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presto77
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Hi , Guys has any one got this pouch is it Any Good ....................Thanks Mike U.K

http://www.theambitiouscard.com/aitem.cfm?itemid=72
Ekuth
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Don't use pouches myself, but I do know leatherwork...

And this is way overpriced. Cut that in half and then maybe... but $100 for a two section pouch? Ouch.
"All you need is in Fitzkee."
Harry Murphy
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Mike, any good for what? I have one in brown leather. I will tell you that the leather is soft and the pouch is backed with some kind of satin material to keep the leather from rubbing against your trousers. It is based on the Jim Cellini design (described in "The Royal Touch").

Some may consider the soft leather a downside. Heavy final loads will telegraph their presence to a discerning audience. I use baseballs and have had no problem. I also use an emptied coconut from time to time with no problem. A full coconut or a melon will drag the bag down. For those kinds of loads (if you use them) a hard faced leather pouch is more desirable (Gazzo, Gary Animal, Poacher’s pouch from Ambitious Card, etc.). Black leather would help hide the load bulges better than the brown.

However I consider the soft leather a plus. It works for the kinds of loads I use and more important it rolls up and packs in a very small space in my case. I can roll it up and tie it with the belt ties and get a bundle that is about 2” in diameter and about 12” long. Or fold it in half flat on the top of the case.

It is wider and shallower than the Ambitious Card Poacher’s pouch. It appears to be a two-pocket pouch but in truth it is one bag giving the illusion that it is two. There is a leather tab or shallow wall at the center that goes into the bag about 1 5/8 inch. It gives the illusion of being the divider between two bags. Below that tab the pouch is totally accessible from either side. Drop something in the right side and take it out from the right and the audience is none the wiser.

It ties rather than buckles. For some that is another downside for me it is a big plus.

It is well constructed, machine sewn. Mine has only 120 performance uses so far and looks like the day I bought it (and I bought it used and haven’t a clue how much it was used before me. Probably not much judging from how pristine it looked when I got it). I think that the corners at the mouth of the bag might need reinforcing with rivets at some point but so far they show no sign of stress. Again I use pretty light loads. If I was going to use heavy loads I’d probably go ahead and have the corners riveted.

It has two pockets (like hip pockets in a pair of Jeans) sewn inside against the back wall of the pouch. They will hold a deck of cards each or as I use it, a wallet set-up for card to wallet. There is a smaller “coin” pocket sewn centered on each of the pockets.

Again I ask “good for what?” The pouch you select should meet your performance needs. This pouch meets mine. Mileage may vary.
The artist formally known as Mumblepeas!
FunTimeAl
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I've had this one for about 7 years and love it. It's the best magic purchase I've ever made...and I've made plenty.

http://www.theambitiouscard.com/aitem.cfm?itemid=2
presto77
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Quote:
Thank you for your Good Advice ....................Mike
On 2012-04-26 17:30, Ekuth wrote:
Don't use pouches myself, but I do know leatherwork...

And this is way overpriced. Cut that in half and then maybe... but $100 for a two section pouch? Ouch.
Harry Murphy
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I don't know leather work other than a consumer of some custom made belts, handmade and custom boots, and a couple of deer skin tunics (all for period costume work), and two custom leather vests (waist coats). Most of my stuff cost a pretty penny. I don't know if the price on this pouch is high or not. $100.00 could be a lot. But then the hand made Gazzo pouch is $700.00 when you can get one. Gary Animal makes a Gazzo like pouch for about the same (maybe a couple of hundred less) when he makes them.

This design is way different than the Gazzo pattern. It is the design of Jim Cellini which he used for decades and then sold by him at his lectures. I believe that Frank made them for Jim to sell at the lectures.

The difference is in the routine. The Gazzo pattern is for multiple final loads with a final hat load (melon or coconut). Celini's is a different routine with fewer final loads and no hat load. Gazzo's is made to hide the very presence of the loads. Jim's sort of telegraphs them.

It's is horses for courses. You have to go for the pouch that suits your needs and serves your routine.

It is called an entry level pouch but will suffice until you know if you actually are going to perform the Cups and if you are going to busk. Is it over priced? I honestly don't know. Is it worth $100.00? Ah...only you can answer that.
The artist formally known as Mumblepeas!
Eduardo
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I buy one parlor pouch from Mike, two or three years ago, and its there for the curves... high quality...
Paddy
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I also have one of Frank's pouches and will say the quality matches Gazzo's work and the price is right!! You can't go wrong getting that pouch, you'll love it.
Non Impediti Ratione Cogitationis

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EVILDAN
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Quote:
On 2012-04-26 17:30, Ekuth wrote:
Don't use pouches myself, but I do know leatherwork...
And this is way overpriced. Cut that in half and then maybe... but $100 for a two section pouch? Ouch.


Please enlighten us as to your qualifications and expertise on leatherwork so that we may make a better informed decision.
by EVILDAN....
"The Coin Board Book" - moves and routines with the coin panel board. - http://www.lybrary.com/the-coin-board-book-p-827955.html
"SLASHER - A Horror Whodunnit" - a bizarre close-up routine based on Bob Neale's "Sole Survivor."
PM me for more info.
"Zombie Town" - a packet effect about how a small town turned into zombies. https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=nzJhcoJtyOM
Octopus Sun
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That's great price/deal for a very very good buskers pouch.
you can't go wrong with that buy, or you could try and make one for yourself.
hmmm, time, effort, finding the leather you like, yada yada
may cost you more than 100, and do you have the skills
and craft knowledge to sew one yourself? Leather work is not easy.
Eric Evans
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I've seen the pouch and it looks to be reasonably priced to me. I would change the design ever-so- slightly, but it is a very nice entry level pouch.
Ekuth
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Quote:
On 2012-04-27 09:07, EVILDAN wrote:
Quote:
On 2012-04-26 17:30, Ekuth wrote:
Don't use pouches myself, but I do know leatherwork...
And this is way overpriced. Cut that in half and then maybe... but $100 for a two section pouch? Ouch.


Please enlighten us as to your qualifications and expertise on leatherwork so that we may make a better informed decision.


Alright, I've been working leather and mixed media including furs for over 20 years; everything from deerskin, sueded hides, rawhide, both cured and uncured.

I've made belts, pouches, backpacks, bags, mocassins, boots, shoes, scabbards, quivers and custom work. I've done relief carving, stamping, beadwork and multi-color dying as well as bas-relief effect, including negative and positive impression designs.

I have pieces I made in the 80's still in active use today, so I think I'm fairly well qualified.

This is a basic pouch with one divider, a tie belt strap and several slit pockets that could easily be made for a cost of around $20 for materials, given the split-suede shown. Heavier weight (ounce) material would be more.

What you're paying for here is the time of the craftsman.

I'm not demeaning the product or the quality thereof, simply saying that it suffers from outrageous markup.
"All you need is in Fitzkee."
TheAmbitiousCard
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Several people over the years have agreed with you Ekuth and, instead of purchasing one of my pouches, they went to the hardware store, bought tool belts, or bought ladies purses, etc. and used those, only to have them fall apart soon thereafter and eventually got around to buying one of my pouches anyway.

If the materials are $20, let's say the craftsman gets a measly $30 to make it, that's $50. And we don't use split-suede because it's not strong enough and my customers would not be happy with it. So you'll need to add more $ for better leather. (PLEASE DON'T TELL PEOPLE WE USE CHEAPER MATERIALS THAN WE ACTUALLY DO IN A PUBLIC FORUM)

So already, a doubling of the cost would not be considered "outrageous" by any stretch of the imagination

I have to add some markup to help pay for: the prototypes, fuel to acquire the pouches, or postage to send it to me,
there are details/re-enforcing on the pouch that you don't see from the photographs, and I actually communicate with my customers about how to use them or to help if they have questions (unlike 99% of the products on the market). Magic items don't have huge demand so I couldn't have 1000 made in China even if I wanted to. I pay for monthly storage for products, I pay for my website, newsletter services, monthly paypal business account so I can accept credit cards, not to mention 3% of each sale going to paypal, business checking account, on and on and on.... hundreds of dollars per month... Oh. and some profit to help me maintain and invest in the business.

I also guarantee the pouches forever, even if they are re-sold.

If you think it's overpriced don't get one, but to say "outrageous markeup" is a wee bit ... outrageous.

Its' easy to make something cheap once and walk away. Try making them affordable over and over again and standing behind your products is a whole different ballgame.
www.theambitiouscard.com Hand Crafted Magic
Trophy Husband, Father of the Year Candidate,
Chippendale's Dancer applicant, Unofficial World Record Holder.
Ekuth
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Whoa, whoa, Frank; I wasn't stepping on your toes, bro- just giving my opinion. Which, as my wife continually tells me, is worth about... squat. Well, with her, anyway.

In fact, I didn't even know it was your site until I just saw the link in your sig line.

And you are correct, there are a myriad of factors to consider when you're producing for mass consumption. I was speaking of a one-shot piece only- not mass distribution.

Sorry for the mis-identification of the split-suede; that's what it looked like in the pictures- roughly 6 oz. However, as you know, it's difficult to tell from a picture. I was making an educated guess, not an exact prediction.

I'm certain it's a fine pouch that will last a lifetime. The construction looks very solid, you've obviously put a lot of thought into the design and you have a right to be proud of your creation. You also have a right to be fairly compensated for your time and effort.

Ultimately, the price point you set is entirely up to you, and what the market will bear.

Me, I'm a DIY guy, always have been. I believe my grandmother called it being "Scotch". As a craftsman, I tend to look at things with a more critical eye than most and tend to be very blunt in my appraisal.

As said, I wasn't knocking the product at all; simply pointing out it could be made for less and the pricepoint seemed high.

I have a great respect for any craftsman who is willing to put his product out there and stand by it, sounds like you do that.

Best of luck with your business, and my apologies if I ruffled any feathers; it wasn't intended.

*tips hat*
"All you need is in Fitzkee."
TheAmbitiousCard
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Thanks for the follow-up.

Actually, that particular pouch was designed to give beginners an options without:
a. having to buy an expensive pouch when they are just trying out the idea of busking.

b. keeping thriftier customers from wasting money at the hardware store or goodwill with a tool belt or a ladies purse that's just going to fall apart.


It wasn't ever intended to be a big money maker.
www.theambitiouscard.com Hand Crafted Magic
Trophy Husband, Father of the Year Candidate,
Chippendale's Dancer applicant, Unofficial World Record Holder.
EVILDAN
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What are you paying for when you hire a magician for a party? You're not paying for the props because you don't get to keep them at the end of the show. You're paying for the labor...for the expertise. In the case of Frank's leather products, you ARE paying for labor and materials because you're getting the product.

Frank does nice work. I have the deluxe padded jester bag for cups and balls and the poacher's pouch. Both have served me extremely well over 5 years now and don't show much wear and tear except for a little on the exterior of the leather, and that's just from being banged around all over the place.

Fine craftsmanship is a rare thing these days. I'd rather give Frank a couple extra bucks knowing I'm getting a quality product rather than saving money the first time around on a cheaply made version. I'm a do-it-yourself kind of guy myself. However, when you need things to look good and function well, it's always better to go straight to the pros, rather than wasting time and money yourself only to go to the pros anyway.
by EVILDAN....
"The Coin Board Book" - moves and routines with the coin panel board. - http://www.lybrary.com/the-coin-board-book-p-827955.html
"SLASHER - A Horror Whodunnit" - a bizarre close-up routine based on Bob Neale's "Sole Survivor."
PM me for more info.
"Zombie Town" - a packet effect about how a small town turned into zombies. https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=nzJhcoJtyOM
leomagnus
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After reading various threads full with glowing reviews of Frank's craftsmanship, I just ordered one of these.

http://www.theambitiouscard.com/aitem.cfm?itemid=61

CAN'T WAIT!!!!!!!
EVILDAN
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I'm sure you'll find it well worth the investment.
by EVILDAN....
"The Coin Board Book" - moves and routines with the coin panel board. - http://www.lybrary.com/the-coin-board-book-p-827955.html
"SLASHER - A Horror Whodunnit" - a bizarre close-up routine based on Bob Neale's "Sole Survivor."
PM me for more info.
"Zombie Town" - a packet effect about how a small town turned into zombies. https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=nzJhcoJtyOM
presto77
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Quote:
Thank you do you use it for all loads Mike
On 2012-04-27 05:36, Eduardo wrote:
I buy one parlor pouch from Mike, two or three years ago, and its there for the curves... high quality...
Eduardo
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Quote:
On 2012-04-29 14:54, presto77 wrote:
Quote:
Thank you do you use it for all loads Mike
On 2012-04-27 05:36, Eduardo wrote:
I buy one parlor pouch from Mike, two or three years ago, and its there for the curves... high quality...



I mean, a parlor pouch from Frank the ambitiouscard... My mistake... its good stuff...
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