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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Tricky business » » Hard to deny the value of "luck". (0 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

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Bazinga
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On Mar 1, 2014, Ken Northridge wrote:
And then, no one has brought up what God brings to this equation, which I'm sure will send this conversation into a hopeless state of irreconcilable difference.

I always thought you were a respectful guy and worth listening to, until you decided to instigate a fight. Is that the best way to represent your god and its values?
Scott Burton
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Quote:
On Mar 2, 2014, Bazinga wrote:
Quote:
On Mar 1, 2014, Ken Northridge wrote:
And then, no one has brought up what God brings to this equation, which I'm sure will send this conversation into a hopeless state of irreconcilable difference.

I always thought you were a respectful guy and worth listening to, until you decided to instigate a fight. Is that the best way to represent your god and its values?


Actually, I don't think he was trying to instigate a fight. I think he's sincere in saying that luck and his god are similar forces or at least a similar topic. And I don't think "god" is completely off topic. I say this because there are some who would lump together "luck", "god", "fate", "the universe" (as per the book "The Secret"), and other such "outside forces" as those acting upon us. This is why "luck" can be so hard to talk about because there are multiple versions of what this means. I personally don't think there are outside magical/supernatural forces working on me but, as per my previous post, the existence or non-existence of such forces do not change my actions in any practical sense (I'd just consider it a bonus).
Dannydoyle
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Yea this is exactly what I had hoped to convey. Thanks all.

Really I was more just relaying a story about a short term fluctuation in chance. I was conveying a story of happy circumstance. Nothing more. Not saying you should "rely" on luck, but rather saying that things do happen that are of a fortunate turn and it is great when they happen. I was saying that in spite of all the work, it is great to have these things happen and the fact is they DO happen. Nothing more.

Nobody needs to prove they are the smartest person on the subject. Nobody needs to be the worlds foremost authority. All I wanted to do was put up a thread that didn't have a lot of BS involved in it. What a success I have been. Nobody has to have their own "clever take" on the subject. It was fairly straight forward.

As much as I can but heads with Curtis he sums it up perfectly. Sometimes the timing is just perfect. That really was my point. Thank you Curtis.

Now go ahead argue.

Wow amazing.
Danny Doyle
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<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
Bazinga
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Perhaps you are right, Scott, about Ken's intentions. I admit I'm a very anti-god these days. No one could live through what my family is and be pro-god. Although my mother still is very pro-god. It's a very long and complicated story and I'm not going to get personal in an open forum. I'll just say (for one example) that to see a woman who has devoted her life to god, Jesus, and her church be stripped away of her health, her home, even her Medicare (for those that don't know, your Medicare can be taken away if you lose your home, move in with your son and have no visible means of income or expenses) yet still pray every day, still give what she has to her church’s causes, and even sings hymns while trying to fold laundry. Then to be inflicted with a burning pain when anything touches her flesh, and now her memory. Yeah, god. Thank you god for torturing this poor little old lady who gave you everything.

I'm sorry, I'm sorry I'm derailing the thread. I'm sorry. Just take that as where I'm coming from. Denny's story is a great example of what I call "Timing is everything." Yes, it's lucky, serendipity, good fortune, whatever name one wants to apply. I also agree with you that it's purely random and nothing to do with supernatural forces. It's all coincidence.

The only thing I don't see is anyone arguing. I see a thread where everyone but one agrees with everyone else. And the one dissenter was polite about it (except for what I thought was instigation.) If that what one calls an argument, I can see why there are so many threads around that one that turn very ugly very quickly.

To quote that, "Wow. Amazing."
Scott Burton
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I too see people with very challenging lives who keep saying "god has a plan for me and I place my trust in him" and so on. Same with people who like books like "The Secret" where they can channel the forces of the universe through their thoughts. There is a danger to placing responsibility to people and things outside of yourself.
Bazinga
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On Mar 2, 2014, Scott Burton wrote:
I too see people with very challenging lives who keep saying "god has a plan for me and I place my trust in him" and so on. Same with people who like books like "The Secret" where they can channel the forces of the universe through their thoughts. There is a danger to placing responsibility to people and things outside of yourself.

Absolutely. All we can say to those people is, "Good luck." Smile
Ken Northridge
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For the record, Scott hit the nail on the head. I was certainly not instigating a fight, but was referring to what luck has to do with God, although I knew there are some strong opinions on the subject. I am searching for answers on this myself and hoped someone would share their thoughts. I won’t pursue this because I can see this subject hits close to home for some. I’m truly sorry, Bazinga, for what you’ve been through and hope better days are ahead.
"Love is the real magic." -Doug Henning
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Bazinga
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Thanks for clearing that up, Ken. And thanks for your kind words. I really didn't want to bring up my woes but I knew an explanation of my nastiness was necessary.

I will say this about "luck," or whatever term anyone wants to use: There were times when I thought I was in quite a fix, but in the end things just seemed to work out. I can't say if it was because of what I did or in spite of it. But they worked out. What I'm experiencing right now is not on me directly, except for trying to take care of the family, but the really bad things are happening to my loved ones. I think I'll be o.k. (or at least survive) but they obviously will not.

Thanks again,
Bazinga!
charliecheckers
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Bazinga brings up a point related to God, that I think can be discussed here in a broader sense. Despite his Mother's seemingly good works, she has experienced horrible set backs. Situations like this are an opportunity for something good to come from her suffering. Bringing her situation to other people's attention is an opportunity for us to react and improve as a society so these things do not occur in the future. Weather one believes these things are inspired by God is a personal choice.

This relates to luck as well. Bad luck can be an opportunity to have good come from it. It depends on how we react to those situations.

Bazinga - sorry to hear about your mother's situation. Perhaps having you there is the answer to her prayers.
Bazinga
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Charlie,

Thank you VERY MUCH. She'd most likely agree with you. Right now I have no other goal or purpose than to take the best care of her I can. I fail in some way every day, and that's probably why I get nasty around here. For that, I'm sorry (most of the time Smile )

Bazinga!
Scott Burton
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Failure (and bad luck or whatever situational description you use to describe a less-than-ideal circumstance) can be a wonderful opportunity for learning and a changed approach to bring one's "luck" from bad to good. Not that we wish for "bad luck" but it is a choice to use it to our advantage. But, again, it's our responsibility to take this approach to turn things around rather than to hope that another person or spiritual influence will help us.
TomBoleware
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I'm a big believer that prayer works and can play a big part in a persons success. But I
don't think God and Luck have that much in common. That's two completely different things.


Bazinga, I too wish you and the family nothing but the best. While it may not appear that your mom
is blessed with everything, I'm betting she feels blessed for having you around. I admire you for giving
up a big part of your life to care for them. That my friend is what life is all about, those in a position
to care and help others is about as successful as it gets. I'm not the only one that believes that either;
Henry Ford once said “To do more for the world than the world does for you - that is success.”



Speaking of luck, I once heard somebody say: Bad luck is when your ship comes in and you're at the airport.
Good luck is when you at the airport and you find a nickel heads up. But seriously, yes getting the lucky breaks
at the right time can change things. We can't and shouldn't depend on luck to always come our way, but we do have to recognize that sometimes it can make a difference.


Tom
"Entrepreneurs are willing to work 80 hours a week to avoid working 40 hours a week"--Lori Greiner

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Bazinga
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Thank you Tom. I appreciate that.

http://www.themagiccafe.com/forums/viewt......rum=17&0
Dannydoyle
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Maybe this is the root of your hostility in general Bazinga.

I am sorry you have personal troubles. I wish you the best. Life is what gets thrown at us. Some get through life with an absolute faith in a higher power. Others make it through just fine absent any such belief. Whichever gets you through life is what is right for you.

I hope things work out the beast that can be expected for you.
Danny Doyle
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<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
Bazinga
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Yes, Danny, I think it is.

Thank you for your kind words.
Dannydoyle
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Stupid Gorilla fingers, I meant BEST FOR YOU. NOT beast for you!
Danny Doyle
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<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
Bazinga
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Smile I didn't notice that. But that applies too. If I can work out the beast, things should be better.

Thanks again.
Ken Northridge
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My wife and I are registered for the Marine Corps Marathon in Washington DC on October 26th. The field is limited to 30,000 participants. There are so many that want to be a part of this painful experience that you must enter and pay by March 18th and be entered in a lottery system. Now, if we get in is that luck or is it God's will? If we don't get in is it luck or sigh of relief?
"Love is the real magic." -Doug Henning
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Scott Burton
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If your goal is to participate in this particular marathon, you have chosen to put your fate into another's hands as to whether you even get in (I would argue the hands of the event organizer and selection procedure rather than gods or luck). If your goal is to run a marathon (26.2 miles), you can do that any day any time starting from your front door and ending at your front door so no luck needed (just preparation). You can even run a marathon on a treadmill while watching TV (you might need to add incline to mimic outdoor effort). I do (nearly) weekly runs of a marathon distance and sometimes up to 50 mile training runs at a time. This just requires making the decision and getting permission from my wife (hmmm...is that the "luck" part??) to leave for a while. Perhaps you've helped to illustrate a point Ken: our choices directly influence the degree that luck plays on our success. If we both decide to run a marathon and (a) you sign up for a lottery system and (b) I just leave from my house tomorrow morning, then luck is influencing your success but plays little or no part in mine - to the same end goal.
Ken Northridge
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Very logical thinking Scott, and exactly what I would expect from a long distance runner. Its hard for athletes to deny the value of hard work.
"Love is the real magic." -Doug Henning
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