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Dannydoyle
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What gives you the right to redistribute any wealth morally? Where does that right come from? One has more so you decide how much is enough and redistribute based on that?

Funny how this never had worked isn't it?

The problem isn't the rich. The problem is your leviathan government. But then again those are so often one in the same.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus
<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
landmark
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Funny how this never had worked isn't it?

AFAIK, every modern country taxes its people.
LobowolfXXX
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Gates built most of the lifeboats himself.
"Torture doesn't work" lol
Guess they forgot to tell Bill Buckley.

"...as we reason and love, we are able to hope. And hope enables us to resist those things that would enslave us."
silvercup
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The problem is money.
Dannydoyle
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On Feb 4, 2015, landmark wrote:
Quote:
Funny how this never had worked isn't it?

AFAIK, every modern country taxes its people.


Who said they didn't?
Danny Doyle
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<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
Magnus Eisengrim
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On Feb 4, 2015, Dannydoyle wrote:
What gives you the right to redistribute any wealth morally? Where does that right come from? One has more so you decide how much is enough and redistribute based on that?

Funny how this never had worked isn't it?

The problem isn't the rich. The problem is your leviathan government. But then again those are so often one in the same.


What gives governments the right to decide what kind of economy their country will have? Decisions have to be made.
The blood-dimmed tide is loosed, and everywhere
The ceremony of innocence is drowned;
The best lack all conviction, while the worst
Are full of passionate intensity.--Yeats
Dannydoyle
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Do you equate the formation of the United States with the right to take private property from one to give to another?
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus
<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
The Hermit
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On Feb 3, 2015, tommy wrote:
Very nice illusion: There are no forests, there are only individual trees. Forests are merely an abstraction.


On the surface they are. If you look below the ground you will see millions of roots that are intertwined and interconnected and provide the life force that allows the trees to grow. It is hard to distinguish one tree from another below the surface. Hardly an abstraction.

Much to Bob's point.
LobowolfXXX
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Well, the power of eminent domain, at least, is in the Constitution.
"Torture doesn't work" lol
Guess they forgot to tell Bill Buckley.

"...as we reason and love, we are able to hope. And hope enables us to resist those things that would enslave us."
The Hermit
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On Feb 4, 2015, landmark wrote:
1) Illustration, as it helps to have an easily imagined visual when thinking about these things. We can use ten chairs and ten people too. One rich person (much less of course) takes up 4 chairs while the other 9 have to scramble for a piece of the remaining 6 chairs.

2) Danny was distraught that some rich people might get screwed out of the lifeboat. My Bill Gates remark was to reassure him that Bill would land on his feet. He'd still have plenty of room in that lifeboat, even if wealth were substantially re-distributed.

3) Practical how of it? Start with taxing capital gains at the same level as income tax, get rid of the Social Security rich person entitlement discount, enact a stock transfer tax. And for Lord's sake, stop boo-hooing that then you'll only be able to afford ten mansions instead of twenty.



Doesn't all of this talk assume there is only one pie and it has to be divvied up. The economy, resources and wealth creation can be limitless.
The Hermit
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On Feb 4, 2015, NYCTwister wrote:
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On Feb 4, 2015, Slim King wrote:
I think the TIME you were born is more important.


Why?


If you were born in the middle ages your opportunities were severely limited. There is an old saying that 'there is more opportunity today than ever before'. Progress of civilization almost always opens up more opportunity. Women today vs 1910's. Blacks today vs 1950's. The list goes on. The more available resources to improve yourself, more mobility, more individual progress.
tommy
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The last time man was free was before civilization.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d6c70hPa8iU
If there is a single truth about Magic, it is that nothing on earth so efficiently evades it.

Tommy
rockwall
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On Feb 4, 2015, landmark wrote:
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Well John do you prefer a screw you get out of the lifeboat because too many who look like you are already in attitude?


Imagine a large lifeboat with a hundred seats. A hundred people get on the boat. Imagine, further, each seat represents 1% of the nation's wealth and each person represents 1% of the nation's population.

Then, if the 1% rich own 40% of the wealth--as they do in this country-- that means, by analogy, 1 person gets to take up 40 of those seats. The other 99 people have to scramble for a piece of the other 60 remaining seats.

So Bill Gates will not drown even if he gives up 35 of his seats.


That would be a great illustration IF like a single lifeboat with 100 seats there was a fixed amount of money available in the world. Since that's not true, it kinda sucks as an illustration.

Imagine instead an ulimited number of potential lifeboats that 'could' be built but 50% of the people aren't interested in helping build them, only in using them.
rockwall
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Ah, I see Hermit kinda beat me to it.
Magnus Eisengrim
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On Feb 4, 2015, rockwall wrote:
Quote:
On Feb 4, 2015, landmark wrote:
Quote:
Well John do you prefer a screw you get out of the lifeboat because too many who look like you are already in attitude?


Imagine a large lifeboat with a hundred seats. A hundred people get on the boat. Imagine, further, each seat represents 1% of the nation's wealth and each person represents 1% of the nation's population.

Then, if the 1% rich own 40% of the wealth--as they do in this country-- that means, by analogy, 1 person gets to take up 40 of those seats. The other 99 people have to scramble for a piece of the other 60 remaining seats.

So Bill Gates will not drown even if he gives up 35 of his seats.


That would be a great illustration IF like a single lifeboat with 100 seats there was a fixed amount of money available in the world. Since that's not true, it kinda sucks as an illustration.

Imagine instead an ulimited number of potential lifeboats that 'could' be built but 50% of the people aren't interested in helping build them, only in using them.


Do "potential lifeboats" really help anyone? Some 750 million people lack access to a stable supply of clean drinking water. The fact that maybe if we continue to create wealth, then they might have clean water some day really help anyone?

Good thing we have waterbottles in our lifeboat.
The blood-dimmed tide is loosed, and everywhere
The ceremony of innocence is drowned;
The best lack all conviction, while the worst
Are full of passionate intensity.--Yeats
Dannydoyle
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Give your water bottle to others. Give YOUR seat to others. Don't tell me what I am obligated to do with mine.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus
<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
Magnus Eisengrim
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On Feb 4, 2015, Dannydoyle wrote:
Give your water bottle to others. Give YOUR seat to others. Don't tell me what I am obligated to do with mine.


Don't tell the rest of the world what to do, Danny.

You might believe that greedily holding on to anything you've got your hands on to be the most ethical thing. Why should you impose your will on others?
The blood-dimmed tide is loosed, and everywhere
The ceremony of innocence is drowned;
The best lack all conviction, while the worst
Are full of passionate intensity.--Yeats
Ray Tupper.
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Removing the obligation, what would you feel personally Danny?
I only ask, because I'd be the first one on. **** em.. Survival of the fittest, that's me!
The problem I have, is the guilt/sorrow I'd feel, at the people I left behind.
Self preservation is wonderful, if you can sleep at night.
What do we want?
A cure for tourettes!
When do we want it?
C*nt!
Pakar Ilusi
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But all we have is now.
"Dreams aren't a matter of Chance but a matter of Choice." -DC-
tommy
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If there is a single truth about Magic, it is that nothing on earth so efficiently evades it.

Tommy
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