|
|
Go to page 1~2 [Next] | ||||||||||
plainman007 Special user 630 Posts |
Hi Guys,
Im just about to get a bunch of Led Pars. Im getting the 54 x 3w leds model, approx 10 nos. A chinese brand but reasonably good quality. They offered me 3 qualities and I chose medium level as this will be used maybe 10 times a year for certain specific small venue shows. If they outdo my pars or at least come close to half their power. I don't mind buying another 10 more. Im thinking of getting these because a few years ago led fixtures were pretty dull but nowadays they have turned out pretty bright and have vastly improved. My question is....Will 10 nos of the above mentioned LED fixtures work as front or gen lighting for a show where the venue has only a small stage of w25'x d15'. My regular par 64s will need a complete generator van at the venue etc and the venue is a little conservative kind of location if I'm putting it rightly. So I wanted to get 10 of these and put 5 on each side on T bar stands and these things will run 4 on a domestic power strip. If any of you are using such lights and know about 54x3w fixtures please do advise. The nature of this show wouldnt require to light an area larger than 20' x 10' as that would be the playing area. So if I get them on almost to the sides and at a 45° angle pointing downwards then would these suffice. Also I am not looking for an extremely intense kind of lighting. A tad bit subdued is ok. Please advise. Thanks |
|||||||||
plainman007 Special user 630 Posts |
None of you using LED par cans here ?
|
|||||||||
Kevin Ridgeway V.I.P. Indianapolis, IN & Phoenix, AZ 1832 Posts |
I'll follow up here later. We're in the e middle of a 10 day run here in FL with 2-3 shows per day. I responded to your PM.
Living Illusions
Ridgeway & Johnson Entertainment Inc Kevin Ridgeway & Kristen Johnson aka Lady Houdini The World's Premier Female Escape Artist www.LadyHoudini.com www.livingillusions.com |
|||||||||
abrell Loyal user Remscheid, Germany 284 Posts |
The only problem with LED PARs is the color rendering. Red, Green and Blue mixes to a quite unpleasant White. This white light is usually very unpleasing on human flesh. The skin tone does not look nice.
Therefore professional lighting tends to use RGBW or RGBWA instead of RGB. W stands for White - there are extra white LEDs. And A stands for Amber. If you have white and amber LEDs then you can blend very nice skin tones. The best solution with LED lighting is the X7 system from ETC. But this system is very expensive. Therefore I still use tungsten lighting for human skin, especially facial lighting. Using LED for colored lighting reduces energy consumption and heat. Therefore there should be enough electrical power to operate some few halogen spots for some front light/ key light. |
|||||||||
plainman007 Special user 630 Posts |
Im getting RGBW units
|
|||||||||
plainman007 Special user 630 Posts |
Anyone have a few pics to share of your setup with LED used as general lighting. I saw a few on youtube and google but I don't know if the cam exposure is bumped up there to show the lights/stage as being brighter than it actually is there. So if you guys can share a few pics of your led setup and just inform that the pics is almost what the real eye would see, then I can calculate how many units are needed etc.
Thanks |
|||||||||
plainman007 Special user 630 Posts |
Im quite well versed with the technicalities of these lights such as RGB, RGBW, RGBWA and some which even come with UV diodes. Im aware of the video flicker problem and how they appear more so at dimmer settings than when the lights are at full intensity. Also the colored fringing in shadows, though they do not appear so much in RGBW and RGBA fixtures. All these things are fine. I only want some real world proof as to how many lights would fill a 25'x15' stage. No matter if your lights are 36 watt, or a totally different number of units, or a different sized stage etc I can still use your example as a judgement scale and calculate accordingly.
|
|||||||||
gothike Elite user 463 Posts |
The problem with the lack of answers is your unknown specifics.
What is the throw distance for the lighting. How far from stage are your lights. Which lights are you using, how many quads in the fixture and what's the wattage. What's the ambient light. Kevin will help you out and ask him about the lights he uses.
Control your Show Music from a PC from 800 ft away with a remote control. Send me a message to find out how......
|
|||||||||
plainman007 Special user 630 Posts |
The ambient light is ZERO.
Pitch dark auditorium. This is going to be my main lighting. Along with about 6 moving heads as back/rim lighting. The distance from stage apron to each tree stand holding the led pars would be about 20 feet. 5 on each side of the stage are proposed. There are no quads here. RGBW led pars with 54x3w leds. |
|||||||||
gothike Elite user 463 Posts |
Www.themagiccafe.com/forums/viewtopic.ph......forum=11
3 watts quads (RGBW) are the older generation lighting. 10 watts Quads are the next gen. Visit the link I sent and then shoot Kevin an email. The lights he sells should be similar to the output of a Regular Source Four Par. Or you can waste your money and buy the 3watts fixtures. Lighting is like sound, you will get louder sound from a 400 watt speaker amp, than 4X 100 watts speak amps.
Control your Show Music from a PC from 800 ft away with a remote control. Send me a message to find out how......
|
|||||||||
plainman007 Special user 630 Posts |
Buying from Kevin etc is out of the question. Im across the globe from the USA. There are always more expensive options to anything and everything.
|
|||||||||
thomasR Inner circle 1189 Posts |
LED lights seem to vary a great deal. It really doesn't matter how many you have per side. If the pars are bright enough and have a good wide wash then 2 per side could be plenty for a stage the size you describe. If the pars are not bright enough for the throw distance you need.. adding pars is not going to help anything.
I would suggest you visit a show room, and look at the specific LED's you can purchase. Make sure they have a good throw before spending that kind of money. Again... It would be better to have fewer lights that are ideal for your needs, rather than MORE lights that aren't bright enough to handle your needs. As for the color mixing... it's true that RGB together creates an icky front wash, but you can still mix the colors a bit to get a decent "color corrected" tone. |
|||||||||
plainman007 Special user 630 Posts |
Thomas >
Some fixtures seem to be right with the whites. They do vary a lot by each manufacturer as you say. I think since I'm going RGBW, id be slightly better off on this issue. I was also thinking of mixing the white to a slightly warmer shade maybe to elminate the ghostyness (if that's even a word) of the white. The throw distance I'm looking at is only about 15-20 feet, which is pretty nominal I assume ? Can you explain to me why you feel more number of lights isn't better ? I mean in terms of redundancy and angles to be covered. I always assumed to opposite. Even in photography they add flash heads next to each other to get double the output of light from a particular direction. Also can you tell me, instead of having my general lights out front near the apron of the stage, can I have them only on the sides and ever slightly to the front ofcourse. Meaning somewhere near the first wing downstage and shining down towards centre stage ? |
|||||||||
thomasR Inner circle 1189 Posts |
Yes... an RGBW will make this much less of an issue. And honestly the fact that you know about this issue, and you plan on mixing colors to create the shade that looks best for you is really 80% of the problem. Many times people are just not aware this is an issue and put up all the colors and don't realize they could make things look more natural and eliminate the "ghostyness" as you say (which is a perfect way to describe it).
What I meant is... having additional lights is not going to help the situation if the throw distance of the lights is the problem. For what you are describing to me, if you had the right fixtures, 2 pars per side is plenty. Again.. don't guess, either visit a showroom or talk on the phone with a sales person that understands lights. Make sure you are getting a fixture that is designed to create a wash, and not a narrow beam of light. (you may be well aware of this already... again the problem is "LED PARS" vary so much in design). As for position.. that depends on a few things. You want the lights to be in line with where you are standing. You don't want them to be too far in front, then you will have shadows. So first wing may be ideal. If you had 2 pars on each side you want one par to be in line cutting straight across, and the other par to be angled upstage, being sure that it is focused off of the back wall or back curtain. Obviously you will want to play around and check positions and focus points for your specific conditions and routine. Even if you buy more than 4 lights, I suggest you start with 2 lights per side, focus the way I suggest, and then look at the stage and ask yourself "do I need more lighting for a general wash, and if so.. where?" |
|||||||||
plainman007 Special user 630 Posts |
The showroom owner says the beam angle is about 35deg. Not 25 or 45 deg as we mostly see doing the rounds. Again this is due to the positioning the manufacturer adopts for the led board when mounting them in the housing and as you say, theres nothing we can do about it. If I go the direct china import route, its costing a trifle MORE than what this guy charges and the package may also attract customs duty if it gets scanned.
|
|||||||||
Kevin Ridgeway V.I.P. Indianapolis, IN & Phoenix, AZ 1832 Posts |
Just a side note. Here is a batch of new 18 RGBA 10 watt quad LED's. These are the ip65 rated waterproof version. These are going into a touring alligator education show.
Living Illusions
Ridgeway & Johnson Entertainment Inc Kevin Ridgeway & Kristen Johnson aka Lady Houdini The World's Premier Female Escape Artist www.LadyHoudini.com www.livingillusions.com |
|||||||||
plainman007 Special user 630 Posts |
Quote:
All these products are not available to me. The point of my thread here was to find advise on how many units of what wattage it takes to cover a small stage of 25'x15' approximately. Or at least to know what kind of rig others are using as opposed to what are all available for sale. In fact I found an old thread of yours where youve shown a pic of how 6 led pars are front lighting your stage with the water escape mid stage. That one pic helped understand more than much of technical discussions. I wanted to ask you, in that picture were only those 6 fixtures lighting the stage as you have said there because, there seems to be some additional front lighting which is falling on the truss rigs also from front. |
|||||||||
Kevin Ridgeway V.I.P. Indianapolis, IN & Phoenix, AZ 1832 Posts |
The light you see washing the truss is from two ground based pars illuminating Kristen when she does her aerial stunt. That is their only purpose. Other than that, yes that 16'x16' stage is lit with 6 LED fixtures.
Hope that helps.
Living Illusions
Ridgeway & Johnson Entertainment Inc Kevin Ridgeway & Kristen Johnson aka Lady Houdini The World's Premier Female Escape Artist www.LadyHoudini.com www.livingillusions.com |
|||||||||
plainman007 Special user 630 Posts |
Hello Kevin, That stage is 16'x16' exact ? right from edge to edge or do you mean the playing area is 16x16 ?
Thanks |
|||||||||
gothike Elite user 463 Posts |
Kevin,
As a reference the 6 led fixtures. What are their specs?
Control your Show Music from a PC from 800 ft away with a remote control. Send me a message to find out how......
|
|||||||||
The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » F/X » » Get a batch of LED DMX Pars to use as general lighting for a show (0 Likes) | ||||||||||
Go to page 1~2 [Next] |
[ Top of Page ] |
All content & postings Copyright © 2001-2024 Steve Brooks. All Rights Reserved. This page was created in 0.03 seconds requiring 5 database queries. |
The views and comments expressed on The Magic Café are not necessarily those of The Magic Café, Steve Brooks, or Steve Brooks Magic. > Privacy Statement < |