The Magic Café
Username:
Password:
[ Lost Password ]
  [ Forgot Username ]
The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » The Good News! » » Bowl full of Crazy (0 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

Bryan Drake Show
View Profile
Regular user
Alabama
125 Posts

Profile of Bryan Drake Show
So I know this happens to others, but in the years of traveling, I have yet to experience this. Just thought I'd share with you guys.

Message from Facebook:

"I am writing to you because I love you, and I want to open your eyes to something very important. It's about your soul, and where you will spend eternity. I am NOT a judge , but God is . And his Holy word is now speaking :


"The cowardly, the unbelieving, the vile, the murderers, the sexually immoral,
those who practice magic arts, the idolaters and all liars
- their place will be in the fiery lake of burning sulfur. This is the second death."

The definition of MAGIC

mag•ic (ˈmædʒ ɪk)

n.
1. the art of producing illusions, as by sleight of hand.
2. the practice of using various techniques, as incantation, to exert control over the supernatural or the forces of nature.
3. a result of such practice.
4. power or influence exerted through this practice.
5. any extraordinary influence or power: the magic of fame.
adj.
6. done by or employed in magic: a magic trick.
7. mysteriously enchanting, skillful, or effective.

n
1. the art that, by use of spells, supposedly invokes supernatural powers to influence events; sorcery
2. the practice of this art
3. the practice of illusory tricks to entertain other people; conjuring
4. any mysterious or extraordinary quality or power the magic of springtime
like magic very quickly

Now I will give you some other relevant verses

Do not be yoked together with unbelievers. For what do righteousness and wickedness have in common? Or what fellowship can light have with darkness?
The night is nearly over; the day is almost here. So let us put aside the deeds of darkness and put on the armor of light.
to open their eyes and turn them from darkness to light, and from the power of Satan to God, so that they may receive forgiveness of sins and a place among those who are sanctified by faith in me.'
Turn from every APPEARANCE OF EVIL.

Anything that even APPEARS to be evil , we as followers of Christ should turn immediately from it. I watched you in Lincoln , Ne . And I was very sad. I read articles from your blog , where you attempt to expose others for using the name of JESUS CHRIST to make a living , to make money , to live the good life , to buy expensive plane tickets , and eat at expensive restaurants , live in nice houses , and have a awesome car and jewelry . All using the name of our savior Jesus . I ask you , is any of this true for you? No not millionaire , diamond , Bentley status . But none the less , Jesus said he did not even have a place to lay his head . He said if you want to make it into my kingdom , GO SELL ALL your earthy possessions , and FOLLOW ME. Give to the poor . Heal the sick , IN MY NAME . None of these things are done in the name of money , or for money by Jesus . They were FREE FREE. Really free. Not for a show fee mixed with magic . Jesus DID NOT roam around state to state doing the sleight of hand to trick people into coming to him. NO. It was the Holy Spirit who convicted people . The HOLY SPIRIT who revealed the truth. I ask you, when Jesus comes back any day now , is he going to be wanting to participate with you in one if your shows ? You know , the shows where you call the little ones he spoke of that none shall make stumble , Up on to the stage? Would Jesus be seen on stage with you , or even better , would Jesus want to lead one of your " mental deception" " illusion" lie shows ? You are really taking a huge risk. What will it profit a man if he gains the WHOLE WORLD even , but looses his own soul? You know exactly what you are doing. You have no excuse . Just because at the end of your show , you say the name Jesus , and use a few words from the bible , doesn't mean you are doing good . Remember when Jesus went to throw out all of the buyers and sellers from the temple? And then remember what you , standing at the altar of the LORD , told everyone to go and do at the end of your show? Go buy your merchandise . And I will remind you, your last words , they weren't about Jesus , or God . They were telling ppl to go and LIKE your FB page , twitter , YouTube , all of them . And why? More likes , more attention , more money , more , shows , more advertising , more FAME . In the name of Jesus. Repent brother , and cease from practicing this darkness . Repent and stop these things , turn away from this evil. You want to change lives , you want your life to change ? PREACH THE BIBLE ONLY And let the HOLY SPIRIT do the work! YOU have no power . The only power is the POWER Of Almighty GOD . Unless of course you are serving a different god . I love you, please hear and believe what I have wrote to you. God Bless you.

I know you may not respond , and that's ok. And I am not out to " get you" . But I just wanted to explain one thing. There is a new age movement going on , that mixes the world of satan with the gospel of Jesus Christ, and Jesus is not happy about it. The road to eternal life is narrow , and FEW find it. That's why he said SEPARATE yourselves from the world . GOD is HOLY , like seriously HOLY . God has no fellowship in the dark. There are many many ppl even many many churches who have traded the true HOLY gospel , for a watered down inspirational motivational encouragement message. The majority of the pulpits are not preaching to live Holy and turn from evil. To repent of all sins and cease in doing them . What road are you going down, and what is the overall message of Life your show promotes . How is it good to mix the works of Jesus with what Houdini and such do? Risk taking. What did Jesus say to he devil when he asked him to throw himself down to prove he was the son of God ? Tho shall not tempt The Lord your God ."
Craig Logan
View Profile
Special user
Michigan
540 Posts

Profile of Craig Logan
Wow. Reminds me of an article DaffyDoug posted a week or so ago. It is sad to see. I am always bothered when someone uses the Oxford dictionary to define a Greek word.
Aside form that, I too have met this confrontation in a much smaller way. The use of playing cards in my show was seen as "the appearance of evil" because they are also used for poker.

As for the tirade in the middle about making a living, I think Paul received monetary compensation so he could remain on the mission field. I'm scratching my head. The body of Christ needs our prayers.

I rest assured believing God uses ministries like yours to convey His truth in the same way Christ himself used object lessons to convey spiritual points.

In His Service,
CM
"A wizard is not to be made in a day." -Professor Hoffmann (Modern Magic)
Bryan Drake Show
View Profile
Regular user
Alabama
125 Posts

Profile of Bryan Drake Show
Quote:
On 2013-11-11 15:32, mediocre_magic wrote:
Wow. Reminds me of an article DaffyDoug posted a week or so ago. It is sad to see. I am always bothered when someone uses the Oxford dictionary to define a Greek word.
Aside form that, I too have met this confrontation in a much smaller way. The use of playing cards in my show was seen as "the appearance of evil" because they are also used for poker.

As for the tirade in the middle about making a living, I think Paul received monetary compensation so he could remain on the mission field. I'm scratching my head. The body of Christ needs our prayers.

I rest assured believing God uses ministries like yours to convey His truth in the same way Christ himself used object lessons to convey spiritual points.

In His Service,


CM


Thanks brother! Yeah it was like a two fold attack that was incredibly off base (her other two posts were even worse, but didn't want to bore you guys too much lol) This one started with the Magic is Evil then into a weird jealous type of anger that I had merch at my show.

Very strange. I'll be praying for you as well man.
Donald Dunphy
View Profile
Inner circle
Victoria, BC, Canada
7401 Posts

Profile of Donald Dunphy
The person seemed to attack from several fronts. So, if there was a discussion, it would be wise to talk about one point at a time.

The long and the short of one part of it, is that entertainment magic isn't really mentioned in the Bible. It's occultic magic that is mentioned in the Bible. I once did a study of the original greek words for an essay I wrote, which I later published in a book. Magic is a word with multiple meanings, just like some other words.

- Donald
Donald Dunphy is a Victoria Magician, British Columbia, Canada.
Danny Kazam
View Profile
Inner circle
1516 Posts

Profile of Danny Kazam
This has been beat to death here, nor is this the place really to resolve it. I appreciate you sharing your story but I think it's been clearly established a zillion times that there will be people who will misunderstand what we do, not just other christians but non christians as well. I mean well when I say that. This is best to be discussed between you, your Pastor or Priest and God. I hate to see our brothers and sisters who are weak in knowledge be constanly made a topic of discussion when we should be more sensitive to them instead.

The real person who we should be praying for is the individual who is not familiar with how magic entertainment is accomplished.

What's more important? Keeping magic secrets, or the spiritual health of our brothers and sisters who think magic is real?

The only bowl full of crazy is the constant bashing of our brothers and sisters who maybe weaker than us. It's not spiritually encouraging nor uplifting.

I would love to hear a story like a friend of mine shared with me once. He had a similiar experience with and older lady. He dicided to befriend her, and slowly showed her how many tricks were accomplished while also explaining to her the difference between magic in the bible and magic for entertainment purposes. He took his time with her, and spent many times ministering to her. In the end, she was able to understand the difference and in the process created a bond.
Keep your dreams alive. Understand to achieve anything requires faith and belief in yourself, vision, hard work, determination, and dedication. Remember all things are possible for those who believe.
Danny Kazam
View Profile
Inner circle
1516 Posts

Profile of Danny Kazam
What purpose does it serve discussing it here where she cannot read it? How does it help our sister in the Lord? How does it benifit her spiritually? Have you taken the initiative to help ease her mind? No, I am not being a jerk, I am being spiritually assertive and can't understand why we need so many threads on this same topic that always resorts in putting down a weaker member of our faith.
Keep your dreams alive. Understand to achieve anything requires faith and belief in yourself, vision, hard work, determination, and dedication. Remember all things are possible for those who believe.
Vlad_77
View Profile
Inner circle
The Netherlands
5829 Posts

Profile of Vlad_77
Quote:
On 2013-11-11 23:11, Danny Kazam wrote:
This has been beat to death here, nor is this the place really to resolve it. I appreciate you sharing your story but I think it's been clearly established a zillion times that there will be people who will misunderstand what we do, not just other christians but non christians as well. I mean well when I say that. This is best to be discussed between you, your Pastor or Priest and God. I hate to see our brothers and sisters who are weak in knowledge be constanly made a topic of discussion when we should be more sensitive to them instead.

The real person who we should be praying for is the individual who is not familiar with how magic entertainment is accomplished.

What's more important? Keeping magic secrets, or the spiritual health of our brothers and sisters who think magic is real?

The only bowl full of crazy is the constant bashing of our brothers and sisters who maybe weaker than us. It's not spiritually encouraging nor uplifting.

I would love to hear a story like a friend of mine shared with me once. He had a similiar experience with and older lady. He dicided to befriend her, and slowly showed her how many tricks were accomplished while also explaining to her the difference between magic in the bible and magic for entertainment purposes. He took his time with her, and spent many times ministering to her. In the end, she was able to understand the difference and in the process created a bond.


Danny,

Well written brother! The only thing I can add is that most people making these attacks are taking the word "magic" out of its original context and meaning from Ancient Greek. As such, you are spot on in that such a thing needs to be discussed with a Priest or Minister. It's important that the Priest or Minister have a good understanding of Ancient Greek (and Hebrew for that matter) such that the context of what is exactly meant by "magic" and "sorcery."

Lastly, Danny is right in that it has been beaten to death not only here, but at least a millenia and a half ago by the early Fathers of Christianity; it's a settled question but, I would hazard a guess that because magic is so rarely encountered even in these days of instant "YouTube" it, that it isn't the hot button issue in the same league as theosis/salvation, repentance, abortion, capital punishment, and other more immediate and crucial matters of doctrine and belief.

MANY priests and ministers perform magic. These people have spent years in seminary and I simply cannot imagine that after all of that study, these priests and ministers would accept all other tenets of doctrine but ignore proscriptions against magic as performance if indeed any existed. As it stands, only a very small number of churches have proscriptions against it and interestingly those same churches also depart from more important tenets of Christianity; these churches also tend to flirt with hereisies resurrected by "churches" out side of Christianity such as the Jehovah's Witnesses and the now defunct criminal organization formerly known as the Worldwide Church of God - NOT to be confused with the Protestant denomination known as The Church of God.

Lastly, if all will permit me one more thought, I'll present an idea that's been rollin' around me noggin for some time now.

It would be wonderful if there was a committee of priests, ministers, and theologians who also have an interest in magic to come together and write an educational treatise explaining why magic as performance art is not a tool of Satan. Obviously the ultimate Authority is God Himself, but, the point is that clergy are the teachers of His word and at least in my estimation are much better equipped to engage in creating such a treatise that could be distributed to magicians who are Christians. I do not belong to the FCM but I wonder if that organization has ever pondered such an idea. I cannot post in that section because it's not a post that would "directly" have something to do with FCM, and Café regulations clearly state that posts in that section are for FCM considerations only.

So, have any FCM members discussed this issue? Joe M. Turner's response and defense of magic is really a great start and could be something upon which to build.

Humbly in Christ,
Vlad
Craig Logan
View Profile
Special user
Michigan
540 Posts

Profile of Craig Logan
Thank you Danny, for your gentle rebuke. Contacting the woman directly is a lot more helpful than commiserating. I believe the proliferation of these posts is not to slam those weaker in the faith, but to seek encouragement from brothers/sisters in the Lord. My original post did include a call to pray for the body of Christ. I was referring to those like the sister rebuking Bryan.

To Vlad's point, as a minister myself, I think a joint treatise would be remarkably beneficial to the body of Christ. I have thought about writing an ebook on that very same topic.
"A wizard is not to be made in a day." -Professor Hoffmann (Modern Magic)
Mike Maturen
View Profile
Inner circle
Michigan's Beautiful Sunrise Side
2725 Posts

Profile of Mike Maturen
Vlad...

I do believe such a document already exists. I have something on my desk at home that was written awhile back on this topic. I will have to dig it up and share it here.
Mike Maturen
World of Wonder Entertainment
The Magic and Mayhem of Mike Maturen
989-335-1661
mikematuren@gmail.com

AUTHOR OF "A NEW DAWN--Weekly Wisdom From Everyday Life"

member: International Magician's Society
Bryan Drake Show
View Profile
Regular user
Alabama
125 Posts

Profile of Bryan Drake Show
To make a rebuttal gentlemen:

Just to let you know, This is only the first part of a discussion that she and I had. I did not include mine or my wife's responses and subsequent responses from this lady being that it was rather lengthy to start with. Therefore I can see where you are coming from, but beg to differ on your approach. If you are so inclined I will post what those responses were.

Now to mention something that hasn't been done to death, anybody got a gospel presentation for Hippity Hop Rabbits.........................
Donald Dunphy
View Profile
Inner circle
Victoria, BC, Canada
7401 Posts

Profile of Donald Dunphy
Sometimes, Gospel performers share the Robert Hill article with the concerned Christian. This is a well known resource that has been around for many years.

It's available on the FCM website: http://fcm.org/usa/should-a-christian-do-magic/

Here's info on the book I wrote: http://www.donalddunphy.com/usedmagic.html

- Donald
Donald Dunphy is a Victoria Magician, British Columbia, Canada.
Mike Maturen
View Profile
Inner circle
Michigan's Beautiful Sunrise Side
2725 Posts

Profile of Mike Maturen
The one I was speaking about was written by Andre Kole. Here are links to a couple of his articles:

http://knowgodpersonally.org/articles/qu......-god.php

http://knowgodpersonally.org/articles/qu......-god.php
Mike Maturen
World of Wonder Entertainment
The Magic and Mayhem of Mike Maturen
989-335-1661
mikematuren@gmail.com

AUTHOR OF "A NEW DAWN--Weekly Wisdom From Everyday Life"

member: International Magician's Society
Donald Dunphy
View Profile
Inner circle
Victoria, BC, Canada
7401 Posts

Profile of Donald Dunphy
Andre also wrote a book ("Miracles or Magic?"), that was published in 1987, that is a great resource.

- Donald
Donald Dunphy is a Victoria Magician, British Columbia, Canada.
Dougini
View Profile
Inner circle
The Beautiful State Of Maine
6724 Posts

Profile of Dougini
When Yeshua left, he said we are commanded two things: God (The Father) is FIRST. Foremost in your life, and we are to LOVE one another. In other words BE KIND to each other. He even showed us HOW! That's what is important. How we treat each other!

I think one of the most memorable things I read was where the guy came to give gifts to God. God said, "Hey, go fix your problems with your buddy. Make peace, then come back and give me gifts!" How we treat each other. Money does not matter. A homeless person can hold a door open for someone!

Religion gets in the way sometimes. Can't see The Truth, because the big spectre of RELIGION blots it out! I do magic to be kind. I never charge for it. It's my "random act of kindness". Hey, if ONE person has been entertained and smiles...I've done MY job!

"Be kind to one another". Smile

Doug
Vlad_77
View Profile
Inner circle
The Netherlands
5829 Posts

Profile of Vlad_77
Quote:
On 2013-11-13 15:26, Dougini wrote:
When Yeshua left, he said we are commanded two things: God (The Father) is FIRST. Foremost in your life, and we are to LOVE one another. In other words BE KIND to each other. He even showed us HOW! That's what is important. How we treat each other!

I think one of the most memorable things I read was where the guy came to give gifts to God. God said, "Hey, go fix your problems with your buddy. Make peace, then come back and give me gifts!" How we treat each other. Money does not matter. A homeless person can hold a door open for someone!

Religion gets in the way sometimes. Can't see The Truth, because the big spectre of RELIGION blots it out! I do magic to be kind. I never charge for it. It's my "random act of kindness". Hey, if ONE person has been entertained and smiles...I've done MY job!

"Be kind to one another". Smile

Doug

Hi Doug,

I don't think "religion" in and of itself gets in the way. Rather, it's more how we conduct ourselves. The Pharisee "syndrome" is what I call it. The Pharisees allowed the PRIDE of their religion to get in the way. Not heeding the words of Christ our True God, they stuck to the letter of the Law rather than its spirit.

I like what you said about being kind and this set of verses seems appropriate:

Matthew 25:31-46
The Sheep and the Goats

31 “When the Son of Man comes in His glory, and all the angels with Him, He will sit on his glorious throne. 32 All the nations will be gathered before Him, and He will separate the people one from another as a shepherd separates the sheep from the goats. 33 He will put the sheep on His right and the goats on His left.

34 “Then the King will say to those on His right, ‘Come, you who are blessed by My Father; take your inheritance, the kingdom prepared for you since the creation of the world. 35 For I was hungry and you gave me something to eat, I was thirsty and you gave me something to drink, I was a stranger and you invited me in, 36 I needed clothes and you clothed me, I was sick and you looked after me, I was in prison and you came to visit me.’

37 “Then the righteous will answer Him, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry and feed you, or thirsty and give you something to drink? 38 When did we see you a stranger and invite you in, or needing clothes and clothe you? 39 When did we see you sick or in prison and go to visit you?’

40 “The King will reply, ‘Truly I tell you, whatever you did for one of the least of these brothers and sisters of mine, you did for Me.’

41 “Then He will say to those on his left, ‘Depart from me, you who are cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels. 42 For I was hungry and you gave me nothing to eat, I was thirsty and you gave me nothing to drink, 43 I was a stranger and you did not invite me in, I needed clothes and you did not clothe me, I was sick and in prison and you did not look after me.’

44 “They also will answer, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry or thirsty or a stranger or needing clothes or sick or in prison, and did not help you?’

45 “He will reply, ‘Truly I tell you, whatever you did not do for one of the least of these, you did not do for Me.’

46 “Then they will go away to eternal punishment, but the righteous to eternal life.”

Humbly in Christ,
Vlad
Mike Maturen
View Profile
Inner circle
Michigan's Beautiful Sunrise Side
2725 Posts

Profile of Mike Maturen
Vlad:

I think you make valid point...it is not religion that is the problem, it is man's interpretation of it that is.

Jesus left us a visible Church on earth...and organized human institution to promulgate His ways and His laws. We need to follow it, or see our judgement as a result.
Mike Maturen
World of Wonder Entertainment
The Magic and Mayhem of Mike Maturen
989-335-1661
mikematuren@gmail.com

AUTHOR OF "A NEW DAWN--Weekly Wisdom From Everyday Life"

member: International Magician's Society
daffydoug
View Profile
Eternal Order
Look mom! I've got
14063 Posts

Profile of daffydoug
Truth is what God says. Religion is what man says God says..
The difficult must become easy, the easy beautiful and the beautiful magical.
The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » The Good News! » » Bowl full of Crazy (0 Likes)
[ Top of Page ]
All content & postings Copyright © 2001-2020 Steve Brooks. All Rights Reserved.
This page was created in 0.25 seconds requiring 5 database queries.
The views and comments expressed on The Magic Café
are not necessarily those of The Magic Café, Steve Brooks, or Steve Brooks Magic.
> Privacy Statement <

ROTFL Billions and billions served! ROTFL