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mastermindreader V.I.P. Seattle, WA 12589 Posts 
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I certainly think that those whose job is to pass laws should have a solid foundation in law and legal interpretation.
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General_Magician Special user United States 707 Posts
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Members of Congress don't seem all that competent to me. Playing chicken with the nation's credit was very incompetent. Not to mention the influence that money has on politics. The corrupting influence of money seems to produce a lot of incompetence on Congress. Lawyers, are somewhat analgous to like made guys in the mafia. They are part of the elite of society and are on top of the pecking order in our social order of things. They pass the laws, make important decisions for the nation and can take your assets if they want to. If you want to do business, you are wise to pay tribute to the lawyers, the elite of society otherwise you could very well end up paying a much higher price later on to this elite. Lawyers are very powerful and though they may choose not to exercise their power, they can if they wish to do so.
"Never fear shadows. They simply mean there is a light shining somewhere nearby." -unknown
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mastermindreader V.I.P. Seattle, WA 12589 Posts
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You've been misinformed. It's been said that lawyers are just hired guns for those who actually have the power.
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General_Magician Special user United States 707 Posts
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I'm not so sure about that. It might seem that way sometimes, but from my angle, it seems the lawyers are the ones with the real power. They can always sue to make money if nobody hires them. Most lawyers are also Congressmen who can pass laws against business if they so choose to do so. Lawyers are also not stupid though, you don't want to kill the goose that laid the golden egg either. This is one of the reasons for LLCs and Corporations it would seem in my view.
"Never fear shadows. They simply mean there is a light shining somewhere nearby." -unknown
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mastermindreader V.I.P. Seattle, WA 12589 Posts
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They can always sue to make money if nobody hires them????? Do you really believe that?
Now that we're completely off-topic again.... |
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LobowolfXXX Inner circle La Famiglia 1199 Posts
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It's almost like when somebody who doesn't know anything about magic tries to "explain" to the rest of the audience how the tricks were done.
"Torture doesn't work" lol
Guess they forgot to tell Bill Buckley. "...as we reason and love, we are able to hope. And hope enables us to resist those things that would enslave us." |
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General_Magician Special user United States 707 Posts
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Well sure, you can be sued at anytime for any reason. That's what my attorney told me. She didn't mis-advise me did she?
Here is what one person had to say in an article here: Quote:
You will probably go through your entire life without being sued. There were 278,442 civil case filings in the U.S. in 2012, according to the latest government data, but it isn't exactly a rite of passage for most people. You probably weren't taught in school how to handle a court summons, and your parents probably never sat you down and talked about how someone might try, through legal channels, to take away everything you have. http://money.usnews.com/money/personal-f......ing-sued It's probably best to assume that you could very well be sued by somebody who is malicious and the law incentivizes lawsuits if somebody thinks they will get a money payout which plays well to drumming up business for attorneys. If you make these assumptions, you will be better prepared for worst case scenarios in the event it does happen. Not saying that the worst will happen, but you want to plan and be ready for the worst because there is always that possibility. Even if you are sued and you successfully defend against the lawsuit and win it, you still lose because defending the lawsuit could very well bankrupt you and there is a good chance a court will not grant you all the legal fees you had to pay defending yourself even if you win and successfully defend against the suit. To me, that's a great deal of power that lawyers wield when you consider the totality of it all.
"Never fear shadows. They simply mean there is a light shining somewhere nearby." -unknown
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mastermindreader V.I.P. Seattle, WA 12589 Posts
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That's all well and good, but what you said was that if lawyers are unemployed they can just sue people to make money. Sue them for what??
If they have a client, they're NOT unemployed. Do you think they just sue people on their own? You're aware, are you not, that an attorney can be sanctioned for filing frivolous lawsuits? This is getting silly and is now completely off-topic. In case you forgot, the discussion is currently about the right of a criminal defendant to be represented by counsel and the rold of defense attorneys in the criminal justice system. That has nothing whatsoever to do with civil lawsuits. |
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rockwall Special user 762 Posts
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On Aug 24, 2014, mastermindreader wrote: Oh, I didn't miss anything. Maybe you misunderstood my question. First, you said, "Personally, I never defended, at trial, a person I knew to be guilty, but I did succeed in keeping several innocent people from going to prison." No one asked if you had. Because you offer this without being asked, it almost seems as though this is a badge of honor for you. But then later, you explain why it's important that even the guilty need counsel. So again, I was wondering, why would you be proud of the fact you never defended someone you knew to be guilty when you believe it's important that they get counsel? If you want to claim that you were just stating a fact and that you're not proud of the fact, why offer it at all? |
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slowkneenuh Regular user After 5,278+ posts, only credited with 133 Posts
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"To me, it's pretty obvious that it's a good thing to have people of above-average capability in Congress."
If it's that obvious, then why don't we have them in Congress now? As a group you may consider them to have an above average IQ, but their judgment, common sense and behavior is despicable.
John
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LobowolfXXX Inner circle La Famiglia 1199 Posts
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Quote:
On Aug 24, 2014, slowkneenuh wrote: We do. If you think they would be better replaced (in terms of capability) by a cross section of random average Americans - average in terms of intelligence, education, etc. - you're deluding yourself.
"Torture doesn't work" lol
Guess they forgot to tell Bill Buckley. "...as we reason and love, we are able to hope. And hope enables us to resist those things that would enslave us." |
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mastermindreader V.I.P. Seattle, WA 12589 Posts
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Rockwall-
Where did I say I was "proud of the fact" that I never defended someone I knew to be guilty? Reread what I wrote, for you've misquoted me: "Personally, I never defended, at trial, a person I knew to be guilty..." [emphasis added for clarity] Of course I represented clients who were guilty but I never took those cases to trial. Instead I negotiated reasonable sentences and/or argued for same in court. Because, like I said, EVERYONE is entitled to representation. |
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S2000magician Inner circle Yorba Linda, CA 3465 Posts
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On Aug 24, 2014, General_Magician wrote: Scary, perhaps, but not remotely incompetent. |
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slowkneenuh Regular user After 5,278+ posts, only credited with 133 Posts
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I'm not suggesting we randomly pick and average American, but there are many qualified people who do not have the money, connections or time to pursue a political career and could do an admirable job given the opportunity as opposed to the more fortunate ones who seem bent on squandering the opportunity.
John
"A poor workman always blames his tools" |
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S2000magician Inner circle Yorba Linda, CA 3465 Posts
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On Aug 24, 2014, General_Magician wrote: Absurd. Most lawyers - 95% or more - aren't congressmen. |
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LobowolfXXX Inner circle La Famiglia 1199 Posts
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Or as we tell the LSAT students, "'Most' isn't reversible."
"Torture doesn't work" lol
Guess they forgot to tell Bill Buckley. "...as we reason and love, we are able to hope. And hope enables us to resist those things that would enslave us." |
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General_Magician Special user United States 707 Posts
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Absurd. That's not what I meant to write, I meant to write most Congressmen are lawyers. But if you want to nail me to the wall, you can assert it isn't true. A more accurate statement would be, many members of Congress are lawyers.
"Never fear shadows. They simply mean there is a light shining somewhere nearby." -unknown
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S2000magician Inner circle Yorba Linda, CA 3465 Posts
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On Aug 24, 2014, General_Magician wrote: Maybe you've hit on exactly the problem: there aren't enough lawyers in Congress. |
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Dannydoyle Eternal Order 20870 Posts
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I was lost two pages ago.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus <BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell |
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landmark Inner circle within a triangle 5129 Posts
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Quote:
On Aug 24, 2014, LobowolfXXX wrote: Disagree strongly. With access to staff to insure the proper legal niceties are followed, I think the decisions would be much more representative of the people's will, which, if I recall correctly, was the whole point of the experiment.
Click here to get Gerald Deutsch's Perverse Magic: The First Sixteen Years
All proceeds to Open Heart Magic charity. |
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Posted: Aug 25, 2014 01:42 am 
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