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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Smooth as silk » » Oh, ye sages of old, please come forth... (0 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

TSW
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Ohio, USA
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I need thee to, once again, impart thy great knowledge.


(I posted this in the Secret Sessions forum and it was suggested that I might have better look posting it here, in the Smooth as Silk forum)


OK, so, some 40 or so years ago, when I was no more the size of a black-art well table, I saw a magician perform at a Masonic Lodge in Columbus, Ohio. He did a scarf routine in blue spotlight. It included self-tying and untying knots and the multiple penetration of a large ring, I think. The scarf was too large and heavy for a reel (I believe); held by it's corner, it was at least half the size of the magician (24"-36") and very opaque. And the metal ring was almost the size of a linking ring, but could not have been as heavy. I'm sure (now) that there must have some thread involved.

Does this "non-mechanical" type of serpentine silk routine seem familiar to anyone? Does anyone else remember seeing such a routine? Is there a book or lecture notes somewhere that contains this type of thread work? Or are my memories foggier than I think?

Thanks for any help you could provide and for indulging me this trip down memory lane!


P.S. The more I learn and more deeply immersed I become in magic, the more I appreciate the old guys and their "old-school" methods!
Bill Hegbli
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Eternal Order
Fort Wayne, Indiana
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There are many ring and rope/silk moves that can be performed this way. Nothing is in print or video that I know of involving thread work with a ring and silk.

But, you can try this routine here, sort of combines what you are speaking about:

http://www.stevensmagic.com/index.php?ma......_id=8002

As far as your question concerning the untying silk, Rice Silk King Studio still sells it.

http://www.silkkingmagic.com/Rice's%20Knotty%20Silks.htm

This has nothing to do with ring penetrations, only tying and untying knot in silk.
Vietnam Veteran 1967, Sgt. E-5

Graduate of Chavez College of Prestidigitation and Showmanship

"Magic With A Twist Of Comedy"
Mary Mowder
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Sacramento / Elk Grove, CA
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It was often done without a reel.

A black thread was used and quite a thick one too, like carpet or upholstery thread.

Rice's Encyclopedia of Silk Magic, Vol. 2 page 888 looks like a good place to start.

-Mary Mowder
Anatole
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In addition to the great Rice source that Mary recommends, there are these sources you may want to investigate for a non-mechanical serpent silk handling:
1) Anverdi's first set of lecture notes: Anverdi's Lezing/Seminar/Lecture if you can find a copy.
or
2) Bohleno's Mysteries--You can read a description of the routine at:
http://www.lybrary.com/bohlenos-mysterie......b11f9b2d

Perhaps other magicians familiar with Anverdi and Bohleno's work will comment on this recommendation.

Howie Schwarzman's performance and lecture of the Bohleno routine is exceptional.

----- Amado "Sonny" Narvaez
----- Sonny Narvaez
Harry Murphy
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I agree with Anatole/Sonny on Bohleno's little booklet. It has a wonderful tossing three different size rings on and taking them off a large scarf. It is very, very low tech that's for sure. Howie Swartzman performed the routine sort of "impromptu" in Denny's shop about five-ish years ago and floored everyone. It is so old it could be new again.
The artist formally known as Mumblepeas!
TSW
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Ohio, USA
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Bill, you seem to be the "go-to" guy for most everything. Thank you. The Johnny Hirose & Rice material seems like a good place to start!

Anatole and Harry I also like the looks of the Bohleno's Mysteries on Lybrary.com. And the price is right.. just $5. for the PDF download of 5 routines.

Looks like I'm going to have enough to keep me busy for awhile.

Thanks all!
JNeal
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The Bohleno routine is in the Silk encyl. in a brief descriptive version. the Anverdi material is first class as well and the lecture notes cover it perfectly.
The lecture notes are well illustrated and make learning rather easy...I also recommend it highly!
Regards-
J.Neal
visit me @ JNealShow.com
Anatole
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I'm not sure whether to be flattered at being addressed as a "sage of old"... but I guess it's apropos
:)


----- Sonny
----- Sonny Narvaez
Gerald
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Texas
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I don't know how much of a sage I am, but I am pretty old. Smile

You might have a look at "OHO!" from the book "Okito on Magic" by Theo Bamberg and Robert Parrish.

Cheers,
Gerald
TSW
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Ohio, USA
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Relax fellas. I called upon those who 'knew' about the old ways of doing things, not necessarily those who were old, who were doing things! Sage merely references your vast knowledge and experience. Which all of you have generously shared and I appreciate it. Were only as young as we feel, right? And nothing makes me feel younger than that joy and amazement I get from magic; What say you?
motown
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I think the folks here new what you meant.
"If you ever write anything about me after I'm gone, I will come back and haunt you."
– Karl Germain
Anatole
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Motown is right. My tongue was firmly planted in my cheek when I posted my comment about being called a "sage of old." In fact, one of my favorite quotes is from Chelsea Quinn Yarbro's book about the alchemist Ragoczy Saint Germain:
"I was old when Caesar ruled in Rome. I heard Aristotle teach. Ahkenaten praised the bust that I commissioned of his beloved Nefertiri in Amarna. No one has found its ruins yet, but I walked there when the city was new."
(From _Hotel Transylvania_)

----- Amado "Sonny" Narvaez
----- Sonny Narvaez
Dick Oslund
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Sonny! I am copying that quote from Hotel Transylvania!!! You have made my day!

Gerald! Yes,also. Jay Marshall 'put out' OHO as a prop about 40 years ago. It's seldom seen, but I think it's great. Jay sold a 3" ring and a 5". I found a 2 3/4' to go with the 3" -- carries easier in pocket.

OHO is another of those nice flashy walk a round items. Highly visual effect and visible props.

BTW, my copy of OKITO's Magic, is signed by Robert, George, and Okito--it's the numbered edition. Ha! Further BTW:::all the great magicians are dying off. I don't feel too good myself. (OY that's an old one!)



Recently, in the rings an ropes forum. someone provided sources for rings at very reasonable prices.sssss
SNEAKY, UNDERHANDED, DEVIOUS,& SURREPTITIOUS ITINERANT MOUNTEBANK
Dick Oslund
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OOOOps I meant RINGS STRINGS AND THINGS for sources of rings.
SNEAKY, UNDERHANDED, DEVIOUS,& SURREPTITIOUS ITINERANT MOUNTEBANK
Anatole
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Dick, I'm glad you enjoyed the Saint-Germain quote. Although the Yarbro books are novels, Saint-Germain himself was a real-life alchemist who was rumored to be immortal. You can read about him at:
http://www.alchemylab.com/count_saint_germain.htm
where there is this quote from Voltaire about him:
"A man who knows everything and who never dies..."

I wonder if Saint-Germain knew another person who was said to be at least 400 years old--The Ghost Who Walks!

----- Sonny
----- Sonny Narvaez
Bill Hegbli
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Eternal Order
Fort Wayne, Indiana
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I still have my original "Oho" rings and silk/nylon scarf. Instructions, and I have added what's his name ring and rope moves to the original. As it stands, "Oho" is kind of short with just 2 penetrations. The ring are fantastic, you will not find this quality any longer, seamless as well, and beautifully chromed.

I would like to find some routines/tricks using both rings with a rope. Would be interesting with double penetrations and such.

I am sorry to have mentioned great magic that is no longer available, don't like to cause anxiety for the youngsters.
Vietnam Veteran 1967, Sgt. E-5

Graduate of Chavez College of Prestidigitation and Showmanship

"Magic With A Twist Of Comedy"
Anatole
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Bill, I think today's youngsters who aim to be tomorrow's stars will diligently search used magic collections in magic shops and eBay for the classics--if their mentors don't lend them to them. I searched diligently for Maurice Rooklyn's _Spherical Sorcery and Recollections of a Pro_ and finally found an autographed copy at a used bookstore in Silver Spring, Maryland.

I just did a yahoo search and found "Oho ! Okito's Close-up Exclusive No. 3" listed for $15.00 at Micky Hades's site:
http://mickyhades.com/magicforsale04(Mi-Ro).htm

Where there's a will, there's a way.

----- Amado "Sonny" Narvaez
----- Sonny Narvaez
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