It's interesting how long this thread has gone on.

Sometimes people answer the OP's question with a response that essentially says, "TO ME, mentalism is ______________ ." That kind of statement presumes that all definitions are equal, that reality is subjective and that the definition is determined by the individual. Some people don't know up from down, yet - how could their definitions be given as much weight as that of a founding member of the PEA, for example? At risk of offending a few readers, who cares what mentalism is TO YOU? I want to know what mentalism is to all of us.

If everyone has their own definition of what mentalism is as a performance art, then there is no definition. In that case the idea to which the word "mentalism" refers isn't clear. We can't have a conversation about anything without agreed upon definitions.

When you look at the history of mentalism, what it was when it began, and when examine the performances of famous mentalists through the decades (such as Fay, Alexander, Dunninger, Kreskin, Geller, Brown) though they claim different abilities, you find a common thread that connects them all... believability, or at least plausibility. Many audience members believed the abilities of these performers might be real, whether they claimed to be mediums, mindreaders, hypnotists, body language experts, etc. Even when some mentalists give heavy disclaimers and tell the audience they're using trickery, audience members approach afterward asking to have their futures foretold. The show, despite disclaimers, is believably acted.

If you're a Mental Magician, where's the shame in that if your audiences like what you do? I guess some performers who think they're mentalists will take offense when they discover their audiences perceive them as magicians. They believe they've just been knocked down one rung on the ladder of the "performance hierarchy" described by Stewie Griffen (reprinted here with one alteration):

Legitimate theater
Musical theater
Stand-up
Ventriloquism
(Mentalism?)
Magic
Mime

Lately I've backed away from performing as a mentalist because, try as I have to disclaim supernatural abilities, ladies still approached after my Q&A act asking me about their futures. In almost all cases I had already stated that I didn't know the future and couldn't answer questions about it. The audience believed the experience of the show, not the disclaimer.

When mentalism is done right, it's easy for people to believe you have special insight into their lives. I don't want to mess with people's belief systems or help lead them in any way to con-artists and their dry wells. There's too much confusion in the world already. I just want to entertain people by fooling them. For conscience' sake I may have to knock myself down a rung. If I do, I may not call myself a "mental magician", but that's essentially what I'll be. I have to do what my conscience agrees with in order to enjoy my performances and to act with conviction.

Mike,

You are speaking in terms of "definition" regarding art. I do not believe mentalism can be defined definitively, as it is an art form. When I said..."mentalism is...blank..." I was not defining mentalism, I was offering my subjective opinion, and what it means to me. When viewing mentalism as an art form, is not all art subjective?

I do however believe there is a definitive difference between mental magic and mentalism (what this thread is supposed to be about).

You say..."Some people don't know up from down, yet - how could their definitions be given as much weight as that of a founding member of the PEA?" Again, you're speaking in terms of definition regarding something that is subjective. This is not a battle to define "mentalism".

As for the comment... "Who cares what mentalism is to YOU, I want to know what mentalism is for all of us". The second part of this statement contradicts the first part. How can you expect to know what mentalism is for all of us, without knowing what it is for one person? The "us" is created by the "you". Because art is subjective, it will mean different things for different people.

For you, it's "a way to entertain the audience by fooling them". For me, it's something deeper than that. Neither approach or perspective is right or wrong. Art cannot be right nor wrong. Art is art.

Lastly, you say..."If you're a Mental Magician, where's the shame in that if your audiences likes what you do? I guess some performers who think they're mentalists will take offense when they discover their audiences perceive them as magicians. They believe they've just been knocked down one rung on the ladder of the "performance hierarchy".

No one has said anything in regards to this. There is no shame in being a "mental magician". The topic is about what the difference is between mental magic and mentalism.

Humbly,
Matthew

Matthew, I don't have time to respond right now, except to say my post wasn't directed at you, exactly. It couldn't be. I didn't read your post. But I am criticizing the refusal to accept that definitions apply to everyone. Of course I agree that a definition which applies to the individual applies to everyone. While there are differences in the way even the famous mentalists I mentioned approach their performances, there are similarities between all of them that cannot be ignored or you lose the essence of what mentalism is. I'm not dictating that everyone perform as I do or with the same intentions. I'm looking for a consensus that mentalism must be believable or it ceases to be mentalism.

I remember asking once, "what does that painting mean?" Someone answered, "it means whatever you think it means." "Oh," I thought, "in other words it means nothing because the painter didn't even know what he intended to communicate. How useless." Subjective statements only tell us about the feelings and opinions of the individual, not about anything that exists outside that person.

This may seem controversial at first, but it is not. We have no access to objective reality, whatever that may be. We are forced to know reality solely through our individual perceptions. All our knowledge is necessarily subjective. Even device measurements require subjective interpretation by experimenters. We can achieve consensus, but this is not a guarantee of knowing truth. In a very real sense, we do not know what we do not know. We cannot therefore really truthfully and factually say that anything is 'impossible'; simply that we have no experience of it. This is why there is disagreement, debate and sometimes dissension.

If we follow this thinking, we realize that the best we can hope to achieve is a highly tentative group consensus which may in fact prove to be wrong. Belief the world was flat appears to have been such an example. Of course there are philosophers and, today, scientists who are convinced that nothing material exists: that we actually exist in some form of cosmic virtual reality.

So the 'truth' as such is grounded ultimately in the subjective impression of the individual, whatever and whoever that may be. Every perception is 'right', and we might as well accept that fact. True, those that live to argue won't be happy with this but that is the state of things.

True. We cannot, because of the filters through which we perceive the universe, see objective reality.

But there is a consensus reality that is generally agreed upon that enables us to function. And part of that consensus is a fundamental agreement as to what words mean. When everyone defines terms differently, accurate communication becomes difficult if not impossible.

If "mentalism" means anything one wants it to mean, it has no meaning at all.

Can we all agree on this?

Mentalism is a performing art in which its practitioners, known as mentalists, appear to demonstrate highly developed mental or intuitive abilities. Performances may appear to include telepathy, clairvoyance, divination, precognition, psychokinesis, mediumship, mind control, memory feats and rapid mathematics. Hypnosis may also be used as a stage tool. Mentalists are sometimes referred to as psychic entertainers.

Contents [hide]
1 Background
2 Performance approaches
3 Mentalist or magician
4 Notable mentalists
5 Historical figures
6 Mentalism in television
7 See also
8 References
9 External links
Background[edit]
Much of what the modern mentalist performs in his or her act can be traced back directly to tests of supernatural power that were carried out by mediums, spiritualists and psychics in the 19th Century.[attribution needed] However, the history of mentalism goes back even further. Accounts of seers and oracles can be found in works by the ancient Greeks[attribution needed] and in the Old Testament of the Bible. Among magicians, the mentalism performance generally cited as one of the earliest on record was by diplomat and pioneering sleight-of-hand magician Girolamo Scotto in 1572.

The performance of mentalism may utilise similar principles, sleights and skills as street magic or stage magic.[1]

Performance approaches[edit]
Styles of presentation can vary greatly. A few performers, in the mold of Uri Geller, or James Van Praagh, claim to actually possess supernatural powers such as telepathy, clairvoyance, precognition, or telekinesis.

Many contemporary performers, including Richard Osterlind, Banachek, Max Maven, and Derren Brown, attribute their results to mundane skills, such as the ability to read body language or to manipulate the subject subliminally through psychological suggestion. The ability to read body language, brain hacking and detecting lies is also very remarkable in this category. where Paul ekman( book Telling Lies), Joe navarro (FBI Agent Ret.) (book What Every Body Is Saying) has contributed a lot. Prashant A Mahajan (India) is very new upcoming, claim to be the Fastest Human Lie detector in this area.[citation needed]

Mentalist or magician[edit]
Mentalists generally do not mix "standard" magic tricks with their mental feats. Doing so associates mentalism too closely with the theatrical trickery employed by stage magicians. Many mentalists claim not to be magicians at all, arguing that it is a different art form altogether. The argument is that Mentalism invokes belief and when presented properly, is offered as being "real" be it a claim of Psychic ability or proof that supports other claims such as a Photographic Memory, being a Human Calculator, the Power of Suggestion, NLP, etc.

Magicians ask the audience to suspend their belief and allow their imagination to play with the various tricks they present; they admit that they are tricksters and entertainers and the audience understands that the lady really isn't sawn in half nor can the performer actually fly or make exceptionally large objects vanish into thin air. . . it's all Illusion. There is however a "cross over" between these two worlds known as "Mental Magic" -- effects that have the feel of something psychic or mentally phenomenal and yet incorporate a series of physical devices that lend to the public a plausible explanation tied to trickery

Many magicians, however, mix mentally themed performance with magic illusions. For example, a mind-reading stunt might also involve the magical transposition of two different objects. Such hybrid feats of magic are often called mental magic by performers. Magicians who routinely mix magic with mental magic include David Copperfield, David Blaine, The Amazing Kreskin and Dynamo (Steven Frayne)

Notable mentalists[edit]

This list of "famous" or "notable" persons has no clear inclusion or exclusion criteria. Please help to define clear inclusion criteria and edit the list to contain only subjects that fit those criteria. (August 2012)
Alexander
Theodore Annemann
Banachek
Keith Barry
Luca Volpe
Richard Webster
Robert Nelson
Ron Martin
Burling Hull
Kenly Craighill
Vlad Grigorescu
John Riggs
David Berglas
Derren Brown
Paul Brook
Patrick Redford
Luke Jermay
Kuda Bux
Nefesch
James Randi
Chan Canasta
Bob Cassidy
Corinda
George Tait
Davenport brothers
Paul W. Draper
Shawn Spencer
Joseph Dunninger
Cristian Gog
Kellar O'Neil
Mark Edward
Glenn Falkenstein
Uri Geller
Haim Goldenberg
Nimrod Harel
Axel Hellstrom
Matt the Knife
Al Koran
The Amazing Kreskin
Gary Kurtz
Max Maven
Gerry McCambridge
Richard Osterlind
Marc Paul
Bennett Parry
The Piddingtons
Morgan Strebler
Frances Willard
The Zancigs
Neil Tobin, Necromancer
John Edward
Emran Riaz
Deddy Corbuzier
Alain Nu
[Prashant A Mahajan (Human Lie Detector)]
Historical figures[edit]
Mentalism techniques have, on occasion, been allegedly used outside the entertainment industry to influence the actions of prominent people for personal and/or political gain. Famous examples of accused practitioners include:

Erik Jan Hanussen, alleged to have influenced Adolf Hitler[2]
Grigori Rasputin, alleged to have influenced Tsarina Alexandra[3]
Wolf Messing, alleged to have influenced Joseph Stalin[4]
Count Alessandro di Cagliostro, accused of influencing members of the French aristocracy in the Affair of the Diamond Necklace
"The Amazing Kreskin" has audience members hide his checks before the show; if Kreskin cannot find the check at the end of his performance, he does not get paid.

Mentalism in television[edit]
America's Got Talent: Eric Dittelman, a mind reader, performed on Season 7 of the NBC talent competition America's Got Talent. He was eliminated in the semifinals.
Romania's Got Talent: Cristian Gog, a mentalist, won the big prize.
Romania's Got Talent,: Vlad Grigorescu, a mentalist, won the second prize.
Romania's Got Talent: Alexandru Ionut Marcu, a mentalist, was eliminated in the semifinals.
The Mentalist: an American crime procedural television series in which the main character, Patrick Jane, worked as an independent consultant for the California Bureau of Investigation and later the Federal Bureau of Investigation, solving serious crimes by using his skills of observation and his frequent use of his abilities as a former professional mentalist.
Psych: an American criminal comedy-drama television series in which the main character, Shawn Spencer, works as a consultant to the Santa Barbara Police Department as a "psychic detective." Though he purports to be a psychic, the truth is that his exceptional observational skills, amazing vision, and near-photographic memory allow him to portray himself as such.
Deception with Keith Barry: Discovery Channel.
Sherlock (TV series): Sherlock is a British television crime drama that presents a contemporary adaptation of Sir Arthur Conan Doyle's Sherlock Holmes detective stories
Tricks of the Mind: a British TV show starring Derren Brown.
Pasąmonės Kontrolė: Kobra TV Channel by Nicholas Kin.
Now You See Me: Merritt McKinney, played by Woody Harrelson, portrays a mentalist.
The Next Mentalist (TV show): an Indonesian TV show about 11 mentalists who compete with each other to show who is the best and chosen as the next mentalist of Master Mentalist Deddy Corbuzier
The Mysterious World of Alain Nu on TLC
See also[edit]

This "see also" section may contain an excessive number of suggestions. Please ensure that only the most relevant suggestions are given and that they are not red links, and consider integrating suggestions into the article itself. (July 2012)
Cold reading
Eccentrics
Idealism
James Randi
Telepathy
Materialism
Memory sport
Mnemonist
Psychomagic
Scientific skepticism
Si Stebbins
The Great Buck Howard (film)
The Mentalist (TV series)
Theatrical seances
Thirteen Steps To Mentalism (book)
References[edit]
Jump up ^ Randi, James (1995). "An Encyclopedia of Claims, Frauds, and Hoaxes of the Occult and Supernatural". St. Martin's Press. Retrieved 2008-03-28.
Jump up ^ Gordon, Mel: "Hanussen: Hitler's Jewish Clairvoyant". Feral House, 2001
Jump up ^ George King, The Last Empress: The Life and Times of Alexandra Feodorovna, Tsarina of Russia. Replica Books, 2001. ISBN 978-0-7351-0104-3
Jump up ^ Hamilton-Parker, Craig (December 1, 1996). "Medium with a message". Scotland on Sunday. p. 5.
External links[edit]
Media related to Mentalists at Wikimedia Commons
Mentalist in An Encyclopedia of Claims, Frauds, and Hoaxes of the Occult and Supernatural
PSYCRETS British Society of Mystery Entertainers
Mentalist associations

Psychic Entertainers Association.
PSYCRETS The British Society of Mystery Entertainers
Mentalist conventions

MINDvention is an annual convention of mentalists.
Tabula Mentis A twice yearly event sponsored by PSYCRETS
http://www.mentalismwizzard.com

No. I disagree with almost everything in that Wikipedia article that you posted verbatim.

Mentalism is simply the art of presenting seemingly paranormal abilities, particularly mind reading, as a form of entertainment.

I got this far and lost interest or confidence. How about those who ACTUALLY DEMONSTRATE such things? "Highly developed?" Relative to the average observer any performer has that. Etc. "Paranormal" or even "exceptional" are different from "highly developed." How about demonstrating (or claiming) innate abilities considered "other than normal" by most folks?

Why no mention of pendulum work or other "little known" innate abilities of all humans?

What about the demonstration of "highly developed mental or intuitive abilities" out side of the entertainment venue?

I can agree with Bob that the term "Mentalist" should probably be limited to the performing arts, but then what do we call other demonstrations that the lay audience will label as Mentalism?

Largely because of Bob's influence I no longer use term "mentalism" unless I am performing for entertainment. That doesn't mean that friends don't call me that behind my back.

Limit the term (or confuse it all you wish) That has little relationship to what actually occurs in the mind of an observer.

LOL!

At the moment, this is one of the most interesting Topics here in Penny...
Bob, would like to contact you, regarding your book "Artful Mentalism of Bob Cassidy: Fundamentals". Could I send you a pm?
Thanks!
Hans

Yes.

The really funny part is that he cut and pasted the entire article EXCEPT for the notice that appears at the top.

Here it is:

With all due respect, you must be the change you wish to see in the world. If you have issues with the definition, you should help in making changes to help it reflect your reality. If a few mentalists define mentalism differently than a few billion users of wikipedia, that could be problematic in the sense that our audience's perceptions are being molded incorrectly.


quote]On May 21, 2014, mastermindreader wrote:


The really funny part is that he cut and pasted the entire article EXCEPT for the notice that appears at the top.

Here it is:

[/quote]

The fact that an inaccurate article appears on Wikipedia (surprise) hardly means that it represents the opinons of "a few billion" users of Wikipedia.

The official Wikipedia disclaimer at the top of the article accurately states that the article has "multiple issues," is unverified and requires the attention of an expert on the subject.

And, no, with all due respect, it is NOT my responsibility to change it.

The only part that I disagree with you is that it is our collective responsibility to help our art. Yes, as a practitioner, it is your responsibility just as it is mine. We must all do all that we can to help educate the public on what mentalism truly is and not sit silently knowing that sources comtinue to mislead. I feel the same way about piracy. If I think there is fraud, and if I am not a consumer, I don't sit back and say its not my responsibility. As others (I hope) would do, I report it and try to make a positive change. We are all responsible to ensure the health of our industry.


quote]On May 21, 2014, mastermindreader wrote:
The fact that an inaccurate article appears on Wikipedia (surprise) hardly means that it represents the opinons of "a few billion" users of Wikipedia.

The official Wikipedia disclaimer at the top of the article accurately states that the article has "multiple issues," is unverified and requires the attention of an expert on the subject.

And, no, with all due respect, it is NOT my responsibility to change it. [/quote]

I disagree- It is NOT my or any other mentalist's "responsibility" to "educate the public" about what mentalism is. If it was, I'd write my books for the general public.

One question: don't we educate the public about what mentalism is every single time we perform? I just think we must be the change we wish to see in the world.

No. We show them mentalism as we wish them to perceive it.

Posting accurate descriptions of mentalism publicly would simply be exposure.

Educating the public on what mentalism is...that is not the same thing as exposure, in my opinion.

Mental magic, Mentalism, What is the big deal! It is all illusion, no matter if you perform it as real or fake! Why do we care if the public knows the difference, when it does not matter in the first place. I say we stop posting on this forum, because some of you sound like your getting angry.