|
|
Go to page 1~2 [Next] | ||||||||||
mmmario Regular user perth/shanghai 140 Posts |
Hi all
I posted this earlier in the wrong section methinks. I'm working on a serpentine silk routine and am having trouble with keeping the movement slow and steady. I have a few types of the cheaper reels and releasing it slowly and smoothly seems nigh on impossible. I want the first part of the untying to go as slow and smooth as possible to fit the presentation I have in mind. The best I can manage is short, jerky motions, apart from full speed retraction. For a slow and smooth acton, is line/spring tension the main factor? I have concluded I may need a better quality reel. I have checked out many threads in the Café but I can't find any going into any detail about slowing the untying action down. Anywho, I'm thinking of the Tango Ultimate Reel. I would appreciate any thoughts. Cheers. |
|||||||||
Bill Hegbli Eternal Order Fort Wayne, Indiana 22797 Posts |
A reel is not your problem. It is not the equipment. The best way to control a reel is with the line between the second finger and thumb. Then you will need to practice for several hours to get the feel of the line, and the amount of pressure needed to get your desired results.
I see you said what you want is slow, but all the magicians I have seen do it quickly. I strive for a steady, medium speed, as the trick is suppose to represent a serpent, and that is how snakes are, slow and steady. |
|||||||||
hugmagic Inner circle 7655 Posts |
Bill is right on the money. Use the finger pressure to control the speed. Old timers often bought the reels without brakes. The brakes were added as a selling feature to the amateurs.
Richard
Richard E. Hughes, Hughes Magic Inc., 352 N. Prospect St., Ravenna, OH 44266 (330)296-4023
www.hughesmagic.com email-hugmagic@raex.com Write direct as I will be turning off my PM's. |
|||||||||
mmmario Regular user perth/shanghai 140 Posts |
Thanks for your responses Bill and Richard.
Back to practise then. |
|||||||||
Rainboguy Inner circle 1915 Posts |
Mmmario:
Just as an afterthought, if you're having trouble "braking" the reel using finger pressure, you may want to try the old magician's standby.........a length of thread....... |
|||||||||
Bill Hegbli Eternal Order Fort Wayne, Indiana 22797 Posts |
To add to Rainboguy thought, Rice Silk King Studio still sells the "Rice's Knotty Silk" invented before the reel idea. It is was good enough for Cardini, it must be great. Tie a knot and it unties itself, or it will even tie itself as well.
http://www.silkkingmagic.com/Rice's%20Knotty%20Silks.htm Comes with thread, silk and illustrated instructions. |
|||||||||
Rainboguy Inner circle 1915 Posts |
Rice's also still sells "The Original Serpent Silk" that's perfect for this bit.....
http://www.silkkingmagic.com/Rice's%20S......amer.htm Ruth Crone Rice is a pleasure to work with and gives excellent customer service, too! |
|||||||||
mmmario Regular user perth/shanghai 140 Posts |
Thanks guys. I will check it out.
I love this Café! |
|||||||||
Dick Oslund Inner circle 8357 Posts |
It's not just the speed, it's also WHEN, the action begins. TIMING TIMING TIMING!
Audience attention must be focused on the 'action'! Proper twisting is critical too.
SNEAKY, UNDERHANDED, DEVIOUS,& SURREPTITIOUS ITINERANT MOUNTEBANK
|
|||||||||
Bill Hegbli Eternal Order Fort Wayne, Indiana 22797 Posts |
Quote:
On 2013-05-03 06:04, Dick Oslund wrote: Dick, thanks for that comment, "It's Not the Speed". I have been trying to tell these youngsters that to use the real for the Serpent Silk and Silk though Microphone Stand for years that the speed of the reel has nothing to do with the action of the magic effect. Do they listen, no, as some even get extremely rude with me, telling me they read my previous postings and figured I would pop in and reinforce this once again. These young and new to reel magic people refuse to believe they could not be doing the tricks correctly. It has to be the reel, not them, and thus you will find many posts on getting the fastest reel made to perform these effects. Not a one wants to believes me, and I am sure none of them are doing these tricks as a result of not finding the fastest reel available. They refuse to admit that it is the actions and method more then the tool and their lack of knowledge. Paul Diamond made the best video on Reel Magic, but L&L Publishing, who now has the rights, has not published the videos to DVDs. Thanks, that now makes 2 of us trying to get people on the Café to seek the correct handling. I would imagine it is Michael Ammar's poor handling of the silk through cup handle (on David Letterman Late Nite Show) that makes them think it is speed, as he was trying to sell some Swiss Reels at the time. By the way, not one has requested the correct handling of a reel for either of these tricks. Talk about stubborn, WOW! |
|||||||||
Rainboguy Inner circle 1915 Posts |
I'll "3rd" Dick Oslund and Bill Hegbli's comments regarding timing and speed.
MMMario: IF you get the Tango Ultimate Reel (I have one and like it) please be advised that the accompanying DVD shows Mr. Tango doing a "serpentine silk" demo with his reel, and in my opinion, IT'S WAY TOO FAST .......IT SHOULD BE SLOWER AND STEADIER...GREATLY ADDING TO THE ILLUSION.... Fast works with a Flying Bars Silk, like this one: http://www.silkkingmagic.com/Rice's%20F......Silk.htm (which by the way, is the CORRECT version of this silk due to the border which reinforces a "floating" border, adding to the illusion...) I suggest practicing this again and again and again in front of a mirror until the timing looks right to YOU, then ask a friend in magic to critique how it looks.... |
|||||||||
mmmario Regular user perth/shanghai 140 Posts |
Thanks Bill, Dick and Rainboguy. I take it all onboard. And boy, am I glad I asked for the slowest and not the fastest.
I want to create conflict with the silk which is why I want a very slow action in the early stages. I want to imbue the silk with some naughtiness trying to untie itself unnoticed by me. To make it look like it is "sneaking up on me". The slower and smoooooooother the better. Practise continues. Thanks again guys. |
|||||||||
mmmario Regular user perth/shanghai 140 Posts |
I've had some spare timemand have had a closer look at the Knotty Silk and this sounds fantastic. Even better than using a reel. And tying itself into a knot is a great kicker.
Excited MMMario. Thanks Bill !!!!! |
|||||||||
Ekuth Inner circle Floating above my 1538 Posts |
*blinks*
Apparently I'm old school, because I've never used a reel for the Serpentine Silk. Ever. I've always used the method I learned, a static line and body movements. Fast, slow... you don't need a reel. KISS and practice.
"All you need is in Fitzkee."
|
|||||||||
mmmario Regular user perth/shanghai 140 Posts |
Thanks Ekuth
Old school is mighty fine by me. I presume you use the Knotty Silks method. My Knotty Silks has just arrived ... let the practise begin! I prefer KISS A TIT though ... Keep it simple and think it through. Thanks again. |
|||||||||
MagicianTrent New user 13 Posts |
Thanks folks, I have been following this thread as I am interested in this effect and this has provided some very helpful insight into this effect.
Take Care Trent |
|||||||||
Dick Oslund Inner circle 8357 Posts |
My book is "coming along" (too slow to suit me--and Jon Racherbaumer)! This thread has convinced me to write up "my" handling of the Serp. Silk. I bought my first r**l in 1947 ($1.50--P&L). I have worn out a few reels--and silks!
There are techniques involved in rolling or twisting the silk, There are techniques involved in tying the knot (yes). There are techniques involved in the actual TIMING of the 'untying'. Thanks, Bill and Rainbowguy for your thoughts, too! These young guys need to realize that TIMING refers to "when 'it' happens". TIMING has nothing to do with speed! Jay Marshall's TIMING was impeccable! Jay never hurried! (Check out a video (I think it's on the U toob)of Jay doing LEFTY!) In my lectures, I always used the ancient "Norwegian Comedian" gag to illustrate TIMING. Good magicians are often booked by agents for club dates, not only because they can be depended upon to ENTERTAIN (and, "we" know that MAGIC IS NOT INHERENTLY ENTERTAINING!) but, also, because a magician can do "TIME". (Very few novelty acts can do more than a few minutes!). Serp. is definitely (IMO)not a TIME effect, neither is Silk thru Microphone stand, but I have used both (separate parts of the act)for more years than I can count(--lol--!) because both meet my criteria (the 'nine necessary things'). Well, that's a few thoughts about two of the three 'Ts'. There isn't time or space today, to mention TEMPO.
SNEAKY, UNDERHANDED, DEVIOUS,& SURREPTITIOUS ITINERANT MOUNTEBANK
|
|||||||||
Rainboguy Inner circle 1915 Posts |
Just as a POINT of reference in this thread....pertaining to speed and TIMING.....
Blackstone Sr. and Jr. made the BIG BUCKS by turning plain white gentleman's handkerchiefs into little devlish ghosts onstage,....part of that appeal was a simple knot that S L O W L Y un-knotted itself, before the "spirit handkerchief" flew visibly back into it's cabinet... My point here being.......IT TAKES A MASTER TO MASTER THE AUDIENCE USING THE SIMPLEST OF PROPS, SKILL, TIMING, and PRESENTATION. Your audiences will let you know if "you're there" or not~! |
|||||||||
Dick Oslund Inner circle 8357 Posts |
RIGHT~! Mr. "B" had a box car full of plywood! (and all those crates and trunks had an "X" on the heavy end!)!
--and people talked about that handkerchief! Working casually, impromptu, etc. I often do the fadeaway knot. It is STRONG! It's simple, fun, and EASY. --and the REAL SECRET is "SO LANGSAM VIE MEGLIG" (I can really screw up the Deutsch spelling!) But, now, youse guys will need to go get that translated!
SNEAKY, UNDERHANDED, DEVIOUS,& SURREPTITIOUS ITINERANT MOUNTEBANK
|
|||||||||
john wills Special user 939 Posts |
As slooooooow as possible.
|
|||||||||
The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Smooth as silk » » SLOWING DOWN THE SELF UNTYING KNOT (1 Likes) | ||||||||||
Go to page 1~2 [Next] |
[ Top of Page ] |
All content & postings Copyright © 2001-2024 Steve Brooks. All Rights Reserved. This page was created in 0.03 seconds requiring 5 database queries. |
The views and comments expressed on The Magic Café are not necessarily those of The Magic Café, Steve Brooks, or Steve Brooks Magic. > Privacy Statement < |