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Daryl -the other brother Special user Chicago 594 Posts |
Anyone following the Jodie Arias trial? She finally admitted to killing her ex-boyfriend (after getting caught) but says it was self defense. He was stabbed 29 times, mostly in his back, shot in the head and had his throat cut from ear to ear.
The best part of the trial is that the jury gets to ask questions and they've had some great ones. They should allow that with every jury, who better? They hear the whole trial. |
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LobowolfXXX Inner circle La Famiglia 1196 Posts |
There hasn't been a high-publicity case with a defendant this obviously guilty in my memory. If you're going to have a death penalty (and Arizona does) this case is tailor-made for it.
That being said, I'd bet on life in prison,
"Torture doesn't work" lol
Guess they forgot to tell Bill Buckley. "...as we reason and love, we are able to hope. And hope enables us to resist those things that would enslave us." |
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mastermindreader 1949 - 2017 Seattle, WA 12586 Posts |
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On 2013-03-08 02:24, LobowolfXXX wrote: I agree. Does she have any priors? Am also wondering why there wasn't a plea deal. Can't say I'm too impressed with the defense. |
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Destiny Inner circle 1429 Posts |
They'll have to rewrite Cell Block Tango after this girl.
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Daryl -the other brother Special user Chicago 594 Posts |
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On 2013-03-08 02:24, LobowolfXXX wrote: Casey Anthony |
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LobowolfXXX Inner circle La Famiglia 1196 Posts |
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On 2013-03-08 02:36, mastermindreader wrote: Definitely degree about the defense. Don't know about the priors. Defense wanted second degree, but the prosecution wasn't having it. Don't blame 'em...premeditation is obvious.
"Torture doesn't work" lol
Guess they forgot to tell Bill Buckley. "...as we reason and love, we are able to hope. And hope enables us to resist those things that would enslave us." |
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LobowolfXXX Inner circle La Famiglia 1196 Posts |
Quote:
On 2013-03-08 08:59, Daryl -the other brother wrote: Not even close (at least from the admissible evidence that was available at the time of trial).
"Torture doesn't work" lol
Guess they forgot to tell Bill Buckley. "...as we reason and love, we are able to hope. And hope enables us to resist those things that would enslave us." |
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mastermindreader 1949 - 2017 Seattle, WA 12586 Posts |
I think the premeditation can be challenged by emphasizing the chaotic nature of the homicide- overkill that certainly doesn't reflect calm "deliberation," but could certainly be portrayed as the result of someone just "snapping." I'd argue that if it was premeditated she would have just calmly taken the gun from the closet, gone to the bathroom and shot him. I'd point out that the evidence shows extreme rage inconsistent with premeditation and deliberation.
That's how I'd approach it anyway in order to either get it knocked down to second degree (or even voluntary manslaugher) or to mitigate against the death penalty. Not defending her in the least, just pointing out a possible defense strategy. |
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LobowolfXXX Inner circle La Famiglia 1196 Posts |
The problem with that is that there's overwhelming evidence that it was premeditated long before she arrived in Arizona.
"Torture doesn't work" lol
Guess they forgot to tell Bill Buckley. "...as we reason and love, we are able to hope. And hope enables us to resist those things that would enslave us." |
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mastermindreader 1949 - 2017 Seattle, WA 12586 Posts |
That's a possible problem, but I would characterize it as indicative of obsession rather than premeditation and deliberation to commit murder. And again, the crime scene itself and the condition of the victim is not indicative of a well-planned act.
Of course, if I was the prosecutor I would argue exactly what you're suggesting. But I think the obsession/rage/snapping approach could be convincing to at least a few members of the jury. The defense attorney is failing, though, to offer clarity to any of these theories and seems to me like he's just going through the motions. Am already seeing grounds for appeal if (or more likely, when) she is convicted. |
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LobowolfXXX Inner circle La Famiglia 1196 Posts |
Absolutely agree...the defense is throwing everything against the wall and hoping something sticks when they need a clearly defined and supported theory. It's a mess.
"Torture doesn't work" lol
Guess they forgot to tell Bill Buckley. "...as we reason and love, we are able to hope. And hope enables us to resist those things that would enslave us." |
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Daryl -the other brother Special user Chicago 594 Posts |
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On 2013-03-08 12:02, LobowolfXXX wrote: Casey Anthony's "Not Guilty" verdict sent shock waves world wide. It was headline news for days, why? Because she was obviously guilty and got away with murder. The biggest blunder since the O.J. Simpson verdict. |
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mastermindreader 1949 - 2017 Seattle, WA 12586 Posts |
Daryl-
I think you may be missing Lobo's point. Based on the ADMISSIBLE EVIDENCE that was presented to the juries in both the Anthony and Simpson cases, there was clearly room for reasonable doubt. The general public got to hear a lot more than what the juries were permitted to hear. That's why there was so much widespread surprise at the verdicts. In contrast, the evidence that has already been admitted in the Arias case leaves little room for doubt. Arias has already admitted guilt and all that is being argued is whether or not what she did constitutes first degree murder. Neither Anthony nor Simpson admitted guilt. |
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rockwall Special user 762 Posts |
NOt to mention the fact that she admits to it which Simpson or Anthony never did. That's kindof a big one.
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Daryl -the other brother Special user Chicago 594 Posts |
Quote:
On 2013-03-10 16:03, mastermindreader wrote: Really? I didn't hear people angry because the jury didn't hear everything. I heard people angry that a woman murdered her child and got away with it. The problem was that the case wasn't wrapped up in a neat little CSI package like we see on TV. Which brings up a good question (at least in my mind) Should a jury reach a verdict based soley on evidence or should common sense come into play? IE: Why was there duct tape on the child's mouth if it was an accidental drowning? that's why I like the Arias trial. The jury is allowed to ask questions, and their using a lot of common sense. I think that should be allowed in every state after all, their the ones who have to pass a verdict. Quote:
Arias has already admitted guilt Only after changing her story for a third time. First she said she wasn't there at all, then she was there but they were attacked by Ninjas, then yes she killed him but it was self defense. Quote:
all that is being argued is whether or not what she did constitutes first degree murder. The defense wants self defense, time served. Prosecution wants pre-meditated with the death Sentence. |
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LobowolfXXX Inner circle La Famiglia 1196 Posts |
I'm not saying Anthony wasn't obviously guilty. I'm saying Arias is more obviously guilty. Much more.
"Torture doesn't work" lol
Guess they forgot to tell Bill Buckley. "...as we reason and love, we are able to hope. And hope enables us to resist those things that would enslave us." |
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Daryl -the other brother Special user Chicago 594 Posts |
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On 2013-03-10 18:04, LobowolfXXX wrote: Sorry Lobo, from your comment of "not even close" I thought otherwise. But your right, I think the prosecution will get 1st degree, but probably a life sentence. It would be pretty hard to sentence someone to death. |
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mastermindreader 1949 - 2017 Seattle, WA 12586 Posts |
Daryl-
Lobo and I are/were both trial attorneys and are discussing this from that perspective. The rules of evidence are complex, and, based on what the juries in the Anthony and Simpson cases were permitted to hear, together with the strategies employed by the prosecution and defense, the acquittals were not as surprising as the pubic seemed to think. That is not the case in the Arias trial, where we are talking about the degree of a conviction rather than a finding of guilt. Hence, when Lobo said that the cases are "not even close," he was absolutely correct. |
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dave_matkin Inner circle 4522 Posts |
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On 2013-03-08 12:15, mastermindreader wrote: Oaaawww heck you got me convinced..... She should do 30 days community service and then be let off - well at least definitely not pre-meditated. Darn it your good at this lawyering (that really should be a word) if I ever need a lawyer your my man! In all seriousness I think your argument is pretty pod. Of course she could have known that you would think that so made sure to do the overkill! |
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dave_matkin Inner circle 4522 Posts |
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On 2013-03-10 19:28, mastermindreader wrote: I didn't realise that ..... But maybe I did ..... Which is why your post about pre-meditation reads with "an air of authority" (I think that's what I mean) ..... You know what I mean! |
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