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jugglestruck Inner circle Wales 1038 Posts |
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acesover Special user I believe I have 821 Posts |
Sounds harsh. However they were convicted of murder which is rather harsh. They could have been found guilty and excuted. Not sure what to say here.
If I were to agree with you. Then we would both be wrong. As of Apr 5, 2015 10:26 pm I have 880 posts. Used to have over 1,000
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balducci Loyal user Canada 227 Posts |
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/culture/film/......-3..html
When King was eventually transferred to Angola State prison, Albert Woodfox and Herman Wallace were already there and fighting their own battle, having been charged for the murder of white prison guard Brent Miller. On April 17, 1972 23-year-old Miller had been left alone in a cell with over one hundred prisoners when another group had staged a protest in the kitchen, drawing staff from all over the prison. Sitting on a bunk drinking coffee, the recently married Miller was set upon and stabbed multiple times. Woodfox and Wallace, along with fellow prisoners Chester Jackson and Gilbert Montegut, were identified as the killers by fellow prisoner Hezekiah Brown. Woodfox was tried alone and convicted by an all white jury before Wallace and Montegut were tried together. Their trial took a dramatic turn when, on the second day, Chester Jackson returned from lunch and took a seat at the prosecutors table, announcing he had decided to admit to the lesser charge of manslaughter and testify against Wallace and Montegut. Montegut was lucky, he had a security officer from the prison as an alibi and was acquitted, Herman Wallace was convicted. These convictions have been considered unsafe for many years by supporters of Woodfox and Wallace, and with good reason. The prosecution's APOS star witness, Hezekiah Brown, who was serving a life sentence without parole for aggravated rape, was given his own house within the prison grounds as well as a weekly carton of cigarettes paid for by the state, shortly after testifying. Brown was then released in 1986 after a successful campaign by the warden. A bloody fingerprint found at the scene was only tested against Woodfox and Wallace and, when it didn't match, not checked against anyone else, a major oversight in an environment where everyone's fingerprints were on file. The prison authorities initially tried to involve Robert King in Miller's murder even though he was in a different prison at the time but they had to settle for putting him 'under investigation', condemning him to Close Cell Restriction, solitary confinement by another name, from the moment he arrived at Angola.
Make America Great Again! - Trump in 2020 ... "We're a capitalistic society. I go into business, I don't make it, I go bankrupt. They're not going to bail me out. I've been on welfare and food stamps. Did anyone help me? No." - Craig T. Nelson, actor.
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jugglestruck Inner circle Wales 1038 Posts |
In 1972, Albert Woodfox and Herman Wallace were first placed in solitary confinement. Four decades on, they remain in isolation. Sign our petition: end their cruel, inhuman and degrading treatment
Each man spends 23 hours of every day in a cell measuring 2m by 3m. That’s about five steps long and three steps wide. The only view is of a small space beyond the prison bars. In good weather, they are allowed a solitary hour in an outdoor cage three times a week. They have limited access to books and no opportunities for work or education. Social interaction is restricted to the occasional visit and limited phone calls. After living in these conditions for most of their lives, both Woodfox and Wallace suffer from serious health problems including osteoarthritis aggravated by lack of exercise, and functional impairment. On Tuesday 17 April, it will be exactly 40 years since the men were first placed in solitary confinement. We'll mark the date by handing in our petition to the Governor of Louisiana, Bobby Jindal, calling on him to end their ordeal. We need to gather as many names as possible before then, so please sign our petition to Governor Jindal now |
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LobowolfXXX Inner circle La Famiglia 1196 Posts |
Hopefully they're guilty, anyway.
Brent Miller, meanwhile, has spent the last 40 years in confinement measuring about 7' by 2' by 2.5'.
"Torture doesn't work" lol
Guess they forgot to tell Bill Buckley. "...as we reason and love, we are able to hope. And hope enables us to resist those things that would enslave us." |
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jugglestruck Inner circle Wales 1038 Posts |
Extraordinary.
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acesover Special user I believe I have 821 Posts |
Quote:
On 2012-04-04 16:38, LobowolfXXX wrote: After reading jugglestruck's post about their conditions I was thinking the same thing about Brent Miller's confinement. You beat me to it.
If I were to agree with you. Then we would both be wrong. As of Apr 5, 2015 10:26 pm I have 880 posts. Used to have over 1,000
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tommy Eternal Order Devil's Island 16544 Posts |
Didn't he go to heaven then?
If there is a single truth about Magic, it is that nothing on earth so efficiently evades it.
Tommy |
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MagicSanta Inner circle Northern Nevada 5841 Posts |
Good one Tommy! Let me check...killed a white guard, all honky jury, member of race based group, and held in solitary condinement under a no contact order often spending years w/out leaving the cell for any purpose since 1983... No, sorry, there is a difference, I am refering to Thomas Silverstein who been in true solitar w/ no help from amnesty intl, I wonder why?
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Chrystal Inner circle Canada/France 1552 Posts |
I'm really disgusted that these men are still being kept in such severe conditions. Nope, I'm not a bleeding heart either but to keep them in solitary confinement is cruel and unsual punishment. Even the widow of the slain prison guard thinks the punishment is harsh and has doubts as to their involvement.
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mastermindreader 1949 - 2017 Seattle, WA 12586 Posts |
Quote:
On 2012-04-06 10:14, acesover wrote: The problem here is that there are serious questions about their guilt. |
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MagicSanta Inner circle Northern Nevada 5841 Posts |
There are entire prisons under 23 hour lockdown for decades.
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jugglestruck Inner circle Wales 1038 Posts |
Quote:
On 2012-04-06 14:24, Chrystal wrote: Your sentiments are certainly not shared by Scott Ford, Chief of Police of the town next to Angola. He has just said on the radio; "I absolutely don't mind if somebody who took the life of somebody’s loved one doesn't see but an hour of sunlight a day. I'm probably more on the side which says that the one hour you let them see sunlight, if we could shave some time off that, that's better". |
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tommy Eternal Order Devil's Island 16544 Posts |
Scott Ford, Chief of Police is a pear shaped creature which are always cruel and unsual, so what's new?
If there is a single truth about Magic, it is that nothing on earth so efficiently evades it.
Tommy |
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LobowolfXXX Inner circle La Famiglia 1196 Posts |
Quote:
On 2012-04-06 14:34, mastermindreader wrote: I agree with you; there are certainly, however, those who think that's a problem, and not the problem, i.e. that even if they're guilty, the punishment is still problematic. That's not a camp I'm in, myself. If they're not guilty, then, clearly, ANY punishment is too harsh. If they are, well...that's 40 years' worth of hours more than their victim has had.
"Torture doesn't work" lol
Guess they forgot to tell Bill Buckley. "...as we reason and love, we are able to hope. And hope enables us to resist those things that would enslave us." |
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landmark Inner circle within a triangle 5194 Posts |
Quote:
On 2012-04-06 14:34, mastermindreader wrote: That's one problem, Bob, and would have to be argued on the evidence. What, however, is a matter of ethics and what speaks to our constitutional framework prohibiting cruel and unusual punishment regardless of guilt is the extensive solitary confinement. As Santa has pointed out, there are now whole prisons of inmates on 23 hour lockdown. This has been an increasing trend, and while not much in the public awareness, is something that is not becoming of Americans. A piece and video here about the effects of solitary confinement and why it is considered torture by many. While the desire for revenge is understandable, we are supposed to be a country that does not torture.
Click here to get Gerald Deutsch's Perverse Magic: The First Sixteen Years
All proceeds to Open Heart Magic charity. |
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landmark Inner circle within a triangle 5194 Posts |
Lobo, our posts crossed. Clearly we agree on the innocence part. But the latter part of your post seems to justify ANY treatment of those who have been convicted of murder. Is that your position?
Click here to get Gerald Deutsch's Perverse Magic: The First Sixteen Years
All proceeds to Open Heart Magic charity. |
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LobowolfXXX Inner circle La Famiglia 1196 Posts |
Quote:
On 2012-04-06 17:09, landmark wrote: No, it's not; it's just that solitary confinement doesn't cross the line for me. Particularly in a case where a murder took place in a prison and involved a guard; in that case, above and beyond everything else, there's a proven risk in the general population prison environment. Having said that, I haven't checked out your link yet, and I will. I'm open to changing my mind on that. Life without parole definitely doesn't cross the line, and I can't possibly see myself changing that position. The things that would cross the line would be physical torture, sleep deprivation for punishment, various forms of humiliation, and a maybe few other things that I can't think of off the top of my head.
"Torture doesn't work" lol
Guess they forgot to tell Bill Buckley. "...as we reason and love, we are able to hope. And hope enables us to resist those things that would enslave us." |
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critter Inner circle Spokane, WA 2653 Posts |
I consider solitary confinement to be one of the more extreme forms of punishment within our justice system. It can drive an average person insane. There are studies on that, but I'm lazy right now
That's not to say that I don't think it should be used, just that I don't take it lightly.
"The fool is one who doesn't know what you have just found out."
~Will Rogers |
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acesover Special user I believe I have 821 Posts |
OK. Lets look at the other side of the coin. What do yu believe should be their punishment assuming their guilt? Should they have a nice big cell with only themselves in the cell and the opportunity to mingle withthe other prisoners and perhaps a TV and of course their meals and medical attnetion. I am just asking what should their interment involve. Should they be allowed to as I mentioned before mingle with the others have acess to newspapers and as mentioned bfore Television and perhaps the books they want to read.
Many people outside of prison do not have it as good as some of those inside. Now before you jump on me just think...medical, food, shelter etc. I do not know the answer but punishment should fit the crime and I feel murder (taking anothers life) as about as serious as it gets. I amsure some here think diferently. Not saying I am right and they are wrong or vise versa...just saying, what is the answer?
If I were to agree with you. Then we would both be wrong. As of Apr 5, 2015 10:26 pm I have 880 posts. Used to have over 1,000
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