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Mister E. Regular user Germany 189 Posts |
Hello Guys,
I admit to it - I bought a prop because I was intrigued by the ad before thinking how to incorporate it properly in my act. It's small sized Supa Lok. Don't get me wrong, it's a great prop, as I already stated elsewhere. But now, after a few weeks tinkering with, and trying out presentational ideas, I am starting to become a little frustrated. I studied John Archer's "Soundbox" and worked on a audience-member's-intuition type routine, but I am arriving always at the same problems: 1. What should I put in the box that's being locked? Something valuable from a spectator? I personally would consider that rude. Something valuable from me? I think that is a little similar to the smash and stab problem. Most audience members would probably think: "If there is really a chance, that he would lose his stuff/stab his hand, he wouldn't do it!" 2. Who finds/intuits the right key? If it's me as a performer I don't think it's that strong. John Archer's routine is entertaining, but not that magical (but I may be wrong, maybe I am thinking too much as magician). If it's the audience member, it is still only chances of one to four. Is that magical enough? So far everything I tried has the feel of a puzzle (as Darwin Ortiz would put it), but not like a piece of magic. I had an idea lately, but it's not in the least developed. The lock and the box are part of a larger effect, maybe some sort of confabulation. In the box is nothing of value but the final prediction. The keys are mixed and put in envelopes numbered 1-5 by an audience member and one part of the confabulation routine is to arrive at a number in the end which also leads to one of the envelopes? Just a very rough idea, so far... Maybe any of you has some ideas, you'd like to share. Happy New Year! Patrick |
IAIN Eternal Order england 18807 Posts |
Metaphorically, think about this...
what do we as human beings keep locked up?
I've asked to be banned
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JanForster Inner circle Germany ... when not traveling... 4190 Posts |
First of all the idea of the sound is far older, it was Borodin who did it first. But certainly John "reinvented" it without knowing about Borodin. I see your doubts and understand them. My honest opinion: It is in any case (mental or magic) "B-Material", nice, but not more, not really strong. I can and could do it only the way I do it (as a running gag); as a stand alone thing it is to weak. If you have the slightest doubts about the quality of the overall routine/your presentation, leave it out; seriously, live is too short to get wasted by things your are not really convinced about. We do that too often anyway. Jan
Jan Forster
www.janforster.de |
eSamuels Inner circle 3085 Posts |
While I will agree with my German half-brother that you should never force (no pun intended) material into your act, unless you are 100% committed to it, I will respectfully disagree that this represents "B-Material."
I have two handlings, both of which I would characterize as strong mid-set pieces. One involves a single person on stage, the other engages 5-people and is loosely based on a Max Maven idea. One of the things that has elevated this to the level at which I am confident performing it in just about any setting, is that I managed to solve the single biggest issue with mechanical items of this nature - the Occam's Razor "must be some kind of special lock" audience solution. Apologies for what must now seem like a tease, but all of this will be included in my book, "Setting The Stage," which will be released this year! And I am making the commitment to release the book before Summer, because it's my one and only New Year's resolution for 2015. Happy New Year! e |
Mister E. Regular user Germany 189 Posts |
Thank all of you for taking the time to contribute!
@Iain: interesting idea. My first thought went to the routine, Derren Brown sketches out in one of the first chapters of "Absolute Magic" - his routine for the floating finger ring, where the memory of the spectator makes the ring move. My second thought was, that when a thought is locked away it's probably for a reason... Anyways, I will keep thinking. The intriguing part would be to take the focus away from the lock towards the experience of the spectator. @Jan: Danke! You spelt out what the little devil in my ear has been telling me for two weeks now... I still hope, to prove him wrong. But now it also means proving Jan Forster wrong. Much more difficult than the devil... @Eric: I have heard about Max's presentation, but couldn't find anything about it. There's a thread here with a link to a YouTube Video, but the link seems dead. Don't get me wrong - the routine seems to be unpublished, so of course I'm not asking for it in order to copy it. |
saysold1 Eternal Order Recovering Cafe addict with only 10795 Posts |
So the Max Maven sounds like it might be a Kurotsuke style concept perhaps?
Can't wait to see your book this year Eric! Lots to look forward to. I just received a mid sized SupaLock a few weeks ago and I love the hands-fee nature of it and the beautiful heavy quality of the device. I'm still like MisterE tinkering with presentational ideas and I will probably road test it at a parlour show next week using something similar to John Archer's with a slotted wood box and playing up the comedy a bit. I agree that I don't think this has to be "B" material but it would depend on the routine. As Archer does it I do think it would be a mid-piece and B. I think in the end the SupaLock should demonstrate the performer's abilities rather than the spectator's though. On a side note Eric why wouldn't or shouldn't the hands-free testing of each individual key not pass the "Occam's Razor" test? Seems like that would be a pretty strong bit of proof to destroy notions of a special lock no?
Creator of The SvenPad Supreme(R) line of aerospace level quality, made in the USA utility props. https://svenpads.com/
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TomConsole New user 59 Posts |
I have use the SupaLok quite a few times using John Archers routine, and it usually gets very good reactions. No, its not a mind blower, but it is 5 to 10 minutes of entertainment. So Patrick, when you said maybe you are thinking too much like a magician, that may be true. The audience wants to be entertained. And I think SupaLok does that well. One thing I would suggest is maybe adding a couple more "non working" keys to it. So instead of it being a 1 in 4 or 1 in 5 shot, make it a 1 in 6 or 7 shot. Mick can cut you as many keys as you like at a reasonable price.
As far as "what" to lock in the box, true, the audience may feel like there is no way you are willing to lose your wallet. So maybe make it a $300 challenge, where you can say that you have performed this feat for over 25 years, and only once have you ever lost the challenge. You now spread a few hundred dollars in $20's and lock it in the box. So they know there is a chance. You could take it out of your wallet, and say "Instead of locking my wallet which contains things that are useless to you, lets just lock up what you would want the most, and what is the most valuable of all....cash". So you will get the most meaningful part of my wallet. I also am willing to risk my valuable wedding ring, so you will get that too, along with all the meaningful things (sarcastically) that go with it. Just some thoughts. Tom |
eSamuels Inner circle 3085 Posts |
Quote:
On Jan 1, 2015, saysold1 wrote: It's been my experience that, for a certain segment of the audience, regardless of how well you have defined and demonstrated your abilities, they will seek a 'conventional' explanation for what they have experienced. This is addressed by Bob Cassidy's extensive work with the Bob Haines notion of "logical disconnect." In the case of any mechanical device, this certain personality-type will approach the experience as a puzzle with their default setting analytical mind. (Part of) our job is to anticipate that thinking and add an element that puts up a brick wall as they open that door in their mind. BTW, I should also note that I have no problem with the performer NOT being the one who resolves the issue, provided that the routine contains a logical (and compelling) narrative that puts the performer in the role of, for lack of a better term, 'facilitator.' In other words, the performer has created the conditions in which the audience can have an extraordinary hands-on experience. I know that this notion is somewhat controversial but it is my belief and has been my experience that having this ingredient in your show creates another level of audience experience. I equate this to an experience that I had back in college (quite some time ago), where, believe it or not, I took a (credit) course in ParaPsychology! One of the first things we did was watch a recording of Uri Geller doing his thing. The instructor prefaced the viewing by saying "in the past we've had a few people who have had strange experiences after watching this, so don't be surprised if something odd happens to you." I'm paraphrasing, as it was several decades ago! Anyway, leaving the college that day, I took out m car keys and noticed a severe bend in one of the keys on the keychain. I vividly recall the feeling of excitement at that moment. Watching the Uri Geller video had been cool, but this was far more personal and, as a result, incredible! So, as long as we get are perceived as having facilitated the experience, whatever that is, we get the full credit for the 'astonishment.' e |
John C Eternal Order I THINK therefore I wrote 12945 Posts |
Watch maven's routine on YouTube. I think it's on YouTube. It's so simple and to the point. It makes the specs the stars.
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ZachDavenport Inner circle Last time I posted I had one less than 1196 Posts |
I'm not familiar with this routine, but I think it is something like an object is locked in a box, and the spectator does a Russian roulette kind of thing with a bunch of keys to get in the box. If that is the case then a good presentation would be to lock up a picture of the spectator's spouse or kids, and say something along the lines of: "Let you emotions guide your choices."
Reality is a real killjoy.
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Alden New user 24 Posts |
Help Wanted.
Hi all, I wonder if anyone can advise e me re SupaLock. I've just read of the sad news of creator Mick Hanzlik's passing. The website is no longer in use and I'm trying to get hold of Supalock, was it only available through Mick's own website? Everywhere I check seems to say out of stock at the minute, Many Thanks, Aiden. |
John C Eternal Order I THINK therefore I wrote 12945 Posts |
Are these locks selling at a premium? I have a large model it's beutiful.
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