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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Not very magical, still... » » RIP Eric Garner (18 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

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rockwall
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For those of you who haven’t seen the video, you can see it here instead of just believing the lies that some are going to tell you about what happened.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-zOzkh2cKuM

At :53 is the first time I hear Eric Garner say, “I can’t breath”. It’s hard to see if the officer has fully released the hold at this point but 2 seconds later at :55 it’s clear he has as he’s now on his knees and has his hands on Eric Garner’s head. As Eric Garner continues to say, “I can’t breath”, the officer is seen to be holding his head down but obviously doesn’t have his arm around his neck.

Anyone who claims that the officer continue to choke him while he was saying, “I can’t breath” is lying.

Excessive force? I don’t know the answer to that. Probably not on anyone who didn’t have health conditions but obviously enough to kill this man. If there was excessive force, it was by ALL the officers, not just one.

The police are being used by their liberal masters in NY city to collect taxes. Liberals love to collect their taxes and love to tell people what’s best for them and try to control what they do with more and more taxes. Whenever you’ve got the government using the police to enforce unfair laws and collect taxes, you’re going to see violence.
landmark
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Are those the same liberal masters who make a large part of the county revenue in Ferguson by enforcing traffic stops for minor violations and onerous court fines?
imgic
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Wow...so liberals are the cause for the violence? And others are postulating they are the reason for the violence escalating and continuing? And the liberals have create a system that rewards people burning down their own houses so they get rewarded with better housing (threats from ferguson thread)?
"Imagination is more important than knowledge."
lynnef
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There was reasonable cause for an indictment (really, not even involuntary manslaughter?). As for the law, it looks like we're back to the days of Dred Scott (1857) when the Supreme Court ruled that a black man has no rights which a white man is bound to respect. Lynn
Mr. Mystoffelees
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Gotta wonder if this is what is was like in Germany in the 30's...
Also known, when doing rope magic, as "Cordini"
Mr. Mystoffelees
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Quote:
On Dec 4, 2014, rockwall wrote:
Quote:
On Dec 4, 2014, mastermindreader wrote:
...
And why did he not adjust or release the hold when the victim repeatedly stated, "I can't breath?" Or is it that he just didn't care if the guy could breath or not?

...


Well, he didn't adjust it because he no longer had it on him. He had already moved up to his head and was pushing his head into the sidewalk. To say he was choked to death is a lie.

But let me ask, what do you think of the reason he was being arrested for anyway?


http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2014......s-death/

"Garner chose to participate in the booming underground cigarette market as a smuggler. Since 2009, he had been arrested eight times for selling loosies, which are popular among people who can’t afford a full pack because of the excessive taxes.

In January 2014, tough new penalties for selling untaxed cigarettes took effect in New York City. In July, emboldened by the new law, the city’s highest-ranking uniformed cop, Philip Banks, issued an order to crack down on loosie sales days before Garner died.

These events confirm that police are ultimately the enforcers of the tax code, and every vote for higher taxes gives police increased authority to exert more force on citizens in more situations. Higher excise taxes inevitably lead to more violent clashes between police and smugglers."


Well, while we are trying to figure out why he was being arrested, could someone point me to the place in the video where Mr. Garner obviously threatened the several officers or even really resisted arrest? This whole thing is so trumped up it sickens me... That anyone can even find the gall to rationalize the police actions in this video should sicken the entire country...
Also known, when doing rope magic, as "Cordini"
mastermindreader
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I believe it does sicken most rational and fair-minded people.
Dennis Michael
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Quote:
On Dec 5, 2014, mastermindreader wrote:
"most rational and fair-minded people."


Please explain? From who's perspective?
Dennis Michael
landmark
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On Dec 5, 2014, mastermindreader wrote:
most rational and fair-minded people.
mastermindreader
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From whose perspective? The rational and fair-minded people, of course.

The rest don't seem to be bothered much by it. As far as they're concerned, people who are killed by cops aren't people at all- just "thugs" who deserve to die. (Even if their only crime is selling untaxed cigarettes.)

I've been watching reruns of the old TV series Adam 12 and wondering how model cops like Reed and Malloy would have handled this situation. (And, yes, back then there WERE cops like that. My office was in an inner city area and I was often impressed by the way officers conducted themselves while defusing situations that today all too often end in violence.)
R.S.
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This should also sicken most rational and fair-minded people...

Racist Text Messages Gets Cops In Trouble
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PQuwfv-a......3A0ZjYjQ


Ron
"It is error only, and not truth, that shrinks from inquiry." Thomas Paine
landmark
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rockwall
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Quote:
On Dec 5, 2014, mastermindreader wrote:
I believe it does sicken most rational and fair-minded people.



I'm sickened by it on several levels. It's sad that a guy who was simply selling individual cigarettes ends up dead because of it. It's sad that the police have been tasked with aggressively pursuing such low level crime.

But regardless of how sickened I am about it, I don't feel, (and I don't think that most fair minded people would feel), that justifies making up lies about what happened to create more outrage.
landmark
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Here's about everything I would want to say about this case and Ferguson. I really don't need to post about it anymore:
http://www.awesomelyluvvie.com/2014/12/s......ple.html
Mr. Mystoffelees
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Quote:
On Dec 6, 2014, rockwall wrote:
Quote:
On Dec 5, 2014, mastermindreader wrote:
I believe it does sicken most rational and fair-minded people.



I'm sickened by it on several levels. It's sad that a guy who was simply selling individual cigarettes ends up dead because of it. It's sad that the police have been tasked with aggressively pursuing such low level crime.

But regardless of how sickened I am about it, I don't feel, (and I don't think that most fair minded people would feel), that justifies making up lies about what happened to create more outrage.


What lies?
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rockwall
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Quote:
On Dec 7, 2014, Mr. Mystoffelees wrote:
...

What lies?


Well, the big one that I pointed out in excruciating detail earlier. That the police officer continued to choke him after he said, "I can't breath".
mastermindreader
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The video doesn't lie. But, apparently, the video didn't matter to the grand jury.

While the decedent had health problems, the coroner, nonetheless, found the direct cause of death to be homicide. (I.e., caused by the actions of the officer.)
rockwall
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Correct, the video doesn't lie. I linked to it and showed exactly where your claim that he continued to choke him after saying, "I can't breath" was lie. If you disagree, it would be very easy to show where in the video I'm wrong. You don't, because you can't. And you know it.

I don't know if the autopsy report wasn't released because I can't find it but here are experts discussing it with Anderson Cooper.

http://ac360.blogs.cnn.com/2014/12/05/wh......tell-us/

"Everybody who piled on, compressing his chest, could be implicated."
"Burking can kill a person, without the chokehold."

The autopsy from the medical examiner attributed his death to homicide – meaning death at the hands of another party, not murder, in medical parlance – and stated that he died thanks to “Compression of neck (choke hold), compression of chest and prone positioning during physical restraint by police.” But the autopsy further noted that Garner died thanks to acute and chronic bronchial asthma, obesity, and heart disease. In other words, there were multiple factors that contributed to his death, not simply a chokehold as Bob would want you to believe.

If anyone is at fault, they are all at fault.
Mr. Mystoffelees
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[quote]On Dec 7, 2014, rockwall wrote:
Quote:
On Dec 7, 2014, Mr. Mystoffelees wrote:
...

What lies?


Well, the big one that I pointed out in excruciating detail earlier. That the police officer continued to choke him after he said, "I can't breath". [/q

Lies is plural, rockwall. A "big one" is still only one. Also, I really object to your free use of the word "lie". Please consider "misstatement" or some other term that is not so pejorative. Just a personal thing, I guess, probably due to the fact that I saw a man beaten severely because of his loose use of the word...
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Bill Thompson
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My whole problem is that since when in the USA do cops get to summarily execute a man for the crime of selling loose cigarettes? Why not issue him a citation and be done with it? Why go to this level of esculation over the collection of a tax?

People are being summarily executed by the cops for the smallest of infactions and the cops are getting away with it and people are getting sick and tired of it.
"To let understanding stop at what cannot be understood is a high attainment.
Those who cannot do it will be destroyed on the lathe of heaven." - Chuang Tse
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