The Magic Café
Username:
Password:
[ Lost Password ]
  [ Forgot Username ]
The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Table hoppers & party strollers » » An Experiment... (8 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

 Go to page [Previous]  1~2
Christopher Lyle
View Profile
Inner circle
Dallas, Texas
5698 Posts

Profile of Christopher Lyle
Quote:
On Feb 4, 2015, brehan wrote:
Christopher were can I Buy your book?


www.sleightlydelusional.com
In Mystery,


Christopher Lyle
Magician, Comic, Daredevil, and Balloon Twisting Genius
For a Good Time...CLICK HERE!
davidpaul$
View Profile
Inner circle
Pittsburgh, Pa
2963 Posts

Profile of davidpaul$
Quote:
On Jan 31, 2015, Christopher Lyle wrote:
Tommy,

Yes! I think it's stronger for the audience to remove the card. But if they've never seen a magician before or if they have but have never seen a c2w before, does it matter? Are we solving a problem that doesn't exist?

Glad you liked the podcast. 😉


But, do we really know what is going on in the minds of our spectators? Everyone is different intelectually, analytically, emotionally etc. After we are through with a performance do they think about how, what they just saw, was accomplished?
I think so. Most of our spectators aren't passive. So, imo, a signed card that was in the deck and then produced from a sealed envelope inside the inside of a zippered compartment from a wallet is not only more entertaining put "more" impossible in the minds of those we can't see. For me, I go the extra mile to create in the minds (hopefully) a feeling and thought process of impossibility.
If you can't help worrying, remember worrying can't help you!
Dannydoyle
View Profile
Eternal Order
20523 Posts

Profile of Dannydoyle
BUT if they REALLY think it is a free selection, and they REALLY think your hand is empty and they REALLY think it is the same card what is the difference? You can create that in many ways. A signature and an envelope and zipper compartment is one way to do such a thing.

I think if you rely on those things to make it more entertaining or more mysterious you are making a mistake. I agree it can help, I agree with what you are saying. I am also saying there are other ways to get it done.

When Charlie Schulien or Matt did a Card in Matchbook no zipper, no signature no envelope. Yet somehow when it was done it is one of the best tricks in all of close up magic. Why? First off you were entertained long before magic actually started. (Big step.) Two they were CONVINCED it was the same card and that the hand was empty the whole time.

So I am not disagreeing with you at all in that those things can be magical. I simply contend they are not necessary.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus
<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
Christopher Lyle
View Profile
Inner circle
Dallas, Texas
5698 Posts

Profile of Christopher Lyle
Quote:
On Feb 5, 2015, davidpaul$ wrote:
Quote:
On Jan 31, 2015, Christopher Lyle wrote:
Tommy,

Yes! I think it's stronger for the audience to remove the card. But if they've never seen a magician before or if they have but have never seen a c2w before, does it matter? Are we solving a problem that doesn't exist?

Glad you liked the podcast. 😉


But, do we really know what is going on in the minds of our spectators? Everyone is different intelectually, analytically, emotionally etc. After we are through with a performance do they think about how, what they just saw, was accomplished?
I think so. Most of our spectators aren't passive. So, imo, a signed card that was in the deck and then produced from a sealed envelope inside the inside of a zippered compartment from a wallet is not only more entertaining put "more" impossible in the minds of those we can't see. For me, I go the extra mile to create in the minds (hopefully) a feeling and thought process of impossibility.


I agree in part...however...

Most people have never seen a magician before. Once they have, the odds of them seeing another isn't very high. If they have NEVER SEEN a LaPaul Wallet where the card ends up in a sealed envelope which was in a zippered compartment then they'll have nothing to compare it too.

Also, people believe what you tell them which I have always found strange. If they say, "but the card came back to the deck before you flipped it over" and you say, no...I removed it from the wallet and handed it to you. You had the card the entire time" then they will believe that is what actually happened.

How many times has someone who has seen you before ask you to repeat the trick you did 4 months ago. They describe it to you and its soooo much better in their mind then what really happened.

Just before Christmas a guy asked me to do the bit where his signed card ended up in HIS wallet. WHAT?!?!?!?
In Mystery,


Christopher Lyle
Magician, Comic, Daredevil, and Balloon Twisting Genius
For a Good Time...CLICK HERE!
David Fillary
View Profile
Special user
658 Posts

Profile of David Fillary
I like thinking through how a spectator would argue back against a sceptic who hadn't actually seen the trick.

With nest of wallets, I did a signed coin routine that ended in the nest of wallets. The nest is loaded as I take the pen back, so my hands are completely clean as I reach for the wallets. However, when I handled it during the opening, I didn't show my hands empty much. The guy was astounded.

However, I overheard this guy describing the trick to his friend, and the friend argued that I must have slipped it in right at the end.
I got the opportunity to perform to both of them again, so repeated that trick, but this time put the wallet in his hand first and pointed out that my sleeves were rolled up and there was nothing in my hands etc. I think this made it stronger.

With the taking the card out yourself and doing a Dl on the deck, it may fool the people you perform for, but how strong is their argument when they tell it the next week? If their friend says "he must have switched it before he showed it to you" or "he must have snuck it in there when you weren't looking", can your spectator argue your case?

Tommy Wonder took routines and pushed them to the peak of excellence in whatever way he could. His watch to nest of boxes is a great example of this. The spectator can honestly say that he only picked up the box by the handle and they opened everything up themselves! A fantastic routine that is stronger than any other version I have seen and the spectator merely describing it will get gasps from their friends.
tboehnlein
View Profile
Inner circle
ohio
1781 Posts

Profile of tboehnlein
Funny that after all these years you would come to that conclusion when I was young before I could afford expensive or better props I used a DB to do card to wallet with a Dl. I now use a BKM wallet which allows for several different revelations including th DB method which I think is still a great worker.
frankieacemagic
View Profile
Elite user
496 Posts

Profile of frankieacemagic
Hmmmm. I have to disagree here, but only a little. I use the Real Man's Wallet. It's such a powerful effect that I sometimes repeat it in the boldest way: "If you think THAT was astounding, wouldn't it be even more astounding if this signed card (show to audience) were placed on her hand (gesture, top change), and immediately changed into a different card because it was back in my wallet?" The looks on their faces are hilarious. They're already defeated (in a good way). Of course, I reload the card (that they think is already in the wallet) and the reveal is even more dramatic. I can't imagine diluting that effect by bringing the card BACK to the deck to show it. I think any wallet is good, and any loading method is equally as effective, but bringing the card back to the deck and using a DL seems like too many unnecessary moves.

Now I've never tried this experiment as Chris did. But I HAVE used 2 different methods for changing a card in the spectators hand: the DL and a top change. Hands down (heh heh) the best change was the top change. I think this is because (in their eyes) the card left the deck as the 3 of diamonds, was still the 3 of diamonds AWAY from the deck, but somehow changed t the Ace on the way to their hand. I've tried the DL to achieve the same effect, and, though the reactions were good, they were not as good as the top change. But here's a question: were the DL reactions not as good because I was somehow communicating my expectation that they wouldn't be as good? Was I subtly projecting my opinion of the inferiority of the method? Sheesh. Way above my pay grade.
frankieacemagic
View Profile
Elite user
496 Posts

Profile of frankieacemagic
An amendment to my last post:

Chris (and others) are right about how people misremember effects. When I used to do Ring Flite, I would sometimes perform it at the same table as a watch steal. Several times, a returning customer would ask me to perform the effect where I removed her ring without her knowing and made it appear on my keychain. Removed her ring without her knowing? That's like Chris's ability to get the signed card in the spectator's wallet Smile
Dimitri Mystery Artist
View Profile
Veteran user
Israel/Ukraine
355 Posts

Profile of Dimitri Mystery Artist
What about:

-you give your wallet to spectator Y
-spectator X signs any card and return it to the deck.
-the card disappears
-spectator Y opens the wallet, finds the signed card inside.


I think sometimes the method or psychological touches are important (at least to the most observant people among your audience).
warren
View Profile
Inner circle
uk
3310 Posts

Profile of warren
Quote:
On Feb 8, 2015, David Fillary wrote:
I like thinking through how a spectator would argue back against a sceptic who hadn't actually seen the trick.

With nest of wallets, I did a signed coin routine that ended in the nest of wallets. The nest is loaded as I take the pen back, so my hands are completely clean as I reach for the wallets. However, when I handled it during the opening, I didn't show my hands empty much. The guy was astounded.

However, I overheard this guy describing the trick to his friend, and the friend argued that I must have slipped it in right at the end.
I got the opportunity to perform to both of them again, so repeated that trick, but this time put the wallet in his hand first and pointed out that my sleeves were rolled up and there was nothing in my hands etc. I think this made it stronger.

With the taking the card out yourself and doing a Dl on the deck, it may fool the people you perform for, but how strong is their argument when they tell it the next week? If their friend says "he must have switched it before he showed it to you" or "he must have snuck it in there when you weren't looking", can your spectator argue your case?

Tommy Wonder took routines and pushed them to the peak of excellence in whatever way he could. His watch to nest of boxes is a great example of this. The spectator can honestly say that he only picked up the box by the handle and they opened everything up themselves! A fantastic routine that is stronger than any other version I have seen and the spectator merely describing it will get gasps from their friends.


I agree totally I like to try and cancel out methods when working on an effect and use the same logic ie how would they describe the effect Smile

Great thread as I'm actually looking to get an new wallet myself at this moment in time, having always used an O'Connel hip wallet in the past I was thinking of getting a multi purpose type wallet that could use as an every day wallet and whilst I've more or less narrowed it down to either the infinity wallet or the espionage wallet I may have to re-think lol
The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Table hoppers & party strollers » » An Experiment... (8 Likes)
 Go to page [Previous]  1~2
[ Top of Page ]
All content & postings Copyright © 2001-2021 Steve Brooks. All Rights Reserved.
This page was created in 0.16 seconds requiring 5 database queries.
The views and comments expressed on The Magic Café
are not necessarily those of The Magic Café, Steve Brooks, or Steve Brooks Magic.
> Privacy Statement <

ROTFL Billions and billions served! ROTFL