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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Not very magical, still... » » I finally broke down and did it. (0 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

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Dannydoyle
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Yea your missing the point. I never said it was a bad idea. I simy say that for how we do things it does not need to be a large component of what we have to do.

But since you wizzards of smart seem to know how every business runs thanks for the help.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus
<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
Al Angello
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Danny
I have not been arguing with you. I was not talking about anyone in general. Holding on to the past is something we all do.
Al Angello The Comic Juggler/Magician
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"Footprints on your ceiling are almost gone"
LobowolfXXX
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Quote:
On 2013-08-06 15:07, Slide wrote:
Don't worry though, I'll be gone soon enough. I'm only wasting time here today because I just finished building a new website from scratch using the new Joomla 3 CMS system. It required me not only learning a new development environment but I had to take a crash course in advanced CSS3.

So I needed a break, and decided to waste some time here.

Some of you guys really like to argue just for the sake of arguing, though. I'm have no doubt if Warren Buffet came on here to give you financial advice, you'd argue with him.

It would have been great if someone had actually asked me a question that could have helped them. A waste actually.



I make money through teaching (a lot, mostly privately), writing, performing magic (a little), and practicing law. I've turned down the last several prospective legal clients, some magic gigs, and many prospective students, because I have all of the business I can handle and then some. I could sell more books with a more active social media presence, but between my other activities and the fact that my second book was licensed to a nationwide test prep company and has a built-in market that gets me a royalty 4x per year for each of their students, I don't really care much. But I do appreciate the attempt to save me from professional obsolescence!
"Torture doesn't work" lol
Guess they forgot to tell Bill Buckley.

"...as we reason and love, we are able to hope. And hope enables us to resist those things that would enslave us."
Andrew Zuber
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Quote:
On 2013-08-06 14:20, Slide wrote:
It is like using an AOL email address. You can do it, but no one will take you seriously.

Carlton Cuse uses an AOL address. You might be familiar with the show he was an executive producer on. It was called Lost.
Michael Dinner uses an AOL address. His producing and directing credits include Masters of Sex, Justified, and about 80 episodes of The Wonder Years.
Howard Gordon (executive producer of 200+ episodes of 24,) Dan Jinks (Academy Award winning producer,) Tim Long (producer of 170 episodes of The Simpsons,) Graham Yost (executive producer on The Americans, Justified, Falling Skies, etc.) All use AOL addresses.

Anyway, continue with your generalizations.
"I'm sorry - if you were right, I would agree with you." -Robin Williams, Awakenings
LobowolfXXX
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Yes, but they can't be taken seriously.
"Torture doesn't work" lol
Guess they forgot to tell Bill Buckley.

"...as we reason and love, we are able to hope. And hope enables us to resist those things that would enslave us."
Andrew Zuber
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You make a good point. Massive success doesn't necessarily equate to seriousness.
Well played, sir.
"I'm sorry - if you were right, I would agree with you." -Robin Williams, Awakenings
Dannydoyle
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I know people using Yahoo who are successful. Taken serios I have no idea.

AOL? I had no idea all those people had it Andrew thank you.

Hard as it is for the internet evangelist to believe some of us simply do not need it. If you want to help others so badly Slide just start another thread. Don't hijack one. But then if nobody takes you seriously I see why you don't.

But then again a pseudonym on an internet magic forum bragging about your success does not impress me much sorry. No real name no way to see your opinions at work and nothing to judge you by. Talm about not being taken seriously.

I will try to muddle through life as I am and hope I can keep the wolves from the door.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus
<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
LobowolfXXX
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I know one attorney whose email address is an AOL address. One of his clients is Verizon, so *somebody's* taking him seriously. He used to play guitar in a popular new wave band, so maybe that's questionable.
"Torture doesn't work" lol
Guess they forgot to tell Bill Buckley.

"...as we reason and love, we are able to hope. And hope enables us to resist those things that would enslave us."
Andrew Zuber
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Something tells me you're gonna make it, Danny...Facebook or not Smile
"I'm sorry - if you were right, I would agree with you." -Robin Williams, Awakenings
Dannydoyle
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Quote:
On 2013-08-06 10:43, General_Magician wrote:
Quote:
Clearly you have no ida how my business runs. But if it makes you feel better to think you do then go for it.

Having a billion people pre disposed to being magic lovers translates into exactly zero dollars for me. You may be right in general but in this specific case you are just wrong.

I know everyone flys the social media flag rreally high but for us it is a way to simply be in tough AFTER.


Personally, I have referred business to other magicians because I am a close up magician and not a stage or parlor magician. Building relationships with other magicians can be good for your business in that you can refer them business and they can do the same for you. I have also referred business to people who are balloon twisters as I personally don't have that skill and sometimes I am hired for gigs where in addition to myself, the customer would also like a balloon twister.

But if you want to cheat yourself out of additional business by not building relationships with other magicians, then, it's all you Danny. Not to mention having more likes on your Facebook page also helps to build social proof which in turn helps in marketing your Facebook page and developing more contacts. Facebook and social media were also key in bringing democratic revolutions to the Arab world a year or two back. So, it's a powerful tool for networking, which networking is key in business.


So it is clear I have never refered business back and forth. I also do not need or see how "social proof" helps me in the least. You can quote the buzz words but can't show it translating into dollars.

There are businesses in which there is no need for this. Whether you understand it or not.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus
<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
General_Magician
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On 2013-08-06 20:00, Dannydoyle wrote:

So it is clear I have never refered business back and forth. I also do not need or see how "social proof" helps me in the least. You can quote the buzz words but can't show it translating into dollars.

There are businesses in which there is no need for this. Whether you understand it or not.


You don't need Facebook anymore than a restaurant needs a magician. You will have to run promotions and call to actions on your Facebook page to convert Facebook likes into sales and the more people you have liking your Facebook page, the more likely you will be able to convert those likes into sales (law of averages, 1 out of 10 will tell you yes to the sale, but you can beat the law of averages through honest, good sales and people skills). You don't need Facebook to run a successful business, but it can help your business. 5 Ps to marketing is Price, Product, Promotion, Placement and People. People being the most important aspect to marketing.

Facebook helps you connect with people online, build relationships and you can also run a promotion along with a call to action on your Facebook page (personally, I would not use Facebook ads if I were you, I think it's a waste of money). If you want you can include the prices of your services, but I personally do not do so. I will run a promotion occasionally. But it will take some time and using Facebook to get your likes up and you want people to engage with your Facebook page as well because the more people engage with your Facebook page, the more it reaches people who haven't even liked your Facebook page.

Being a magician is a people and personality (like most businesses when you think about it) driven business, so I like to talk about what's going on in my life or some of things I enjoy and like on Facebook or on my blog. I might also throw up an article I think is cool or interesting. You don't want to market too hard either as it will annoy those who like your Facebook page. Just takes time and patience, no instant gratification if that is what you are looking for.
"Never fear shadows. They simply mean there is a light shining somewhere nearby." -unknown

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Dannydoyle
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Again you demonstrate a comete misunderstanding of my business. But by all means continue to use all the special buzz words you read in your last sales book.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus
<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
General_Magician
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On 2013-08-06 22:14, Dannydoyle wrote:
Again you demonstrate a comete misunderstanding of my business. But by all means continue to use all the special buzz words you read in your last sales book.


I'm talking from experience now rather than from reading a sales book. That's why I told you not to bother wasting your money on Facebook advertising because it didn't yield me any ROI and I think it's a waste of money. A lot of other businesses would agree with me, but I still think it's a good idea to keep a Facebook business page.
"Never fear shadows. They simply mean there is a light shining somewhere nearby." -unknown

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Dannydoyle
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You sound like you enjoy using buzz words.
Danny Doyle
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<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
General_Magician
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On 2013-08-07 13:29, Dannydoyle wrote:
You sound like you enjoy using buzz words.


That's because I did some reading prior to gaining actual experience. I like to educate myself a little bit on something before I try using it and then I let experience teach me the rest that I don't know. There is nothing wrong with reading a book and educating yourself a little bit before diving blind into doing something. Ideally, I like to learn from somebody who has experience and success on a particular topic before taking action rather than from a book, but that's not always possible. But taking action is important too and education should not be the excuse for not taking action either.
"Never fear shadows. They simply mean there is a light shining somewhere nearby." -unknown

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Dannydoyle
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Yea but you do a lot of rah rah quoting of books and it really does not apply in every situation. Knowing where to apply it is the key.

As I said things are different than you think.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus
<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
balducci
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Quote:
On 2013-08-06 22:14, Dannydoyle wrote:

Again you demonstrate a comete misunderstanding of my business. But by all means continue to use all the special buzz words you read in your last sales book.

I have not been reading this thread so maybe this was already mentioned, but perhaps linkedin is a better place for you to have a profile if marketing your business is a concern. Especially if you market to corporate clients.

Some friends of mine are on linkedin and I was recently surprised at how good it is for getting them clients.
Make America Great Again! - Trump in 2020 ... "We're a capitalistic society. I go into business, I don't make it, I go bankrupt. They're not going to bail me out. I've been on welfare and food stamps. Did anyone help me? No." - Craig T. Nelson, actor.
balducci
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On 2013-08-05 17:00, LobowolfXXX wrote:
Quote:
On 2013-08-05 16:19, Slide wrote:
"I don't know about "downside," but I would say if you have all the business you need, its unnecessary."

In my experience, not marketing yourself will soon lead to not having all the business you need. I've never seen a product, outside of a monopoly, that didn't require some marketing, except maybe drugs.

My best friend is a magician now semi-retired from performing. Before his retirement, he did 150+ shows a year with no social media marketing, and very little active marketing on his part at all. He had an agent, did a lot of repeat bookings, and got calls from referrals and word of mouth. He had absolutely no desire to do more shows than he got effortlessly, and Facebook or Twitter would have been a complete waste of time for him.

Facebook is not just (or even mainly) about marketing, though.

Social media in general offers more than that.

Your friend may not need to market on social media, but he might have garnered enjoyment from interacting with fans in that way. Some people do.
Make America Great Again! - Trump in 2020 ... "We're a capitalistic society. I go into business, I don't make it, I go bankrupt. They're not going to bail me out. I've been on welfare and food stamps. Did anyone help me? No." - Craig T. Nelson, actor.
General_Magician
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Yea but you do a lot of rah rah quoting of books and it really does not apply in every situation. Knowing where to apply it is the key.

As I said things are different than you think.


As I gain more experience I see some truth in what you are saying. But I got to have a starting point before I take action. If I don't have a starting point and I don't ever take any action, then I will never get anything done and I won't ever have anything to improve upon and make better.
"Never fear shadows. They simply mean there is a light shining somewhere nearby." -unknown

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balducci
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Quote:
On 2013-08-06 14:32, Slide wrote:

With Facebook, you have complete control over what people see and what people don't see.

Ha ha. Lol. Sure you do.

Until Facebook experiences one its frequent and well known privacy 'glitches' or changes the rules retroactively. A couple of quick examples:

http://www.pcworld.com/article/2046139/f......rns.html

http://www.cbc.ca/news/technology/story/......ist.html
Make America Great Again! - Trump in 2020 ... "We're a capitalistic society. I go into business, I don't make it, I go bankrupt. They're not going to bail me out. I've been on welfare and food stamps. Did anyone help me? No." - Craig T. Nelson, actor.
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