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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Not very magical, still... » » Guns don't kill people... (35 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

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LobowolfXXX
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On Sep 9, 2014, ed rhodes wrote:
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On Sep 8, 2014, Dannydoyle wrote:
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On Sep 8, 2014, ed rhodes wrote:
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On Sep 8, 2014, RNK wrote:
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On Sep 7, 2014, mastermindreader wrote:
Yes- that's the biggest part of the math, but numbers like that are difficult for me to fathom. All for nothing.


All for nothing now since the current administration pulled out and let ISIS take over what we accomplished.


The current administration followed the rules set up by the PREVIOUS administration. George W. knew he'd be safely out of office by the time the troops had to be withdrawn and whoever WAS in office would get the heat for it.



This is a joke right? Why does the current administration take credit for it while it happens and pass the blame when it seems to be sort of short sighted? A fine example of cheering for your team under any circumstance. At what point is the current administration responsible for what is happening? 6 years in and still nothing this administration has done they are responsible for. Well obviously the things they want to claim credit for.

Why was it he was not merely the occupant of the office when Bin Laden was killed? No he planned that one huh?

Consistency would be way too much to ask for I guess.


Consistency would be nice... from his critics as well. If Obama HADN'T withdrawn the troops, he'd be accused now of abusing his power and refusing to follow the agreement that was left to him by the previous administration. But because he DID follow that agreement, he's accused of abandoning the area. Actually, I'll take my first line back, we DO get consistency from Obama's critics. It doesn't matter what he does, he'll get crap for it.


As opposed to...Obama gets credit for pulling the troops, unless it turns out that it was a bad idea, in which case he didn't have a choice.
"Torture doesn't work" lol
Guess they forgot to tell Bill Buckley.

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mastermindreader
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Did you note, Lobo, that I earlier rejected that as far as my own views go? Not only was Obama required, by the status of forces agreement with Iraq, to withdraw, withdrawal was a good idea that I would have supported in any case and still support.

And it appears that a majority of Americans are definitely OPPOSED to sending troops back into the country. (Or into Syria)
Dannydoyle
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You are making predictions of what may happen. Not as good as what he actually is doing. But keep cheering ed.
Danny Doyle
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<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
mastermindreader
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Tommy- are you seriously suggesting that Obama did NOT inherit major problems from the previous administration? That's not playing the "blame game." It's simply a statement of fact.
Mystification
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And Reagan inherited major problems when he took office from the previous administration (Carter). But if that were the subject, people on here would be arguing it.
Dannydoyle
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ONLY democrats inherit bad situations. Never republicans. ALL democratic administrations do everything right.
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tommy
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No I am saying they all inherit major problems, which both sides have helped to create. ie Both parties voted for war with Iraq and so they are both to blame. Besides blame, it does no good. Their job is to solve the problems like they promised to. They are all just ugly actors anyhow.
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On Sep 9, 2014, Dannydoyle wrote:
ONLY democrats inherit bad situations. Never republicans. ALL democratic administrations do everything right.


There you go again...(to quote Reagan.) No one has ever said that ALL Democratic administrations do everything right. That's just your straw man again. The simple fact being discussed here is what Obama inherited at the beginning of his administration. But rather than admit that the entire economy was in shambles you simply change the subject by making straw man statements.

YES- Reagan inherited the inflation that occurred under Carter. YES, Democrats have made serious mistakes (escalating in Vietnam comes to mind.) No one is denying that. Stop ascribing positions to those you disagree with that they don't hold at all.

Thank you.
Dannydoyle
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President Obama probably inherited a WORSE situation than any of his predecessors with the exception of Washington.
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<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
landmark
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+1, though I think Washington had a lot of good will behind him and a somewhat subdued enemy.
mastermindreader
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Well Republican Abraham Lincoln didn't exactly inherit an ideal situation from Democrat James Buchanan. Smile (But the ideological positions of the parties then were pretty much opposite to what they are today.)
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On Sep 9, 2014, landmark wrote:
+1, though I think Washington had a lot of good will behind him and a somewhat subdued enemy.

Oh I don't think they were truly subdued for another 100 years or so.
Danny Doyle
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RNK
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On Sep 9, 2014, mastermindreader wrote:
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On Sep 9, 2014, Dannydoyle wrote:
ONLY democrats inherit bad situations. Never republicans. ALL democratic administrations do everything right.


There you go again...(to quote Reagan.) No one has ever said that ALL Democratic administrations do everything right. That's just your straw man again. The simple fact being discussed here is what Obama inherited at the beginning of his administration. But rather than admit that the entire economy was in shambles you simply change the subject by making straw man statements.

YES- Reagan inherited the inflation that occurred under Carter. YES, Democrats have made serious mistakes (escalating in Vietnam comes to mind.) No one is denying that. Stop ascribing positions to those you disagree with that they don't hold at all.

Thank you.


True. Just like Bush inherited a bad situation with the banks when Clinton at the end of his term forced the banks to lend people money for mortgages they could not afford. Of course- this is overlooked and the blame is put all on Bush. But the whole bank lending catastrophe began under Clinton at the end of his last term. Now I liked Clinton for most of his time in office as he listened to BOTH sides and governed from the center (after he to lost majorly in the midterm elections because he was not governing from the center) nothing like what the current administration does.

And thank you Tommy for all the examples listed. Further Bob- this administration loves to play the race card. Here is a nice example:
http://deneenborelli.com/2014/07/eric-ho......bc-news/
mastermindreader
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I don't call that "playing the race card." That's mainly a term used by the right when they want to distract attention away from the actual issue.

BTW- I know you don't agree with me on that, but at least we agreed on something. Also, happy to see that Pittsburgh won. I'm going to have to miss football this weekend as I'm off to Ohio to do Penguin Live with Osterlind and won't be back until next Wednesday.

Bob
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On Sep 4, 2014, landmark wrote:

He will be remembered by many as the man who had the opportunity to change the course of the country from the preceding psychopaths and then went back on every promise made to the people who voted for him. Kind of like those mystery thrillers where the serial killer turns out to be the detective.


I'll bet that there's a lot that you and Michael Moore agree on, right?

http://www.breitbart.com/Breitbart-TV/20......resident

Moore said, “When the history is written of this era, this is how you’ll be remembered: ‘He was the first black president.’ OK, not a bad accomplishment, but that’s it. That’s it, Mr. Obama. A hundred years from now, ‘He was the first black American that got elected president.’ And that’s it. Eight years of your life and that’s what people are got to remember. Boy, I got a feeling, know you, that you’d probably wish you were remembered for a few other things, a few other things you could’ve done.”

(And a tiny, tiny bit that even you and I agree on!)
balducci
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On Sep 10, 2014, rockwall wrote:

Moore said, “When the history is written of this era, this is how you’ll be remembered: ‘He was the first black president.’ OK, not a bad accomplishment, but that’s it. That’s it, Mr. Obama. A hundred years from now, ‘He was the first black American that got elected president.’ And that’s it. Eight years of your life and that’s what people are got to remember. Boy, I got a feeling, know you, that you’d probably wish you were remembered for a few other things, a few other things you could’ve done.”

I've no doubt he'll be remembered for health care and for removing troops from Iraq (no matter how those actions turn out over time).

But I think the fact is, no matter what Obama did, even had he been the most successful and best loved President ever, a hundred years from now he would still be remembered foremost for being the first black President. Everything else he did and does will be, and was always going to be, a historical footnote.
Make America Great Again! - Trump in 2020 ... "We're a capitalistic society. I go into business, I don't make it, I go bankrupt. They're not going to bail me out. I've been on welfare and food stamps. Did anyone help me? No." - Craig T. Nelson, actor.
rockwall
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On Sep 11, 2014, balducci wrote:
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On Sep 10, 2014, rockwall wrote:

Moore said, “When the history is written of this era, this is how you’ll be remembered: ‘He was the first black president.’ OK, not a bad accomplishment, but that’s it. That’s it, Mr. Obama. A hundred years from now, ‘He was the first black American that got elected president.’ And that’s it. Eight years of your life and that’s what people are got to remember. Boy, I got a feeling, know you, that you’d probably wish you were remembered for a few other things, a few other things you could’ve done.”

I've no doubt he'll be remembered for health care and for removing troops from Iraq (no matter how those actions turn out over time).

But I think the fact is, no matter what Obama did, even had he been the most successful and best loved President ever, a hundred years from now he would still be remembered foremost for being the first black President. Everything else he did and does will be, and was always going to be, a historical footnote.


I don't think that is 'quite' the point that Mr. Moore was trying to make.
Smile
balducci
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Never said it was. I was making my own point. Along with criticizing Moores' as being simplistic, or something like that.
Make America Great Again! - Trump in 2020 ... "We're a capitalistic society. I go into business, I don't make it, I go bankrupt. They're not going to bail me out. I've been on welfare and food stamps. Did anyone help me? No." - Craig T. Nelson, actor.
RNK
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On Sep 10, 2014, mastermindreader wrote:

BTW- I know you don't agree with me on that, but at least we agreed on something. Also, happy to see that Pittsburgh won. I'm going to have to miss football this weekend as I'm off to Ohio to do Penguin Live with Osterlind and won't be back until next Wednesday.

Bob


You won't miss the big game tonight Bob! Steelers-Ravens! Tune in... Also- good thoughts with you for your lecture. I'm sure it will be a hit!

RNK
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Thanks RNK. Yes, Ill be watching the game. The Steelers should win it.
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