So Roger,

Perhaps you would like to share a little behind the scenes history in regards to your Bar Cup that so may professionals are using behind the bar these days.

What inspired you? How long did it take to work out the design and manufacturing?

:smoke:

Roger,

Being a Cup guy, I would like to know all the history and what was involved bringing it to market... didn't you have to go a few extra steps to make it food ready?

Thanks,
Bruce

Hi "Boss" Steve, Bruce and everyone else........

In order to answer your questions, I need to go wayyyyy back and tell you I first saw the Chop Cup performed in a small gin-mill in Swan Lake, NY at the tender age of 10. Kilcoin's Tavern was owned by magician Al McCoyd. Al was the first bar magician I had ever seen.... but after all, I was only 10. He inspired me to learn more about magic and would teach me a trick every time I would visit; as long as I performed the previously taught effect to his liking. There was another young magician at that time who Al inspired as well... but I doubt you have heard of him. The other protege currently lives in Vegas. His name is Jeff McBride. To date... Jeff and I seem to be the only magicians who are aware of Al's former existence. He died in 2003... but his magical influence lives on through Jeff and myself.

I received my first Chop Cup as a Christmas present at the age of 12. It was a great cup from Magic Inc, made from spun aluminum. Little did I know, I would be making them out of stainless steel 20 years later.

Probably from the past influence of Al McCoyd, when I was in my twenties, I gave up a boring government job (with a great retirement package) to tend bar and perform magic which included a chop cup routine. In my early thirties I became the working partner of a tavern called "The Hat & Hare Pub." I continued the tradition of using the chop cup behind the bar... and actually used a Rings & Things Chop Cup to choose my glassware for the tavern, you see I used the Chop Cup as the metal part of a cocktail shaker.... until the health department saw me using it. They said, because it was made of aluminum and because of the crevice where the magnet was installed, the unit could not be used... except for the magic trick. I was fine with that... until one very busy Saturday night, some knuckle-head stole my Rings and Things Chop Cup from the bar. I was heart broken... that cup had been with me for over 14 years.

I called a magician friend of mine, Allan Hayden, and told him what had happened. He said three words that really set me off... "So, make one." By this point in time, I had built props for myself and a few close friends (Allan included) but out of wood. I had never played with metal before, let alone steel. It was Allan who pushed me to learn how to work with steel. But that was 23 years and 5 Bar Cup designs ago.... LOL

(More to come if you want it.........)

Roger... way cool... give us more info; what were the other designs and how did you get to the final. I find this very interesting.

Thanks,
Bruce

Sorry Bruce... not ignoring you! I have been extremely busy with assembly and packing all the pieces/parts for the combined convention in St.Louis. I will write more in the evenings from the hotel.

Roger,

No problem... I can wait... I am very happy more info is coming.

Bruce

Hi Roger.

I love your Bar Cup! I purchased the original version just about two or three days before I discovered the "Bar Cup Reloaded" edition was released. (Timing - I hate when that happens!) Anyway I considered purchasing a second Bar Cup - the Reloaded edition - primarily because I really miss the dimpled bottom, which the original does not have. I have to omit some moves when using my Bar Cup because of not being able to load a ball on the bottom of the bottom-up cup - it just rolls right off the flat bottom. The new cup design does have a dimpled bottom, but it only comes with a whole kit of other props: the cocktail shaker lid, strainer, shot glass, balls, etc. I don’t perform in bars; I use your Bar Cup as my regular chop cup by itself. All the associated bar equipment would be a waste for me. As a pure hobbyist my magic budget doesn’t match that of a working performer. (Though since you see all my Card-Shark purchases you probably think I am fibbing big time!!)

Any chance you will ever sell the "Bar Cup Reloaded" as a standalone chop cup? I know it's doubtful but I figure it can't hurt to ask.

Thank you.

Jim

Great question. I'm in the same boat.

Sure Jim.... Not a problem! I will sell the cup with the dimpled bottom for 85.00 USD + shipping to the UK. I would need your postal code to sort the postage! Thanks for your help, support and kind words!!! Use your cup in good health!!

Sorry Jim.... I am at the combined convention in St Louis and trying to answer questions in between all the other convention duties and the dealer booth.

Also Jamie... I will be in the UK next week! Let me know if you want an original Bar Cup and I will bring one so you would save on shipping!!

Back to Bruce's question......

After Allan presented me with the problem to make a Chop Cup, I decided to take a couple of courses at our local BOCES in the evening on metal working and spinning. My first cups looked like a cross between a cake pan and an ashtray. After much trial and error (and expense) I finally got the knack of it. I have made cups for Doc Eason, the late JC Wagner, Paul Gertner. It was actually NYC magician Matt Furman who suggested the dimensions of the current Bar Cup and the Bar Cup Reloaded. I believe Bill Palmer, curator of the Cups and Balls Museum, is the only one (including myself) who has every model I have made.

Roger... Thanks, very interesting. At any time did you consider using an industrial designer or a company that specializes in spinning metal?... Or was the idea to do everything in house to keep costs down?

I appreciate the the behind the scene stuff that you have shared.

Bruce

At the time that I started this project, the numbers were low enough for me to produce them in my spare time. As the numbers grew, so did my skill level. Practice makes perfect.

Roger... I find that pretty cool that you learned a new skill; I don't imagine that spinning is that easy to learn. Do you think that you would ever take on a 3 Cup set?

I wish you the best of luck,
Bruce

Hi Bruce..........

I probably will not get into producing 3 cup sets. I will leave that job for my friend Donnie Buckley at RNTII. He makes the best!!

Hey Roger... Understood and yes Donnie is the King of Cups.

Are there any new features or shapes you would like to see in a 3 Cup set?

Thanks,
Bruce

Hi Bruce......

Greetings from the UK!! Hmmmmmm..... never really gave that too much thought. I have used the "Eddie Joseph Indian Cups" and of course I have a set of heavy Paul Fox Cups given to my by the late Lou Gallo. If you think you have seen most of the designs of cups for Cups and Balls... just go to http://www.cupsandballsmuseum.com
My friend Bill Palmer has amassed a fantastic collection of cups. He even has every generation of the Bar Cup... something I don't even have.

Auke Van Dokkum, an excellent magician and machinist from the Netherlands, makes beautiful, fantastic cups....the likes I have never seen. Some are gimmicked in extremely devious ways!! His craftsmanship is remarkable. Definitely for the magician with discriminating tastes!!!