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Dr Spektor Eternal Order Carcanis 10781 Posts |
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On 2013-03-10 13:51, gdw wrote: So, if you have ever bought an EBOOK from someone here, you feel you have the right to resell it over and over again yourself from a moral standpoint? If so, have you actually done that? Or "swapped" e-materials over and over again i.e. after the first e-swap, you ended up with your original item and the swaped for item correct? Also, if someone sells a book someone else wrote after they bought it, over and over again - does it not have any harm in that it is taking money/earnings that legit(?) should go to the originator of the material? Anyway - thanks for clarifying as now I understand where you are coming from. My difference in opinion is that the morals and laws should work together and not be alien to each other... I look forward to your response.
"They are lean and athirst!!!!"
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FrenchDrop Inner circle I can name that tune in 1647 Posts |
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On 2013-03-10 13:51, gdw wrote: Personally, I thank god we have copyright laws to protect us from people who are capable of convincing themselves it's MORAL to appropriate someone else's creation and profit from it without getting their permission or compensating them. One thing I've noticed about this issue is that there seems to be very little overlap between people who are utterly against copyright laws and people who actually create things for a living (books, music, movies...magic tricks). I think people who have nothing of their own to protect are much more likely to decry other people's rights to protect their own creations.
"A great magician has said of his profession that its practitioners '… must pound and rack their brains to make the least learning go in, but quarrelling always comes very naturally to them.'” -- Susanna Clarke, Jonathan Strange and Mr Norrell
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Jamie Ferguson Inner circle Alba Gu Bràth 3640 Posts |
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On 2013-03-10 14:04, FrenchDrop wrote: I think in this case it would need someone from the magic community to bring it to the publishers attention in order for anything to be done. Our industry is under the radar to most so I don't think his activities will even register. I also think most magicians are too lazy or cowardly to want to contact publishers to let them know. So all in all I think Brian Brushyourwood will get away with this (assuming what he is doing is wrong in the eyes of the law). I'm still waiting for him to confirm that I will be receiving a free review copy. Maybe he's made the whole thing up and it's just another of his publicity stunts.
When the chips are down, the duvet is uncomfortable.
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FrenchDrop Inner circle I can name that tune in 1647 Posts |
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On 2013-03-10 14:13, Jamie Ferguson wrote: Well, I'm glad we have someone as industrious and courageous as you here in the forum, Jamie. I'm sure you'll do what you feel so strongly must be done, and not sit back and wait for one of us lazy cowards to do it.
"A great magician has said of his profession that its practitioners '… must pound and rack their brains to make the least learning go in, but quarrelling always comes very naturally to them.'” -- Susanna Clarke, Jonathan Strange and Mr Norrell
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Ray Chelt Special user Changing the world with my 988 Posts |
Talking about legaleese I wonder whether Mr B might not have cause to think some of the comments on here might not be a bit libellous ?
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FrenchDrop Inner circle I can name that tune in 1647 Posts |
I think you're in the clear, Ray. I don't believe you could be sued for calling BB "totally annoying."
"A great magician has said of his profession that its practitioners '… must pound and rack their brains to make the least learning go in, but quarrelling always comes very naturally to them.'” -- Susanna Clarke, Jonathan Strange and Mr Norrell
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Jamie Ferguson Inner circle Alba Gu Bràth 3640 Posts |
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On 2013-03-10 14:26, FrenchDrop wrote: I'm not going to do anything because I don't have a massive problem with Brian Brushyourwood as some here seem to have. In fact, as I said previously, I admire his capitalistic ability to leverage other people's assets for personal gain. As for Ray's nervousness about being taken to court, I don't think anyone could be accused of slander here. Rather, there has been a debate around the legalities of copyright ownership. Either way it's great publicity for Brian Brushyourwood (n.b. the fact I have changed Brian Brushwood's name to Brain Brushyourwood falls under the definition of 'parody' and therefore I shouldn't really get into trouble for it). In summary Brian Brushyourwood will sell a few books, some magicians will continue to moan and life will continue as usual. That said I'm off to have a cup of tea and a Wagon Wheel.
When the chips are down, the duvet is uncomfortable.
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FrenchDrop Inner circle I can name that tune in 1647 Posts |
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On 2013-03-10 15:15, Jamie Ferguson wrote: I see. So you're not going to do anything about it, either -- but not because you're too lazy or cowardly, as you say "most magicians are." It's just that you don't care. Okay.
"A great magician has said of his profession that its practitioners '… must pound and rack their brains to make the least learning go in, but quarrelling always comes very naturally to them.'” -- Susanna Clarke, Jonathan Strange and Mr Norrell
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BatsMagic Inner circle New York 1052 Posts |
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On 2013-03-10 13:51, gdw wrote: Just curious, gdw- are you an anarchist? |
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Jamie Ferguson Inner circle Alba Gu Bràth 3640 Posts |
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On 2013-03-10 15:34, FrenchDrop wrote: FrenchDrip, why don't you move beyond spectatorship and do something active yourself? I do loads on the Café - e.g. Exclusive scoops, reviews, helping calm things down when they get heated etc.... I don't see you doing anything. Actually that's a lie, I see you throwing stones at others and laughing out loud (as in ).
When the chips are down, the duvet is uncomfortable.
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Jamie Ferguson Inner circle Alba Gu Bràth 3640 Posts |
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On 2013-03-10 15:57, BatsMagic wrote: All property is theft!
When the chips are down, the duvet is uncomfortable.
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gdw Inner circle 4884 Posts |
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On 2013-03-10 15:57, BatsMagic wrote: Depends what you mean by the word. Though I have no problem with the word my self, in it's strictest definition, like "capitalism," many have inferred their own meaning into words. I consider myself a voluntaryist. I believe all human interactions should be consensual, and apparently that is insane to people who believe that, if they keep voting, eventually they will get a different result and they can get corruption out of government. Just keep doing the same things, and sure, you'll get a different result. And they say I'm the one who believed in a utopia
"You may say I'm a dreamer, but I'm not the only one."
I won't forget you Robert. |
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gdw Inner circle 4884 Posts |
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On 2013-03-10 16:12, Jamie Ferguson wrote: See what I mean about people inferring their own conclusions and definitions?
"You may say I'm a dreamer, but I'm not the only one."
I won't forget you Robert. |
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gdw Inner circle 4884 Posts |
I thought I posted this already.
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On 2013-03-10 14:11, FrenchDrop wrote: Actually, it is quite often exactly the opposite of that. Out side of magicians, who, due to their own ignorance, want to shoot themselves in the foot by increasing IP "protection" within magic, it is usually corporations and the big media production companies, not the actual artists and creators, who are championing IP law. Not that there aren't artists and creators who still support IP law, in every case it's due to their own ignorance, either about IP law, or about the reality of economics of it. http://www.presspauseplay.com It's also not just a "new" reality the result of modern technology, it's always been the case. The history of copyright is the crown giving monopolies to people rich and powerful enough, to prevent the education of the "lower" classes. MANY artists are against the bs of legislation, and more are constantly realizing how they are getting screwed by their "producers," and their companies, etc. Lastly, I've been, mostly (outside if the resale aspect,) speaking on what people have a right to do, not what is, necessarily, THE right thing to do. Regarding resale, I also stipulated that the alteration, and to what degree it is, from a legal standpoint, can make a difference. "Although one could argue something about his "alterations," though we don't exactly know what those are. I doubt he's reprinting the entire books. Otherwise why would be need to buy original copies?"
"You may say I'm a dreamer, but I'm not the only one."
I won't forget you Robert. |
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tomsk192 Inner circle 3894 Posts |
As a matter of interest, as an 'artist', how much have you actually released?
How much 'bs' did you come up against, if any? It seems, by the way, that you either believe the rest of these boards to be bereft of intelligence, or you yourself are unwittingly pompous and arrogant. And yes, I infer that from what you, gdw, write here. Either way, it is unpleasant. |
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Dr Spektor Eternal Order Carcanis 10781 Posts |
GDW, you never answered my question regarding ebooks and how you buy and trade them personally based on your moral system?
"They are lean and athirst!!!!"
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FrenchDrop Inner circle I can name that tune in 1647 Posts |
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On 2013-03-10 16:21, gdw wrote: That has not been my experience at all. Quote:
Not that there aren't artists and creators who still support IP law, in every case it's due to their own ignorance, either about IP law, or about the reality of economics of it. In your opinion, you mean. In my opinion, you are in no position to call others ignorant of IP law -- as demonstrated by incorrect statements you've made here in this thread. As for "PressPausePlay," I have no idea why you think a documentary about how digital technology has democratized creativity supports your case that copyright law is bad -- or why you think most of the people in that documentary agree with your position on IP rights, or why you think they represent most people who write or make music or films for a living. I think you tend to see in these sources you cite what you want to see -- and what you want to see is a rationalization for appropriating other people's creative works without paying for them. Modern copyright law exists to ensure that people who create less tangible things -- like novels -- have the same rights to their creations as people who make chairs or other physical objects. It exists to protect creative people from those who would never dream of stealing a physical object like a chair, but think it's okay to steal a book or a song because it's not as tangible as a chair. Quote:
MANY artists are against the bs of legislation, and more are constantly realizing how they are getting screwed by their "producers," and their companies, etc. Examples? Especially related to the issue at hand, I'd be very interested in seeing Stephen King, J.K. Rowling, or anyone who represents them saying they're against copyright law and feel it's against their interests as authors. Quote:
Lastly, I've been, mostly (outside if the resale aspect,) speaking on what people have a right to do, not what is, necessarily, THE right thing to do. But whether your agree with it or not, "what people have a right to do" is set out in copyright law and the case law surrounding it. It has nothing at all to do with how you think things should be (nor with any wishful thinking you've done in order to convince yourself that most creative people agree with you).
"A great magician has said of his profession that its practitioners '… must pound and rack their brains to make the least learning go in, but quarrelling always comes very naturally to them.'” -- Susanna Clarke, Jonathan Strange and Mr Norrell
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FrenchDrop Inner circle I can name that tune in 1647 Posts |
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On 2013-03-10 16:11, Jamie Ferguson wrote: Aw, Jamie. I could've sworn it was you who said earlier in this very thread that I really know my stuff and made an excellent point...and now I'm someone who never moves behond spectatorship and only throws stones.... You truly contain multitudes, Jamie. You are as unknowable as the shifting breeze.
"A great magician has said of his profession that its practitioners '… must pound and rack their brains to make the least learning go in, but quarrelling always comes very naturally to them.'” -- Susanna Clarke, Jonathan Strange and Mr Norrell
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saysold1 Eternal Order Recovering Cafe addict with only 10795 Posts |
Hey Phil!
Having fun here again right? Let me state that GDW Glen's many (many) posts and "opinions" defending Bushwood for about the past month are meaningless. What matters to me is the rule of law. If Bushwood hasn't broken it, more power to him.
Creator of The SvenPad Supreme(R) line of aerospace level quality, made in the USA utility props. https://svenpads.com/
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Jamie Ferguson Inner circle Alba Gu Bràth 3640 Posts |
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On 2013-03-10 17:55, FrenchDrop wrote: It annoys me that you have some brilliant knowledge but don't do much with it. I think you have much more to give to the Café than you let on. Even though we have our spats and you probably don't think I like you I actually have lots of respect for you.
When the chips are down, the duvet is uncomfortable.
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