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pegasus Eternal Order United Kingdom 10537 Posts |
Watch the video above. He explains the reason why.
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gypsyfish Veteran user 383 Posts |
Also, I think that, traditionally, French postcards were women.
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Edith Regular user Germany 131 Posts |
Which one? The Trailer or the one that magician 336 posted? They both don't explain the necessity of just one male card.
The Trailer creates some kind of lesbian feeling because most spectators displayed and handling the props are women. Women getting a sexual vibe from women.... magician 336 states the male card is good for hecklers. Really? |
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gypsyfish Veteran user 383 Posts |
The script says something like 'something for everyone' when the male card is shown. That can be taken several ways is is (supposed to be) humorous. (I think it is, but I reckon it's subjective.)
I got no 'lesbian feeling' looking at the trailer or the accompanying video. In fact, at one point one of the specs is asked if she's uncomfortable and she says she's not. It's a nice trick, but not for everyone (audience or magician), but well worth if only for the alternative OOTW instructions. I like it. |
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motown Inner circle Atlanta by way of Detroit 6127 Posts |
I think Edith's points are well. I found it interesting that most of the spectators in the trailer were women. Seems odd to me. In this day and age I would think a lot of women would be turned off by that sort of thing.
"If you ever write anything about me after I'm gone, I will come back and haunt you."
– Karl Germain |
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motown Inner circle Atlanta by way of Detroit 6127 Posts |
I think Edith's points are well. I found it interesting that most of the spectators in the trailer were women. Seems odd to me. In this day and age I would think a lot of women would be turned off by that sort of thing.
"If you ever write anything about me after I'm gone, I will come back and haunt you."
– Karl Germain |
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motown Inner circle Atlanta by way of Detroit 6127 Posts |
Sorry for the echo.
"If you ever write anything about me after I'm gone, I will come back and haunt you."
– Karl Germain |
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saysold1 Eternal Order Recovering Cafe addict with only 10794 Posts |
Quote:
On Jul 20, 2015, Edith wrote: A Lesbian feeling? Well that's kind of a stretch. That certainly wasn't my takeaway but of course I'm not a chick. Tell you what - just for fun why don't you Google search yourself for "male erotic postcards" and see what comes up... not much. As in nearly nothing. To me your point is a non-starter. These are cool old French cards - the kind that many of us might have seen before. It's fun - it isn't about whether they are male or female.
Creator of The SvenPad Supreme(R) line of aerospace level quality, made in the USA utility props. https://svenpads.com/
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saysold1 Eternal Order Recovering Cafe addict with only 10794 Posts |
Quote:
On Jul 21, 2015, motown wrote: My dear old friend Motown - the effect isn't about turning anyone on or off - it is about magic and blowing their minds They aren't getting a "sexual" vibe as Edith incorrectly states - they are hopefully getting the "amazement" vibe. The naughty cards are a fun sideshow. Congrats to my friend Chris on another great effect. BTW if you Google "Old Male Muscle" postcards you can get some hits but still...
Creator of The SvenPad Supreme(R) line of aerospace level quality, made in the USA utility props. https://svenpads.com/
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motown Inner circle Atlanta by way of Detroit 6127 Posts |
Quote: Saysold, I don't don't think your understanding my point and looking at this too much from a male perspective. Your showing cards with female nudity, you don't think some women would be offended and feel exploited, same way they do with many mens magazines. Going back to Edith's point, which I think you also missed. Let's turn it around, don't you think many guys would feel uncomfortable, if most of the cards were of nude men, instead of women? I sure do.On Jul 21, 2015, saysold1 wrote:
"If you ever write anything about me after I'm gone, I will come back and haunt you."
– Karl Germain |
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videoman Inner circle 6732 Posts |
Definitely have to know your audience as with any effect using risqué items.
Probably not wise to pull this out at the ladies church social. |
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billmarq Special user State near Arizona 570 Posts |
I believe the male/female ratio would be an issue if this effect were called "Dirty Pictures." It is not. It is "French Post Cards."
French post cards are more than a century old, almost exclusively depicted the female form, and the nudity in them is considered quite tasteful by today's standards. This is not pornography.
Honi soit quit mal y pense.
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Jacob Smith Inner circle Columbus, OH 1871 Posts |
Quote:
On Jul 20, 2015, Edith wrote: Hello Edith, Sorry if you took that the wrong way, I usually use it on the more uncomfortable men in the room is what I was implying...I'm far from being a sexist. XX, -Jakob |
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saysold1 Eternal Order Recovering Cafe addict with only 10794 Posts |
Quote:
On Jul 21, 2015, videoman wrote: Exactly - I would never do this at a corporate event for strolling etc. Time and place for everything. For the right audience this might be fun and not offensive.
Creator of The SvenPad Supreme(R) line of aerospace level quality, made in the USA utility props. https://svenpads.com/
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saysold1 Eternal Order Recovering Cafe addict with only 10794 Posts |
Quote:
On Jul 21, 2015, billmarq wrote: Correct. Can we please now move past the sexist ramblings and focus on the effect? If it isn't your cup of tea than you should pass it up. The whole thing about balancing between men/women ratio is a little goofy.
Creator of The SvenPad Supreme(R) line of aerospace level quality, made in the USA utility props. https://svenpads.com/
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Chris Philpott Special user 502 Posts |
Jakob, thank you so much for that review. I really appreciate it!
Hey Tommy - that would be a very cool idea! Thank you, Edith, for your insightful comments. I'm happy these issues are being discussed - we will never get everyone to agree on every detail but if nothing else, I think it shows that these ideas are meaningful and people are passionate about them in a way they are not passionate about 'is this card red or black?' I did consider other possible gender combinations when creating this effect but settled on the combo I did for several reasons. As gypsyfish, billmarq and saysold pointed out (thanks guys!) the term "French postcards" generally refers to pictures of women - in the late 19th and early 20th century they were sold quite openly in France by street vendors and tobacconists primarily to tourists from more puritanical countries (sexy pictures of men couldn't have been sold so openly at that time.) I wanted to play with the form a bit by adding one man, but it is ahistorical - there is really no such thing as a male French postcard. Breaking the form with one male card seemed about right to me - it breaks with history just enough to make its point while not belaboring it. Other people may feel differently and that's totally valid, but I feel my solution is reasonable. If anyone wants more pix of men, they can certainly have some made up for a reasonable price. There's an old joke: men's magazines are filled with pictures of women and women's magazines are filled with pictures of... women. Here in the US this is not construed as lesbian (and even if it was, this should not be thought of as a negative thing). One of the reasons I favored showing women in the trailer was to show how utterly comfortable they are with this effect. Motown's concerns about how women might react to this are valid but in all the times I've done this, no woman has been turned off. Women laugh as much as (even more than) men - and you can see at the end of the video a woman moved to tears because of the power of the effect. To borrow saysold's phrase, she's definitely getting the "amazement vibe". There are a couple reasons I think everyone I've shown this to has been comfortable with it - firstly, this is inspired by a scientific study that made headlines around the world: subjects showed evidence of precognition but only when using erotic pictures. The context is rational rather than lurid so this elevates the tone of the effect. It's disarming. Another reason why people are comfortable with this is that by cultural standards, this is very tame stuff. I think magic is out of sync with the times in terms of what is 'acceptable'. I’ve often talked with Steve Valentine (who like myself goes back and forth between the world of film and TV and magic) about how magic is so much safer (and less grown up) than the other arts. (If this seems edgy, you should see the script we just sold!) In the era of Game of Thrones (42% women audience) and Fifty Shades of Grey (68% women audience), 19th century erotic pictures seem quaint by comparison. I have made a personal commitment (in my effects and my articles for Magic magazine) to always try to push the art in a mature direction. I've gotten many emails from many magicians who’ve thanked me for creating an effect that treats their spectators like adults. But as videoman said, you probably shouldn't do this at a church social. As Jakob pointed out, there is a lot of comedy potential in the male postcard. Even just showing the cards, first establishing the traditional female French postcards then showing the man at the end, usually gets a good laugh. It really does subvert expectation. (And it's not like it's a picture of some schlub in a speedo - it’s Eugen Sandow and he's pretty buff!) In the trailer you can see Michael Rangel use the classic Paul Curry handling, and he motivates the switch of piles by stopping at the Sandow pic and asking what they think it is, then having them turn it over - you can see in the video, people just think this is really funny. Those are some of my thoughts. Again, thanks to everyone for your insights! -Chris |
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VanishingInc Veteran user 322 Posts |
French Postcards is such a worker! Plus any effect from Chris is a winner! Out Of This World is such a classic in magic but this takes it to a new level!
Great job Chris! -Kyle
We personally curate every product we sell because we put quality and service first.
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Chris Philpott Special user 502 Posts |
Thank you, Kyle!
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Edith Regular user Germany 131 Posts |
Here you go Have fun! http://www.oldstratforduponavon.com/eroticblokes.html
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itsmagic Inner circle middle earth 1117 Posts |
Ouch...I'm blind. Wished I didn't click on that link.
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