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Al Schneider V.I.P. A corn field in WI surrounded by 1080 Posts |
Phil
I reread your post and a desire to restart the thread. I thought some more about it and considered a more in depth analysis of what Buddha Papers is about. On the surface, to me, it is about a simple trick that is more of a puzzle than anything else. My experience with Karrell Fox suggests there is more. Perhaps this is what you are after. The basic concept of the effect can be expanded either emotionally or magically. To whit, I came up with the following. The performer comes out with a packet of paper. He says he found it in his family’s old farm house in a trunk in the attic. The paper looks old and has a heavy sent of perfume. The paper of three layers is opened to reveal a flattened stiff flower. The performer says it was saved by his great grandmother. Then the performer talks of his great grandfather that studied time travel. Anyway: something along that line. The flattened flower is replaced back into the nest of folded papers. The unit is placed before a spectator and asked to hold it down with a finger. A few magic words are spoken and the spectator is asked to open the papers. On doing so, a picture from days past is found in the innermost paper showing a woman holding a flower. Ostensibly, it is a picture of the flower initially shown. Doing this is easily within the capabilities of the readers of this forum. Phil; is this in the direction you were thinking? Al
Magic Al. Say it fast and it is magical.
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docguitarman Special user Thousand Oaks, California 888 Posts |
Hi Al,
My post was specifically focused on the "Pursepose" effect in The Phoenix. It is intended to catch those laymen (and maybe a few magi too) who know how the effect works. You end clean in the "Pursepose" effect. Since then I have done more research/reading and have seen ways to add patter such as you suggest (to use different items that "reconfigure" themselves in various ways) that will take the heat off the paper and onto the "reconfigured" items. Of course any one who knows the secret won't be fooled in those cases either... unless the papers are augmented with the handling described in "The Phoenix." Putting all the above together (Interesting patter/presentations, transformations -- such as you suggest -- and the extra something that allows you to end clean and leave all to be examined) ought to make it a useful and entertaining effect, IMO. Regards, Phil |
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docguitarman Special user Thousand Oaks, California 888 Posts |
As a postscript I should add that the "Pursepose" extra something is also an "ever so sleighty" effect.
Also I reread the "Pursepose" article and I realize my intended use to end clean is in addition to the sucker version described therein.... both effects can be done with the extra apparatus described in the article. |
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gaddy Inner circle Agent of Chaos 3526 Posts |
I enjoyed perusing this thread a lot. I have a lot of love for the humble Buddha papers!
I used the Buddha papers for several years in my Ren Faire act. It started as a lazy "throw away" trick towards the beginning of the act, but *** if it ever failed to get a reaction WAY out of proportion to the actual effect. I was just astounded. This ancient trick that had been relegated to the "el cheapo kids magic kits" was just killing it. Every time. Truly, it's all in the presentation; and ANY trick is a "new trick" if the audience has never seen it before! Now, I f I had only thought to making/repackaging these with my own brand name and pulling in some extra cash via the side hustle. Live and Learn...
*due to the editorial policies here, words on this site attributed to me cannot necessarily be held to be my own.*
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gaddy Inner circle Agent of Chaos 3526 Posts |
Incidentally, to answer the "question" of the original thread, I would use the principle of the paddle move and have the larger motion of lifting the packet up for closer inspection as a ruse to cover the smaller action of flipping the packet over in my hand.
I say with absolutely no hubris (it's the bloody Buddha papers, after all) that I was never caught in the act.
*due to the editorial policies here, words on this site attributed to me cannot necessarily be held to be my own.*
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sethb Inner circle The Jersey Shore 2719 Posts |
I have pitched the Buddha Papers in the past, along with the Svengali Deck and the Magic Worms. The papers were not as strong a seller as either of the other two items, but that could have just been the fault of a weak pitch and/or weak routine.
I started by using the Royal Magic (Fun, Inc.) papers, which were of good quality and came attractively packaged, but then switched to Robbins E-Z Magic stuff instead. The quality was the same but the price was considerably less. I used a variation of the #2 method. Right before the turnover, I would take the packet off the table, hold it in the air in a vertical position, and patter for a bit. Then it was a simple matter to replace the packet on the table with the correct side up, and nobody ever caught the move. It was natural, easy and didn't require any fast or fancy moves. SETH
"Watch the Professor!!" -- Al Flosso (1895-1976)
"The better you are, the closer they watch" -- Darwin Ortiz, STRONG MAGIC |
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gaddy Inner circle Agent of Chaos 3526 Posts |
@Sethb, do you pitch at the Jersey Shore somewhere?
I vacation there every couple of years, and I might get back there this year or next...
*due to the editorial policies here, words on this site attributed to me cannot necessarily be held to be my own.*
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sethb Inner circle The Jersey Shore 2719 Posts |
Gaddy --- I used to pitch in Sea Isle City, Cape May, Mays Landing, Woodbine, Somers Point, Linwood, Northfield, Absecon and a few other places in South Jersey. I was a real "40-miler," as the old vaudeville term says.
But I stopped a couple of years ago, due to arthritis in the feet -- it's tough when you're standing up for 6+ hours at a clip! I thank the late Don Driver for helping to get me into the pitch business, and steering me in all the right directions. It was great fun while it lasted, and I also made a few bucks to boot . . . SETH
"Watch the Professor!!" -- Al Flosso (1895-1976)
"The better you are, the closer they watch" -- Darwin Ortiz, STRONG MAGIC |
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gaddy Inner circle Agent of Chaos 3526 Posts |
Oh, how I love Cape May! Such a beautiful place!
Actually, this is the first I heard that Don passed away. I mean, he was sick for a long time, and while he recovered briefly... I had been off the Magic Café for quite a while, and well, we all knew it was only a matter of time. I learned a lot from his videos and conversing with him on the Magic Café. He'll be missed, but his legacy lives on.
*due to the editorial policies here, words on this site attributed to me cannot necessarily be held to be my own.*
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sethb Inner circle The Jersey Shore 2719 Posts |
Don was a great guy, a true gentleman, and very generous with his time. He was always willing to share information and make suggestions to solve problems or issues. And as I discovered in more than one instance, you ignored his advice at your own peril!
But I believe his pitch tape is still around and available, so there will always be someone to learn his wonderful Svengali Pitch! And a lot of his posts are still here under the "Step Right Up" section of the Magic Café. SETH
"Watch the Professor!!" -- Al Flosso (1895-1976)
"The better you are, the closer they watch" -- Darwin Ortiz, STRONG MAGIC |
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ATXTimeLord New user 93 Posts |
Quote:
On Nov 14, 2014, Kabbalah wrote: I've performed this version and love it... |
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docguitarman Special user Thousand Oaks, California 888 Posts |
Quote:
On Nov 14, 2014, Kabbalah wrote: Just made some ungimmicked papers and am going to spring this at the next magic fellowship. Thanks Kabbalah! Phil |
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Docc Hilford V.I.P. 377 Posts |
Wow, years of BP chat!
My answer to the original query is #1 and like Bill (thank you for your wonderful input) flip as I fold. So good to cross Al’s path too. Al I have found BP to be extremely effective in Bizarre storytelling magic and even mentalism, as well as straight magic. I was close to Brother Shadow and saw him really kill with his presentations. If Dick is still on board, I’m so happy to hear your mentor was pitching them for $2 72 years ago! (That’s like $30 today) I sure agree with Karol Fox (as any worker should) that working with money gets attention. Thanks for the tip on Tower’s booklet. I can’t wait to find a copy. And last, I was a dear friend of Don Driver who taught me to pitch in 1980! Below is a share I made on another thread I think might be helpful. FTR I’ve pitched BPs with a special demo where a borrowed $20 doubles to two $20s, a blank paper changes to a $5, a $5 to a $10, a $10 to a $20 and remember folks, a $20 always doubles! Because the series of changes was a cycle, the reset was automatic. I closed the last pocket leaving the pair of $20s and when I started the pitch again, I opened and removed the blank. Then I borrowed a $20 and started over. The gimmick was I used a special a four pocket BP set! There’s another little trick my uncle “Doc” taught me that makes it all work. And the fold a flip of all the papers is what sells it. The papers are waved high in the air as four and as each paper is folded, “fold the sides in, the top down and flip it over” it goes into a paper from the set being waved around. The slum sold to the marks was Robbins with a standard double pocket, so they couldn’t do my demo. But they never knew to kick. The best part of my pitch was not returning the borrowed $20 until last. I offered him the $20 that was made from the $10 to check to make certain it was spendable. When he agreed I asked him if he wanted that one in return. The mark always said yes, but I’d snap it out of his hands and give him what he thought was his original $20, saying he didn’t want that one... it’s counterfeit! When I pitched magic in the 80s (and Horoscopes in the 90s) I wanted slum I could produce myself if needed. And anything that looked like it would pay off like a Stripper, D Looper or 2CM, sold best. So the BPs did very well where the line was low like flea markets. I think $2 back in the 1980s ($5-$6 today). Anyway, I also have an amazing demo for the coin a glass trick. That envelope contained a square of newspaper, a blank sheet of paper, a paper disk and instructions on how to glue it to a glass. But I guarantee the demo was unlike anything you’ve ever seen. Hahahaha I LOVE building up a miracle out of slum! Peace Docc |
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Docc Hilford V.I.P. 377 Posts |
So sad to hear Dick O left us to play the “Big Room” a couple of weeks ago.
He was an historical treasure and is missed already. |
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motown Inner circle Atlanta by way of Detroit 6127 Posts |
Question.
Royal Magic's Buddha Papers is a nest of four sheets. With the secret something being the second one you unwrap. In making up a set, does it matter if it's the second or could it just as easily be the third, if your using the four sheet nest?
"If you ever write anything about me after I'm gone, I will come back and haunt you."
– Karl Germain |
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Tilman Regular user 182 Posts |
Hi motown,
The design you describe is better than the alternatives mainly for two reasons: - Assuming that in wrapping up object 1 you use the choreography where every package is turned as it is closed (preference of some posters above and mine as well), you will have done this same set of actions twice before doing it again with the gimmicked sheet. It is plausible that scrutiny is lower at that point. - After unpacking object 2, the gimmicked sheet is now the third sheet from above. This is perfect: you can pick up the top two sheets, one in each hand, and show them front and back (perhaps as if looking for object 1 yourself). Or you can just lift them in a gesture (again, one in each hand) and let them fall back down. You have two hands, so there is motivation for picking up exactly two and no more. The alternatives are inferior because gimmicking the second sheet from the inside would rob you of the two great features just mentioned. Gimmicking the outer sheet would expose tricky edges for too long (when everything is folded in). In the superior design, the outermost sheet, even when open, will provide cover for the edges on the sheet above, because the outer sheet will never lie perfectly flat, its outer sections standing up a little, effectively blocking any flat-angle view at the edges of the gimmick (paper with some stiffness is preferable because it ensures just that). |
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Tilman Regular user 182 Posts |
If you ever make up a set yourself, a great way to further camouflage the gimmick is the following color configuration:
- inner sheet: black - second sheet: some bright color - third (gimmicked) sheet: black - outer sheet: same bright color as above The black paper serves double duty: clearly presenting the object on the innermost sheet; camouflaging edge and thickness on the gimmicked one. Also, the alternation of color A - black - color A - black clarifies the configuration of papers beautifully at all times. |
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motown Inner circle Atlanta by way of Detroit 6127 Posts |
Tilman,
Those are excellent points regarding the gimmick. I never cared for the craft type papers that have traditionally come with this effect, while I understand why they're used. If I recall right, Bill Abbott performs his Boyd Mystery with papers that are all the same color. I have a few ideas for presentations and want to use papers that are appropriate for the idea, as well as using something that's more out of the ordinary. One idea involves Charlie Chaplin. I have a few thoughts that involve printing my own papers. I'm fortunate to have some very nice printers at work, along with a design background. After some experimenting I'll see where it goes.
"If you ever write anything about me after I'm gone, I will come back and haunt you."
– Karl Germain |
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motown Inner circle Atlanta by way of Detroit 6127 Posts |
Has anyone ever done the Buddha Papers with a design printed on one side of the paper, but not the other?
"If you ever write anything about me after I'm gone, I will come back and haunt you."
– Karl Germain |
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Docc Hilford V.I.P. 377 Posts |
Of course.
I used wrapping paper witch is colored on the outside and white on the inside. |
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