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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Not very magical, still... » » Accident again (4 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

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funsway
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Quote:
On Oct 31, 2014, stoneunhinged wrote:

Ken, you don't like me, do you?

Too bad. I think you're kind of cute, in a fun sort of way.


Oh, I might like you fine in person. Who knows? "Like" has nothing to do with it.

A review of your posts over the last couple of years show that you always have something negative to say about what I post,
usually starting with some positioning statement, followed by thoughts having nothing to do with the original post.

I might even like some idea of your own, if you post one. How about offering a post that starts, "What I know to be true is ..."

followed by a sharing of what you think with no reference to another person.

The idea is what should be important, not the personality.

Drop by Dandridge, TN some time -- we can spend a couple of days getting to know each other. Then "like" might be relevant.

no smoking here, though.
"the more one pretends at magic, the more awe and wonder will be found in real life." Arnold Furst

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slowkneenuh
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John

"A poor workman always blames his tools"
funsway
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Quote:
On Nov 3, 2014, slowkneenuh wrote:
Http://www.nbcnewyork.com/news/local/Con......xfinity1



no problem calling this an accident -- certainly no hint the worked deliberately dropped it or tried to hit someone. Avoidable -- probably.

However, the first response from the company was to assign blame on the victim to avoid a possible law suit. That is no accident.
"the more one pretends at magic, the more awe and wonder will be found in real life." Arnold Furst

eBooks at https://www.lybrary.com/ken-muller-m-579928.html questions at ken@eversway.com
LobowolfXXX
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So in the OP story, do you think that Canseco deliberately trie to shoot off his finger?
"Torture doesn't work" lol
Guess they forgot to tell Bill Buckley.

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mastermindreader
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I think this is really just a matter of semantics. Some of us use "accidental" synonymously with "unintentional." Even in the law we talk about accident cases when we are really referring to negligence and the foreseeability of its consequences.
funsway
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Quote:
On Nov 5, 2014, mastermindreader wrote:
I think this is really just a matter of semantics. Some of us use "accidental" synonymously with "unintentional." Even in the law we talk about accident cases when we are really referring to negligence and the foreseeability of its consequences.



Yup -- and the loss fine distinction between many words in our language is both sad and problem causing INHO. In the late 80's I predicted that the common vocabulary would be reduced to that of SpellCheck.

Now it is far worse judging by the mangled words of news casters and popular idols. I don't have to like it -- which is all I said in the first place.

I hadn't thought of blaming lawyers, though ...

............................

for magicians, and perhaps Mentalists more so, an appreciation of the fact that an audience may not understand a word as you intend it can be important in scripting a routine.

When the common use vocabulary is reduced to a couple of hundred words anyone will be able to buy a magic trick and call themselves a magician ;-)
"the more one pretends at magic, the more awe and wonder will be found in real life." Arnold Furst

eBooks at https://www.lybrary.com/ken-muller-m-579928.html questions at ken@eversway.com
mastermindreader
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You might have a quarrel with the dictionary, then, as well:

ac·ci·den·tal
ˌaksəˈden(t)l/
adjective
adjective: accidental

1.
happening by chance, unintentionally, or unexpectedly.
"a verdict of accidental death"

[emphasis added for clarity]
Pecan_Creek
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Quote:
On Nov 5, 2014, funsway wrote:

In the late 80's I predicted that the common vocabulary would be reduced to that of SpellCheck.


Wow you are the one that came up with that theory first? Man that's awesome.

Umm, you do know that just about every word ever written is in "SpellCheck".

You are too precious!

Seriously though, What is "SpellCheck" is that a brand name, an organization?

Ask any lexicographer, language changes , meanings of words change.

Sixty years ago the words Moron and Imbecile were medical terms with very specific meanings. Now they are used and applied to a broad range of individuals. Smile

To try and bemoan the shifting nature of the english language and in the same breath purporting to be an expert defender of language is quite amusing.

Sorry, you are just a luddite curmudgeon not a noble defender of human culture. (IMHO)
ed rhodes
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Quote:
On Oct 31, 2014, Merc Man wrote:
A modern day term that winds me up, to the extent that I actually shout at the tele (or the computer if I'm reading it) is the pathetic term 'wardrobe malfunction'. Smile

To me a 'wardrobe malfunction' is when the door gets stuck; or the hanging rail falls down inside.

If, for example, some celebrity's breast happens to inadvertently fall out, then that ISN'T a 'wardrobe malfunction'!

Unless of course she happened to be wearing a wardrobe at the time. Which, let's be fair, is highly unlikely.


I think the problem is that the term isn't being used in England where a "wardrobe" is a cabinet used to hold clothing, but in America where
"wardrobe" describes the clothing that's being worn.

My complaint with the term is that it's inaccurate. The wardrobe in question did not "malfunction" given by the fact that the celebrity in question was wearing a pastie UNDERNEATH the wardrobe which indicates that she fully intended for the "malfunction" to happen. A true "wardrobe malfunction" would be in the dance sequence in "Papa Don't Preach" where Madonna in a black skimpy outfit throws her shoulders and head back at one point and "pops" out of the outfit. (It's pretty far away and you'd have to have a High Definition 50+" television to see anything... wait, a lot of people have those now! Oh well.
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funsway
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Quote:
On Nov 5, 2014, Pecan_Creek wrote:
Quote:
On Nov 5, 2014, funsway wrote:

In the late 80's I predicted that the common vocabulary would be reduced to that of SpellCheck.


Wow you are the one that came up with that theory first? Man that's awesome.

Umm, you do know that just about every word ever written is in "SpellCheck".

You are too precious!

Seriously though, What is "SpellCheck" is that a brand name, an organization?

Ask any lexicographer, language changes , meanings of words change.

Sixty years ago the words Moron and Imbecile were medical terms with very specific meanings. Now they are used and applied to a broad range of individuals. Smile

To try and bemoan the shifting nature of the english language and in the same breath purporting to be an expert defender of language is quite amusing.

Sorry, you are just a luddite curmudgeon not a noble defender of human culture. (IMHO)


an interesting mish-mash of opinions -- hardly facts, though.

back then the number of words in Spellcheck (a patch addition to WordStar) was limited to 5000 words and did not offer substitute suggestions.

Since then the number of of included words has increased, plus the attempts of the software to offer substitutes.

So, why is the useful vocabulary of the average high school graduate a fraction of what it was in 1990? Why do studies show that writers often select the first (even wrong) substitute rather than search for a better substitute?

Yup, the meaning of words change -- mostly because of laziness rather than cultural advance IMHO and I don't have to like it.

I gather that you do, and probably use words like "moron" and "imbecile" to label others rather than use a more appropriate term. Thanks for proving my point.

I have the right to both "bemoan" and "support" any subject. I love music and support live performances,
but bemoan the popularity of those who cannot sing on key and rely on electronic enhancements -- and most bemoan that they are popular.

Then comes a value judgment about someone you do not know. Do you really know what those words mean?

Ok -- I'll play play the game. Please describe my experience with computers and electronic technology. What degrees do I hold in those fields.

When did I build my first computer? How have I integrated new technologies into training programs?

If you do not know -- then do not toss around terms you don't understand. or attempt some sort of ego enhancement through trying to put someone else down

"shallow" is a simple word that comes to mind.

but thanks for demonstrating so clearly what the problem is ...

the fact that our language is changing does not mean "for the better" does it?
"the more one pretends at magic, the more awe and wonder will be found in real life." Arnold Furst

eBooks at https://www.lybrary.com/ken-muller-m-579928.html questions at ken@eversway.com
funsway
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Quote:
On Nov 5, 2014, mastermindreader wrote:
You might have a quarrel with the dictionary, then, as well:

ac·ci·den·tal
ˌaksəˈden(t)l/
adjective
adjective: accidental

1.
happening by chance, unintentionally, or unexpectedly.
"a verdict of accidental death"

[emphasis added for clarity]


no quarrel at all. There are other words with a similar definitions, and it is prudent to select the one that best describes the circumstances an events.

saying, "accidental" "inadvertent" "unplanned" "serendipitous" etc. all have different impact on communications

I know that you, Bob, would attempt to use the best word whenever possible.

The problem is that many persons do not know the distinctions or do not seem to care -- de-evolution of our ability to accurately convey an idea.

The only puzzle is why you would choose to project the idea of "quarrel" onto my example, or even suggest what I might to in response to any thought.

Your choice of that phrase was not accidental. With your fine vocabulary, why did you choose those words?

I do not expect an answer. You, being a mind reader, must have found something in my mind I did not know was there.
"the more one pretends at magic, the more awe and wonder will be found in real life." Arnold Furst

eBooks at https://www.lybrary.com/ken-muller-m-579928.html questions at ken@eversway.com
Bill Hallahan
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Quote:
Perhaps I am the only one bothered by the misuse of the term "accident"

the morning news says that a famous baseball player "accidentally" shot himself in the hand while cleaning it.

Sorry -- in may be "inadvertent" or "unfortunate" but hardly an accident.

He chose to own a gun. He chose to clean it. He chose to NOT make sure it was unloaded. He chose to load it in the first place.

in all that nothing was accidental.

I'm not getting down on guns. Years ago our military "Accidentally" shot down a civilian aircraft over the ocean. What an insult! The fighter pilot aimed at the plane, pulled the trigger and hit what he was aiming at. Good job!

To suggest that he accidentally hit it is silly. An officer in charge ordered him to fire. He did not accidentally give the order. He followed that order as trained/conditioned. No accident involved.

It is no accident that the English language is being corrupted.

You only have to decide who is responsible.

The very first definition of the word accident in the Merriam Webster dictionary is:
Quote:
a sudden event (such as a crash) that is not planned or intended and that causes damage or injury

Unless he planned to hurt himself, it was an accident. It also might be negligence, but that doesn't mean it's not an accident.

The legal dictionary for the United States can clear up all such confusion.

And, I believe if you check a 50 year old Merriam Webster dictionary, or even older, you'll find that's been the definition of the word accident for a long time. There are several definitions of that word in the dictionary, but that is the very first definition. Finally, about 50% of car accidents are due to negligence, but they are still called accidents.
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stoneunhinged
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The problem with Ken has always been his solipsistic inistence that we misunderstand his position rather than disagree with it. It never occurs to him that we just might know more about a particular subject than he does.

Should we get into a debate about the meaning of words, I would expect certain Café members to bring some expertise to the discussion that others would not. The other Bill, and Bob, Jeff, and Dan, for example, might be expected to give us a additional peeks around the corner that make us think about words in a different way.

But Ken wants to teach Bill, Bob, Jeff, and Dan. He doesn't really want to engage in a discussion with them. He doesn't even know who they are! My guess is that he could guess who Bob is, but hasn't even an inkling of who Bill, Jeff, or Dan are.

Which is fine with me. But it does say something about his presence in our forum. Ken is unfriendly.

It is because of his unfriendliness that I stopped posting in the Food for Thought forum.

Ken, you are welcome here, because everyone is welcome here. But learning to be friendly would bring more attention to your ideas.

Please don't poison this forum the way you did Food for Thought.
imgic
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I'm nominating this for silliest thread in the forum...
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balducci
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Is this a more appropriate use of the word "accident"?

http://fox13now.com/2014/11/24/woman-say......in-head/

ST. LOUIS, Mo. - A woman appears to have accidentally fatally shot herself in the head with a gun bought to prepare for possible Ferguson-related unrest, according to sources briefed on the police investigation.

The female victim, identified in a police report as Becca Campbell, 26, was a passenger in a car involved in an auto accident.

The boyfriend, who wasn’t identified, told police that the couple had bought a gun because of fears of unrest related to the pending grand jury decision on the shooting of Michael Brown, the sources said.

He told investigators that as they drove late Friday night, the victim waved a gun, jokingly saying the couple were ready for Ferguson, the sources said.

He ducked to get out of the way of the gun and accidentally rear-ended another car.

He said the accident caused the gun to go off and she was struck by a bullet in the head, the sources said.
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