach you, which will be good for my ego)".

But seeing someone who is, supposedly, a magician do that kind of stupid stuff makes me sad!

Mind you, I didn't write YOU were stupid -I certainly hope you're not- but that making such videos is. Think for a second about what magic IS. And about what you are trying to do (you, and thousands on kids):

- magic is about fooling your spectors, for their entertainement. It's about creating an illusion.
- but as for FX in movies, once you know "the trick" (how it's done), you can't be fooled anymore, even if you want to (you're unable to "suspend your disbelief")
- revealing secrets in a public place (Youtube) kills the pleasure of magic for the viewers. Of course, only those who want to know will watch -but EVERYBODY wants to know! It's our duty, as magicians, to protect their pleasure by keeping the secrets secret!
- you're not helping beginners by givong away "small secrets". First of all, thare are no "small secrets", only "small magicians". One of the strongest reactions I get is with a trick I "invented" when I was seven (I modified the presentation since then).
- you're helping reinforce the general idea that "magic is just tricks". Which is true, of course, but is somthing we all try to make the public accept to forget ("suspension of disbelief") for the time of the show.
- you hurt magic, because you reveal beginners tricks. And a beginner's trick is exactly that: a trick beginners perform. But you revealed it, increasing the risks of beginners being told "oh, I know how you do that..."


If your goal is only to feel important with more "likes" and subscribers, you won't care about what I wrote.
But if you really want to help beginners into magic, remove the "reveal" part of your videos. Perform nice tricks they'll want to perform to (and not only know how it's done), and don't make the lesson free: those who just wont to know usually wont go into the trouble of sending you a video of themselves performing a trick of their own, for instance (that's the way I separate the curious from the beginners).

But the best way to really help young magicians is not through Internet. It's "IRL". Of course, you reach fewer people, but you can achieve much, much better results.

LCervier: First, who are you? You've got no profile image, no real name, and no information whatsoever. If you want to have a legitimate discussion with working pros on the Café, best not to be anonymous.

Second, I provided a lesson in misdirection for those who want to learn. I believe that anyone who wants to learn magic should have access to basic tricks, from which they can springboard and further their education. What I taught can be found in the public domain and at any public library in basic books on magic. There is nothing wrong with this, and it is very much not exposure. Exposure is revealing something just for the sake of revealing it. What I've provided is a lesson. They are two very different things.

You say the best way to help young magicians is not through the Internet. Um, obviously. I teach group magic lessons to kids 7-12 and sleight of hand for teens and adults out of two different locations in Connecticut, as well as private house lessons with a handful of dedicated young people in my free time. I take a good chunk of time in order to do this, because I'm invested in and care about the art of magic continuing in the new generation. OF COURSE the best way to help young magicians is in person. But it's not the only way.

Did you even look me up? I'm a full time entertainer of nearly a decade. I do some 300 shows a year, and have been a very consistent and considerate contributor on the Café for 6 years.

Be careful before you and your 6 anonymous posts go spewing off like that.

Well, the fact you don't know me doesn't mean I'm wrong. The fact you're a pro donesn't mean you're right, and the number of shows you've performed in is irrelevant: Penn and Teller and reknown and talented magicians, they expose nevertheless.

Exposure can be done in different ways, beacause you missed a sleight or didn't pay attention to an angle for instance. Here, you expose because you want to give lessons to beginners, _in_public_.
The fact other people do if, the fact very good tricks have already been spoiled, donesn't mean you're right in following along.
You harm magic. You harm the pleasure of spectators, who want to know but need to be fooled.

Lay-kids who make reveal videos are forgivable. They should be told to stop and explained why -but you, as a professional magician, should know better. And it doesn't take years of practice nor hundreds of messages on this board to be able to tell you so.

I'm not anonymous, I'm just unknown. And remote (Southern France). I have some vids on YT (in French), with maybe 100 or 200 000 views in total. Videos where I do a trick and pretend to reveal it. I opened a small forum when I received too many requests from beginners. I asked for a proof they were really eager to learn magic, and not just curious. Usually, I asked for a video of a trick with "their own story". And then I would grant them access to the forum. At its peak, it hosted maybe 15 members. Not much. I wasn't seeking "followers" nor "subscribers". The forum eventually died off, when I stopped taking care of it for personal reasons. But at least 3 of our members went out to meet magicians IRL and the last time I heard of them, they were trying to become professionals.

Revealing secrets in public is exposure. Period.
If you want to give lessons to beginners, please do so. But sort out the beginners from the curious croud, and don't give your essons in public.

They'll be more effective.

And, I'm not happy with what you currently do, but I don't intend to be aggressive. Firm, but not aggressive

If you wish an ethical debate on exposurr, I direct you to the Ethics section of thr Café. There are hundreds of threads there. You'll find many who are just as confused and apparently angry as you are on what is exposure, and what is or is not ruining magic. If Internet "exposure" is hurting magic for you, you must be doing something wrong. That is my final comment on the matter in this thread.

Well, I'm not discussing exposure in general, I'm talking about what YOU do. Think about what YOU do: you explain good tricks _in_public_ . In your last message, you write that, if exposure hurts (one's) magic, then (this person) is doing something wrong. Think again about what you do: your viewers will see through a magician who performs the tricks you revealed -what's HE doing wrong???
And, moreover, what kind of magician is more likerly to perform the "basic" tricks you expose? Beginners! So who will suffer the most from the fact you explained tricks to lots of people who didn't care about magic but just wanted to know "how it's done"? The beginners you say you want to help into magic!!!

I know how good it feels to be the one who knows and expains. It's only human. That's probably why I'm an instructor, and that's why so many kids reveal tricks on YT, believeing it's a good way to show off. In their case (not yours), you know it's wrong: one moment you're a baffling magician, the next you're just a poor guy with a silly trick, not even smart enough to keep his secrets!

In YOUR case, it makes you expose tricks in public, thus hurting magic in many ways (other magicians, the spectators illusions and so on), whil wanting to teach beginners -I'm ready to believe you honestly want that. But ask yourself about what your true motivation is: do you want more pupils? Or more _subscribers_?

There's a (in)famous YT member, something822, who exposes dozens of very good tricks and has hundreds of subscribers. More than you. More than me. But should we care? He gets his number by revealing other magicians secrets, even newly marketed ones. But he has hundreds of subscribers. More than you. More than me. And that's what he told me when I sent him a message about his hurting magic, "you're jaleous".

Well, no, I'm not. I don't care. You shouldn't care.

Keep your lessons private. They'll be better. And you'll trully help people who trully want to at lest give magic a try. Without hurting magic. And you will still be able to attract subscribers, if that's what you want, with good tricks -and a trick is good as long as it is baffling (i.e. not explosed).

Oh! And by the way, you might want to _sell_ your lessons, and not give them away. I don't mean to say you must gave a mercantile approach, but that your "customers" must give something for your lessohns. The simplest payment ismoney, of course, but it can be some kind of work. Anyway, let not your lessons be 'free'. People's mind work in a fashion, that what's 'free' has no value. I was once a product manager for a paintball company; we would sign teams and give (the key word is there: 'give', 'for free') them equipment. I remember seeing masks, normally sold for $120 (retail), in the mud, because 'it was free'. You probably have such examples in mind too.
'If it's free, it has no value'.

Unlike you and much of the magic community, I don't believe the art of magic is about the keeping of secrets. It's about the beauty of a performance, the wonder, the presentation, the connection with an audience. The reason so many people absolutely hate magicians is because we have a notoriously awful reputation as being "know-it-alls" with our, "A magician never reveals his secrets" snotty attitude.

I've taught a couple simple tricks that can be found in any public library and indeed are in the public domain legally. I've done this so that anyone can learn one or two things that will make their friend, coworker, secretary, or even a complete stranger smile. Get off your high horse and temper your arrogant attitude that we are somehow special and are the only ones who should be allowed to learn a magic trick and spread a bit of wonder.

In all the years of however many performances I've given professionally, I have never ONCE had someone say, "Oh I know how that works. I saw it on YouTube." Why? Because it's not about the secret.

If you want more respect as a magician, let go of these tired attitudes and condescending thoughts. People might actually respect our profession if they knew just a little about what went into it (let them in on a few things). Did you ever consider that? No.

I agree the secret is not something that puts magicians "above the crowd". I agree that's the image lots of magicians (?) have and give. I agree magic is about entertaining -but what you overlook is the fact what we entertain with is _illusion_. And to make the illusion work, you need "special FX" that MUST be unknown to spectators, lest their brain doesn't let itself be fooled.

We must protect our secrets, not because they give us power, but because they are _necessary_ to entertain our spectators. Spectators are what we should have ultimately in mind. Their pleasure.

So, there IS a problem if at the end of your performance, people want to know "how you did it" more than they enjoyed the show. And at that point, if you don't explain anything you look like an iritating moron who asks riddles but won't tell the solution -or you have to "lert them in on some tricks", thus killing whatever magic feeling there might still be in the mind of your spectators.

I'm in a different position. I'm more a mentalist. Lots of people take me for real, whil they know that "magic is just tricks" -thanks to whom???
I try to follow many principles, one of which being "be nice to spectators". I would never make fun of a spectator to have th other laugh, for instance. Whether I do mentalism or magic, I don't show off: I _share_ something with them. That's my approach.

And when someone -usually a teen- asks me to teach him a trick, I always reply with a question "Do you know one?" Thay always do. "Show me...". And then, what I teach that person is how to improve that "silly trick from kindergarten" so it hits. I try to teach him that magic isn't about tricks, not more than SciFi movies are about CGI: it's about entertaining, sa you said, it's about a _story_, it's about illusion, what you want your spectators to believ -and then, last an least, it's about the mechanics you use.

The trouble with magic is the same as with SciFi movies (older one, before good CGI): if you "know the trick", if you know that, in fact, Batman isn't really climbing, the wall is horizontal and the camera angled, then all you see, no matter how hard you try, is "the trick". The illusion is lost. And in magic, that means thge entertainement is lost.

Protecting our secrets is not arrogant, it's not selfish. As a matter of fact, it's exactly the contrary: we care for our spectators.

Everybody knows how CGI works. You actually believe that the entire world's movie going audiences are now unable to enjoy every single movie that they spend billions of dollars on because they know how CGI works? No. They enjoy the movies in spite of knowing how it works, because knowing how it works isn't the point. The point is entertainment. Period.

EDIT:

In fact, the reason that every DVD has behind the scenes footage which shows you how the special effects were done is because people get great enjoyment out of knowing how it works! Not just enjoyment, but they get an appreciation and respect for the final result that they watched. It not only doesn't hurt the business, but it significantly benefits it by engaging the audience on different levels.

Hmmm... You shouldn't twist what I write. I carefully mentionned FX "before good CGI". Today's CGI makes it impossible to tell the difference between what was in front of the camera when the shooting occured, and what wasd not. Think of lower-tech effect: cables, puppets and so on. That's pretty much the level of technology in magic. If we could use CGI in magic, we wouldn't need misdirection. As a matter of fact, we wouldn't need sleights, we wouldn't need ANYTHING. Anyone with sufficient knowledge and the right computer can make a video displaying the most incredible magic effets, wihtout having a clue as how "real" magicians do it!

But we do our effects live, we can't use CGI. We must use old fashion manual techniques -that can't be hidden to the spectator's mind once he knows about them :-(

Do you enjoy old SciFi movies where the FX are obvious? No. Maybe you watch them with a smile, but you're not fooled like the early spectator (who didn't know, were not used yet) were.

Have you never told a fellow magician who had just baffled you "don't tell me how it's done"? "Let me savor thais magical moment...". I have.
I went into magic because I enjoyed the feeling of my brain just about to fall off a cliff... "But I SAW it happen !?... Am I losing my mind?" Of course not, and I knew it -but what a feeling! Then I started to learn. And now, most of the time, if I enjoy a magical show, it's not because I'm confronted with the impossible, it's because I appreciate the good work, like an expert will enjoy the perfection of a move. As if I were watching a dancer of a juggler.

I'm pretty sure you feel roughly the same. So, why not lay persons? Not all of them will recognize a technique they saw on YT, but the few who will won't enjoy the entertainement value of your show. To make things worse, they'll probably tell their friends, killing their illusion and therefor their pleasure as well. Even worse: lots of them (of those who know a few secrets) will believe they know how you do _even_if_they're_wrong_. And won't enjoy the pleasure of being mystified :-(

You know, I very otfen read or hear magicians say stuff like "they never see that" or "I did another routine using exactly the same trick and they didn't recognize it". I myself said things like that on a few occasions :-(
Well, sit among the public a few times, and listen to what they say... Lots of them KNOW, lots of them SEE (not the majority, but too many).

If they know the secret because they figured it out, then maybe the magician is at fault. But if they know the method because they were told by _another_ magician... :-( ... Who's to blame?

I don't picture you as one of the Apocalypse horsmen would will bring the magical world down, and I agree that the tricks you expose are already revealed in publicly-accessible books. But even if it's only a little, why widen the whole at the bottom of the boat???
Especially since not doing it wouldn't harm you, wouldn't prevent you from getting more subscibers (if that's what you're after), wouldn't prevent you from helping newcomers to magic -quite the contrary?

LCervier, I think you're having a "knee-jerk" reaction to seeing a good professional magician post a YouTube video. You obviously have a differing point of view and your own reasons to back it up. But I don't think you've thought a lot of things all the way through.

"But even if it's only a little, why widen the whole at the bottom of the boat???"
Really?? Brian's teaching videos are widening the hole in the bottom?? His one or two videos, as opposed to the multitude of videos exposing so much more? Then you would be satisfied with a two-cent raise on your paycheck, because it significantly "widened" your take-home pay. And if this _isn't_ significant, why are you wasting time complaining?

"Especially since not doing it wouldn't ... prevent you from helping newcomers to magic"
Are all the "newcomers" coming in to magic through books? Or through videos? Most have probably seen a performance that grabbed them, then Googled it and watched any video they could. Books are going by the wayside quickly - at least on this side of the Atlantic. Hardly any teen opens a book any more. So the next time a teen shows you the trick he knows, drill down to where it came from - I would be willing to bet that either he or a friend got it off the internet.

"Not all of them will recognize a technique they saw on YT, but the few who will won't enjoy the entertainement value of your show."
I totally disagree with this. In fact, on of Brian's show videos has him working a volunteer who understood props and misdirection: not only did the volunteer enjoy everything, so did the audience. THat's because Brian is an engaging and entertaining ... well, entertainer. He is not just a "trick meister"; he creates an environment where methods - known or not - are not the focus. Any time a performed holds up a bag or a box, it's immediately suspect. And some might recognize it. But if they enjoy themselves, who cares?
Yes, I _did_ enjoy the original Batman and Superman shows, as well as the Godzilla and giant ant movies. Even though you knew it was all faked and often horribly so - because it's all about creating a story / situation / environment that engages your audience and they are pleased to give *you* their focus - not your methods.

If Brian's videos are harming magic, then the Masked Magician killed it long ago and you shouldn't be here. If blatent exposure kills magic, then it was dead long ago from books and magazine articles and give-aways in cereal boxes.

But magic is alive and well. Adjustments to fit the digital age are needed, yes. But please save your energies for someone who is _really_ "harming magic" on YouTube. There are plenty out there to choose from.

Ed

The fact thousands of kids and scores of "magicians" expose tricks on YT or on TV doesn't make it right to join that crowd. Of course Valentino harmed magic a whole lot more than Brian's videos. But still, any public exposure harms magic, harms the pleasure of spectators, harms the work of other magicians.

Read "Magic and Showmanship", by Henning Nelms. It's on how to _entertain_ with magic, why magic entertains, what we should be careful to put -*or not to put*- in the mind of our spectators.

Valentino did absolutely nothing to harm magic. The only people who cared about his specials were magicians. I get people who ask me all the time, "What do you think of the masked magician?" And I ask those people if they remember how he did all the tricks. They haven't got a clue. They watched it, and forgot about it. Because the secret isn't the point, and believe it or not, lay people know that better than magicians. The entertainment is the point.

If anything, Valentino helped magic quite a bit. He got enough magicians thinking that they could no longer perform tired classics and forced everyone to come up with something new. And we did. This new generation of magicians is wildly innovative and inventive.

Had been looking for information on misdirection, this is a great example. Thanks

WorstKnight: Glad I could be of assistance.

Brian, thanks for the link. I'm new to magic and haven't spent a lot of time on misdirection, so this helps.