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acesover
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On 2013-08-25 11:57, Dannydoyle wrote:
With semi auto or any firearm it is not if it will happen it is WHEN a misfire will.happen. It will happen. If it happens at the range ok. If it is at a point where you are needing to save a life I personally think it is unacceptable risk. Therefore a revolver.


Danny. Just as in your previous post about needing more rounds you say it very seldom happens. But it does happen. Yet you also bring up the fact that it will happen that a misfire will occur. Well also a situation where more rounds are needed also will occur...just when no one knows but the odds of both are miniscule. In fact the misfire is much less a possibility than the need for more rounds. So while your reasoning is sound it is unfounded about the reason for carrying a revolver as opposed to a semi auto. However one should carry what one is comfortable with. Honestly I would be comfortable with either as long as I was proficient with both. The odds of the misfire or more rounds needed is miniscule.
If I were to agree with you. Then we would both be wrong. As of Apr 5, 2015 10:26 pm I have 880 posts. Used to have over 1,000
rockwall
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On 2013-08-25 00:35, Bob1Dog wrote:
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You are correct. It is quite easy to obtain a CCW permit in Pa. They do an instant background check (Federal I believe) on you and issue you a photo ID permit right on site if your record is clean. That is how it is done in Luzerne county. The permits are issued at the County Court house by the Sheriff's office. Not sure of all the other counties in Pa. But as far as I know no training is required in any of the counties in Pa. The cost is $20 in Luzerne county for a 5 year CCW permit.

One of the reasons I put off getting my CCW here in DE is because of the cost, but I finally gave in. Total with public notice ad, fingerprinting, course fee, court fee, background check fee totaled a little over $400. But it's good for three years and then renewable at $60, for I think five years.


Holy cow! That much? I'm surprised Eric Holder hasn't filed a lawsuit against the state for making a basic constitutional right so difficult to obtain by the poor and minorities. It's obviously a plot to disenfranchise them from being able to obtain a CCW.
imgic
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Firing .38 revolver for qualification at Officer Traing School I went to fire first shot and....nothing. As instructed I waited 5 seconds then squeezed again. Hammer came back then dropped and...nothing. As instructed after second misfire I raised my hand for Combat Arms Instructor. He came over all ****ed that some snot nosed officer candidate couldn't get a shot off so he grabbed the weapon from me, pointed it down range and squeezed trigger and...nothing. Two more times he tried (not waiting between rounds in case of misfire but I didn't think he was in the mood for me to tell him that). After some examination, he discovered the firing pin had broken off the hammer.

Mechanically revolvers are more reliable, but they're only as good as you take care of them...
"Imagination is more important than knowledge."
Dannydoyle
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On 2013-08-25 13:16, acesover wrote:
Quote:
On 2013-08-25 11:57, Dannydoyle wrote:
With semi auto or any firearm it is not if it will happen it is WHEN a misfire will.happen. It will happen. If it happens at the range ok. If it is at a point where you are needing to save a life I personally think it is unacceptable risk. Therefore a revolver.


Danny. Just as in your previous post about needing more rounds you say it very seldom happens. But it does happen. Yet you also bring up the fact that it will happen that a misfire will occur. Well also a situation where more rounds are needed also will occur...just when no one knows but the odds of both are miniscule. In fact the misfire is much less a possibility than the need for more rounds. So while your reasoning is sound it is unfounded about the reason for carrying a revolver as opposed to a semi auto. However one should carry what one is comfortable with. Honestly I would be comfortable with either as long as I was proficient with both. The odds of the misfire or more rounds needed is miniscule.


Please add support for your contention more rounds vs misfire for me.

EVERYONE has a misfire story. I know of nobody who has needed more ammo.
Danny Doyle
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<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
Bob1Dog
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You are right, everyone has a misfire story! Mine occured on a public range in PA about 25 years ago when I watched a young girl misfire a .357 under the guidance of her young boyfriend. When it misfired, she immediately lookd down the barrel. I packed up and never went back there again.

As for the discussion above on revolvers, I'm tending toward favoring a revolver as well. Very little can go wrong with a revolver, compared to an automatic. I don't have one, but am seriously thinking of getting one. I must also say that while some you seem to favor the trigger safety on the Glock (mine's a 27) it is something I'm not totally comfortable with. It's my first Glock and I've only had it for a few months. I'm not comfortable carrying it with a round chambered. Of the three carry pistols I have (.380 Walther, .25 Baretta and the Glock), I prefer the .380.

My wife is thinking of getting her carry permit (more and more women down here are doing so) and I would definitly want her to have a revolver.
What if the Hokey Pokey really IS what it's all about? Smile

My neighbor rang my doorbell at 2:30 a.m. this morning, can you believe that, 2:30 a.m.!? Lucky for him I was still up playing my drums.
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My girlfriend has a CCW for her Lady Smith five shot revolver. My revolver is a .357 Colt Lawman, but I never bother carrying it around.
acesover
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On 2013-08-25 14:56, Dannydoyle wrote:
Quote:
On 2013-08-25 13:16, acesover wrote:
Quote:
On 2013-08-25 11:57, Dannydoyle wrote:
With semi auto or any firearm it is not if it will happen it is WHEN a misfire will.happen. It will happen. If it happens at the range ok. If it is at a point where you are needing to save a life I personally think it is unacceptable risk. Therefore a revolver.


Danny. Just as in your previous post about needing more rounds you say it very seldom happens. But it does happen. Yet you also bring up the fact that it will happen that a misfire will occur. Well also a situation where more rounds are needed also will occur...just when no one knows but the odds of both are miniscule. In fact the misfire is much less a possibility than the need for more rounds. So while your reasoning is sound it is unfounded about the reason for carrying a revolver as opposed to a semi auto. However one should carry what one is comfortable with. Honestly I would be comfortable with either as long as I was proficient with both. The odds of the misfire or more rounds needed is miniscule.


Please add support for your contention more rounds vs misfire for me.

EVERYONE has a misfire story. I know of nobody who has needed more ammo.


It is not a matter of finding support. It is I feel just being logical. You may find 1 faulty round of factory ammo in every let us say 10,000 rounds and I am being lenient there. Now the chance of that round coming up in a situation is highly unlikely. However the chance of running out of ammo in a situation because of poorly placed or missed shots or multiple attackers is much more likely than coming across a bad factory round. That is my only point.

Addressing your misfire stories. I assume you are referring to people shooting at the range who fire thousands of rounds. Because usually a misfire in a life or death situation spells big trouble and they are not around to relate the story. Definitely one will come across a misfire if he shoots any amount of ammo at the range. But the odds of coming across that same bad round in a life or death situation are so high as to be moot. Most people never even face a life or death situation so it is a moot point.

Either way, in a life or death situation I don't want to be short on ammo and I certainly don't want a faulty round either. Just the odds of a faulty round rearing its ugly head at that time is highly unlikely as opposed to thousands of rounds spent on a firing range and the same faulty coming into play. I mean firing 3,000 rounds at a firing range and 3 rounds in a situation, the odds of running into the faulty round are much higher at the range when firing 3,000 rounds as opposed to 3.

Lastly if a semi auto the faulty round can be ejected by racking the slide definitely a last ditch effort. However if out of ammo, no amount of racking is going to help. All you have now is an expensive club. Of course pulling the trigger again brings a new round into play but if one only has 5 rounds to begin with you are starting to skate on thin ice.
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Dannydoyle
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Feeling you are right is not enough. If you are going to make broad based they need backing up.
Danny Doyle
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<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
acesover
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On 2013-08-25 19:10, Dannydoyle wrote:
Feeling you are right is not enough. If you are going to make broad based they need backing up.


Nothing is broad based. The chance of a bad round coming up in a confrontation is minimal as compared to running out of ammo. I can vouch for that having been in Nam...definitely a different situation, but running out of ammo was much more of a problem than bad ammo.

Seriously now. What do you feel the chances are higher of happening? Running into a bad round of ammo, or running out of ammo when only having 5 rounds to start with. Granted most situations end with about 3 rounds being fired by either party. But do the math. Also with what is on the streets today in the form of individuals as well as weapons, well enough said.

I will end by saying I would be comfortable with either a revolver or a semi auto if I was proficient with either.
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Dannydoyle
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Do equipment issues even figure into your reasoning? Dirt y guns and not well maintained slides and such?

No you "feel" you are right that is enough.
Danny Doyle
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<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
acesover
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On 2013-08-25 19:22, Dannydoyle wrote:
Do equipment issues even figure into your reasoning? Dirt y guns and not well maintained slides and such?

No you "feel" you are right that is enough.


I am speaking mostly for myself and anyone who has firearm common sense. If you read my earlier postyou would see where I said I maintain my weapons religiously.

Just having a firearm is not enough. You know that.

You must know your weapon and you must maintain it and become proficient with it. You do not go out and purchase a weapon and carry it and now you are safe. Hear that buzzer...that is the sound of wrong. Know what sort of ammo you are using. Be it hollow points, hardball, what weight, etc. and why you are using it. Far to many people purchase a weapon and ammo and have no idea how to maintain their weapon and in some cases do not even know if it works because they never even fired it.

Also let me say there is definitely nothing wrong with a well maintained revolver and an individual that knows how to use it.
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Dannydoyle
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Sorry but feeling you are right with flawed logic does not cut it. You may very well be right. I don't know but you have in no way backed up your claim.
Danny Doyle
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<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
acesover
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On 2013-08-25 11:57, Dannydoyle wrote:
With semi auto or any firearm it is not if it will happen it is WHEN a misfire will.happen. It will happen. If it happens at the range ok. If it is at a point where you are needing to save a life I personally think it is unacceptable risk. Therefore a revolver.


You keep asking me to back up my claim. Can you back up your claim that running out of ammo is less likely than having a bad round show up in a life or death situation? Do they keep these stats as to which is more likely? Common sense dictates that running out of ammo is more likely to happen than finding a 1 in 10,0000 bad round in a life or death situation. First off that round has a 1 in 10,000 chance of turning up and secondly it has to be in a life or death situation. I would believe that in 10,000 firearms incidents the possibility of running out of ammo with only 5 rounds to start is much more likely to occur. Of course that is just my opinion and we all know about opinions. I respect youir opinions as an ex police officer but in this instance I just feel that you might be in error...maybe not. I sure don't want to be the test case.
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Dannydoyle
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Equipment problems. Why focus on the rounds?
Danny Doyle
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Bob1Dog
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You must know your weapon and you must maintain it and become proficient with it. You do not go out and purchase a weapon and carry it and now you are safe. Hear that buzzer...that is the sound of wrong. Know what sort of ammo you are using. Be it hollow points, hardball, what weight, etc. and why you are using it. Far to many people purchase a weapon and ammo and have no idea how to maintain their weapon and in some cases do not even know if it works because they never even fired it.

Also let me say there is definitely nothing wrong with a well maintained revolver and an individual that knows how to use it.

I know lots of folks who carry various handguns. Knowledge of rounds, care and maintenance are all tantamount to the responsibility of carrying. My initial training came from my father who taught me well as a youngster, and then later the military. If you can't maintain your weapon you shouldn't carry it, not matter what it is.

I'll also add that I do believe that some sort of training should come with a CCW permit, unless you can prove former military or law enforcement experience. Unfortunately there are a lot of hot dogs out there. I know a few of those too. Unfortunately.
What if the Hokey Pokey really IS what it's all about? Smile

My neighbor rang my doorbell at 2:30 a.m. this morning, can you believe that, 2:30 a.m.!? Lucky for him I was still up playing my drums.
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On 2013-08-25 17:15, mastermindreader wrote:
My girlfriend has a CCW for her Lady Smith five shot revolver. My revolver is a .357 Colt Lawman, but I never bother carrying it around.

I like the Lady Smith a lot. Especially the internal hammer. That would be my choice for my wife. An automatic wouldn't be good for her because she lacks the strength in her hands to operate the slide to eject or chamber a round.
What if the Hokey Pokey really IS what it's all about? Smile

My neighbor rang my doorbell at 2:30 a.m. this morning, can you believe that, 2:30 a.m.!? Lucky for him I was still up playing my drums.
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Holy cow! That much? I'm surprised Eric Holder hasn't filed a lawsuit against the state for making a basic constitutional right so difficult to obtain by the poor and minorities. It's obviously a plot to disenfranchise them from being able to obtain a CCW.

Do you or would you conceal carry and then, what is your preferred handgun? And then I might respond to your remark. Smile
What if the Hokey Pokey really IS what it's all about? Smile

My neighbor rang my doorbell at 2:30 a.m. this morning, can you believe that, 2:30 a.m.!? Lucky for him I was still up playing my drums.
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On 2013-08-24 11:20, frankvomit wrote:
I'm not a gun guy but I've always liked the look of the snub nose .38 special not the standard black but the shiny silver one.

Frank that's not a good reason to want to carry one, but also not a bad reason to look into what you think you like and see what you think you might like to learn something about. Especially if it might help to save the life of you or someone you love at some point. Smile
What if the Hokey Pokey really IS what it's all about? Smile

My neighbor rang my doorbell at 2:30 a.m. this morning, can you believe that, 2:30 a.m.!? Lucky for him I was still up playing my drums.
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acesover
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On 2013-08-25 21:58, Dannydoyle wrote:
Equipment problems. Why focus on the rounds?


Revolvers are much more complex than meets the eye. They must be maintained as much if not more than a good semi auto. If the cylinder does not index correctly you can have shaved bullets. If not properly cleaned the cylinder may not turn preventing firing. Many revolvers have more moving parts than a semi auto. So equipment failure is usually due to operator maintenance or should I say lack thereof.

I definitely do agree that if a FTF occurs in a revolver it is easier to correct by just pulling the trigger again as opposed to having to clear the weapon by racking the slide. However FTF is usually bad ammo and not the fault of the weapon. However everything you brought to the table in this discussion Dan is valid. It is a vanilla and chocolate ice cream debate as to which tastes better. Smile By the way I think chocolate rules. Smile
If I were to agree with you. Then we would both be wrong. As of Apr 5, 2015 10:26 pm I have 880 posts. Used to have over 1,000
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